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IRFAN DAMA: Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen.
As we say in India, [HINDI], brothers and sisters.
It's so good to be here with such a good turnout.
That's excellent.
My name is Irfan.
I am the chef at Baadal, the Indian restaurant
at the far end of Crittenden.
The one that everyone complains about because it is so far.
It takes a long bike ride to get there.
I'm the chef of the first Indian restaurants.
I cook Indian food as a fashion and today
is extremely exciting day for me because today it
seems like the teacher has come home.
And when the teacher comes to your doorstep,
it is a day you are ecstatic.
And I'm really, really pleased to present today's guest.
He was born in Amritsar.
He is a Michelin starred guest.
He is a filmmaker, a humanitarian,
and the host of "Master Chef India," which
is a show that's based on "Master Chef UK."
He has studied in prestigious institutes
in India, including the Welcome Groups School of Hotels,
has worked at the Taj group, the Oberoi, the Leela group.
For those are not from India, this
is probably strange to you, but for us who grew up in India,
these were institutions to be associated with
and he has been in all of them.
He's also studied at the Culinary Institute of America,
Cornell University, the New York University, and Le Cordon Bleu.
He's no stranger to the television.
He was a consultant chef on Gordon Ramsay's TV
show "Kitchen Nightmares."
He appeared as a judge and Indian Cuisine Specialist
on the two part season finale of "Hell's Kitchen."
He appeared on "Throwdown with Bobby Flay" as a judge.
But if he actually threw down with Bobby Flay,
I'm sure he would have won.
And he's also been on the India show the Martha Stewart's show
telecast on March, 2011.
He's hosted the "Master Chef India"--
two seasons, I believe, the second season.
Four seasons.
I'm a little behind.
He has authored-- says 13 books, but I think it's more now.
But "Spice Story of India," "More
than Indian Cooking," "Flavors First," and now
"Return to Rivers."
I am so proud to present Mr. Vikas Khanna.
Welcome, Vikas.
Please take a seat.
We're going to sit together like we like each other.
So, Vikas, how have you been?
How have given it in the Bay Area so far?
Tell us about your first impression.
VIKAS KHANNA: I'm a total New Yorker.
No drivers license, no patience, but everything but the biz.
Because from my hometown I landed straight in Manhattan.
It's like those movies you've watched and they got freedom
and they came to America.
It could be after World War II, but I
think I was fighting a war with myself to come to U.S.
But, besides that, it's fantastic.
It doesn't stop snowing when you're in New York.
We love the pictures, but to be in the real the pictures,
it's horrible.
and I love the sun here.
And it's thanks to Andrea, who got me to the West Coast.
And it was on my agenda.
I live in California for some time.
But it's a great place because I have so much respect
for all of you because you all have driver's licenses
and you drive so well.
I can only drive in my hometown in Amitsar
because I know all the cops and nobody stops me.
And you can go anywhere.
And It's total freedom, I think.
But besides that I'm so proud to be--
you're actually the first few people in America
who are seeing this book and it's something
about-- there's something very strange about holding
your book.
Because you see the rough drafts and you do the sketching.
I wrote this whole book in Punjabi, my native language,
and then we couldn't find anywhere
to translate that to English.
I call this book as as symbol of rebirth for me.
I don't know if I can ever do this book again.
It's very scary.
Because I remember one interview I read as a child
for Tanzig-- the guy who climbed Mt.
Everest.
What was that?
Tenzig.
In Punjabi we call him Tanzig.
So he climbed Mount Everest.
And when he came down on the ground base,
he was asked, how do you feel.
He said, I feel very sad.
He said, why.
He said, because I will never find another Everest to climb.
This was the highest peak.
So, in this book I was holding it first time
when it came to me.
I felt I've touched my Mount Everest, because it
was about-- I challenged myself so much in this book.
I wrote this book when I was totally unemployed.
I have no shame saying this in America.
I had just closed my third restaurant and I was on my way
to nowhere.
And here I'm locking the door of my restaurant
and a call comes from my friend Tashi saying
that His Holiness, the Dalai Lama, is in town.
Would you like to meet him?
And my question was why.
I'm just doing a walk of shame for my life
and this was 2005 end.
So, these things are not in the book.
So, it's important when I'm doing something like the book
I tell the something which is totally true story about what
is behind the glamour and the real project.
I had no reason to go to His Holiness,
but I still went there.
I went to Beacon Theater-- Beacon
Theater it's called on 73rd Street?
Beacon Theater, and there were probably 3,000 people.
And wen His Holiness comes he has
a more impact than President Obama comes to New York City.
When the president comes and the streets are blocked,
we all criticize him.
Go back to Washington!
But we never say that to His Holiness.
And something about that sacred power of his leadership,
the way he leads us.
I go and meet him.
I still have to pay so many bills that day.
I didn't care.
I just wanted to see him.
I don't know why.
So, eventually I went there big face of shame
and everybody asks, oh, another restaurant closed.
[LAUGHS] You will never learn how to cook.
I'm like, OK.
And this is the first person I met right
at the Beacon Theater.
I said, I don't know why it closed.
It was a big building lawsuit.
Oh, everybody says that.
We have a lease problem.
[LAUGHS]
So I very quietly, humbly stood last in the line.
And His Holiness starts walking--
and this is something which is very
surreal-- it's called surreal.
A double R, I think.
So, I'm walking-- I'm in the last of the line
and His Holiness comes.
And I don't know what happened.
He's a short man with a huge presence.
Just humbly bows and keeps walking.
And he comes and touches my forehead, like this,
and touches his heart.
And he ha beautiful silk cloth.
Just hands it over to me.
And just goes away as if nothing happened.
So there's another American girl standing behind me.
She just pushes me and says, F-you.
And I'm like, what did I do.
She's saying, oh, you have Bollywood affect.
I said, I didn't do anything.
I'm like, I didn't even know what happen to me.
She was so angry at me.
Why didn't it happen to her.
I'm like, I'm sorry, what happened actually?
So, I didn't know what happened.
But I went to the lecture, which I was not going to attend.
I just went as a promise to my friend Tashi.
And I go and sit in the lecture and His Holiness
sits there so quietly.
And I remember he was sneezing that day.
And he had this small handkerchief,
which he would put back in the clothes he wears.
And he would sneeze like this.
And it was so real.
He's a symbol of something so high and even he has a cold.
I'm just thinking about that.
And then he talks about that.
You think there's nothing has end ever in life.
It's always changing of form and structure.
I think people who think it's the end,
they're not seeing beyond what they can achieve.
And I was that one person who thought it was the end for me.
I go back home in the night.
I called my mom early in the morning and said, Mom,
I met His Holiness Dalai Lama.
And she says, OK.
I said I'm going to finish my project.
She said, which project?
I said, "Return to the Rivers."
She said, what is that?
I said, Mom, that's-- this is a conversation you have
in your native language.
She said, what's that?
I said, it's my book on Himal-- She's like, oh, no, no,
don't write another book.
Nobody buys your books.
I was like, Oh mom, that helps me.
She says, remember last time you wrote a book
and you said you sold two copies.
I said, yeah, but I bought one, so I just sold one actually.
She's like, why are you writing another book?
She's like, isn't that enough that your restaurant is closed
and you don't have a job.
And I said, Mom, it's not enough.
It's just not enough.
So she said, where do you want to go?
I said, I want to go to Bhutan.
And she said, where's that?
I said it's up in the mountains somewhere in the Himalayas.
So she booked me a ticket from New York to Bhutan.
And that is when the real journey started for this book.
I go to Bhutan-- if you guys know about Bhutan
you must Google-- they don't have per capita income
or anything like that.
They have per happiness income, that kind of thing.
I don't know what they call it.
It's something which is closest to living in paradise.
That place just sucked me in.
I landed, and you have to land through the valley,
the mountains.
The plane goes like this.
And then the aircraft lands.
It's a palace.
Nobody disturbed nature.
Nothing.
There were stories about that place which I will never
be able to forget ever in my life.
So I was totally in love with that place.
I said this is fantastic to begin writing
and rediscovered yourself.
All of the lessons what were in the book started from there.
When I finished there-- I was there
for almost 2 and 1/2 weeks.
I called my mom.
Can you book me to Tibet?
And she said, where is that.
It's like, come on, ma, don't ask me these questions.
Just call the agent and book me a ticket from-- and she said,
oh, this is a very expensive ticket.
I said, OK.
So I said, then I'm going to Katmandu.
I don't come from very huge background.
I figured out, OK, I'm going to take
a bus from Paro to Katmandu.
It took me three days, but that was OK.
And not that anything was happening in my life that time;
it's like nobody needed me at that point.
And I started traveling by bus.
And I figured out that the most beautiful stories
happen when you're not in your comfort
zone, when you're being awake.
There's an American philosopher.
I can't pronounce his name, so I don't want to insult him.
So He said that when you look back in your life,
your life will not be defined about the nights you
slept so well.
They'll be defined by those sleepless nights.
I can spell his name, but it was a difficult name.
But I like that, because all these nights
I was up and thinking what do I want to do with this book?
The whole project was about 2,600 pages.
And I finished it in almost five years.
That time, Junoon was being born at one time of my life.
In 1990, I read one article that India
is one of the fastest growing countries in population.
But it's a shame, we will never get a Michelin star.
And I said, what is a Michelin star?
There was no Google-- sorry, I'm in a Google office.
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: So you couldn't Google anything.
So you don't know what Michelin star was.
But you don't have much reference
of books at that point.
You know, every time you read some of my books,
I'll saw we grew up in a pre-Google age,
where had one newspaper coming to my hometown.
And there was no information besides that.
So here you're writing about such a foreign culture, which
is in between China and India.
And there are so many beautiful countries
which are dominated by this whole cultures of Tibet, Nepal,
Bhutan, Burma, North Pakistan, North India.
I thought this was the strip I must focus on.
And this is what I continued.
And that's why the book is born.
IRFAN DAMA: What a fascinating story, seriously fascinating.
But what I love about it is I love with what humility
you talk about failures in your life.
You have mentioned of one of the interviews
that I was seeing that when you first came to New York,
you literally started with nothing.
You had $3 in your pocket.
And you ended up at a homeless shelter.
VIKAS KHANNA: Christmas.
IRFAN DAMA: And you stayed there for a while.
You got a blanket from someone.
Tell us about the experience.
You had a business in India, correct?
VIKAS KHANNA: Yes.
IRFAN DAMA: And then you came to New York.
So my question is what drew you to New York?
And you were at a point where-- it
scares most of us sitting in this room--
to be ever at that situation, to be in a homeless shelter.
And you came out of that.
So I'd love to know about that experience.
So it's a touching story.
Please tell us about it.
VIKAS KHANNA: I came to America in December-- not in December.
My [INAUDIBLE] hit me.
It's on December.
You don't live in calendars.
This is how I had to-- I never went to proper English schools,
so I think it's my ability.
It's not something which I should
feel I lack behind something.
Because then I could figure out my publisher,
she always says that grammar is not a language.
There's only one language, and that's the heart.
So I don't worry about grammar.
They'll figure out in a nonce.
I came on December 2 to America.
There's an author in American.
His name is Richard Bach.
Some of us must have read this book called
"Jonathan Livingston Seagull."
That was the first book I ever read
by an American author-- my brother gave it
to me-- in which Jonathan wanted to fly higher.
But where I come from, it was a very homogeneous structure
of life, where we only ate a few dishes.
And besides, that was not our cuisine.
And we will not accept it.
You know, that happens.
But I came to America-- I don't know,
I think Richard Bach-- that book,
really-- that 80-page book was my Bible.
And like a little child who likes to repeat,
I would keep repeating reading that again and again.
My brother would say that maybe you don't understand.
That's why you have to read it so many times.
I said, it's a very difficult book, actually.
But how did he figure out to fly higher than everyone else?
And I don't understand the story of going back home.
Why did he go back?
And he wanted to teach everybody to be independent
and to be-- that whole concept of American individualism.
I was so moved by this.
I said, no, we have to live in groups,
like in how we live back home.
Everybody has to live a kind of similar life.
And everybody has to live almost in that group.
So Jonathan Livingston Seagull will never be born,
sometimes you feel.
But I wanted to be somebody who defines
cooking in a different way.
And that is may be one of the biggest reasons why
I wanted to be at the greatest stage of cooking of Manhattan.
I don't know, but maybe that's what
we call destiny, which we can't define.
But I came here.
And I don't know if you remember,
if anybody has landed in New York pre-9/11,
it was a very different country.
9/11 changed so much of our priorities.
It changed our mindsets.
Even if you look at the literature written
by American authors before 9/11 and after 9/11,
there's such a strong subconscious
shift which has happened.
Because I was right there, when everything started changing.
I was standing right Salaam Bombay restaurant, just almost
like 1 and 1/2 blocks away from the site.
I saw that shift.
And that is something which has really
got me so moved about the understanding
that this country is forever evolving.
It is something which is the spirit
is about-- it's so invincible, that they reinvent themselves.
And that was something so important for me.
But before that, I remember that subway used to cost $1.50.
And I go to a restaurant-- I don't have a cell phone.
Initially, at that point, you don't have prepaid phones.
You only could get a phone with a Social Security.
IRFAN DAMA: Right.
VIKAS KHANNA: I never had a social security,
so like, you know, those totally-- I can call myself,
yeah, I was illegal at that time.
I have forgot what was legal.
I said oh, I have a 10-years visa to come to America.
I'm not illegal.
Sir, it was expired.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
VIKAS KHANNA: Your entry was.
And I'm like I had no idea about those things.
I was just come here to American to cook.
I didn't have to worry about all of these things.
We never worried about these things.
So I didn't have money.
But I only had $3.
So I'm going to the restaurant.
The restaurant is closed.
Nobody informed me.
Nobody called me.
And on Christmas Day, the restaurants are closed.
So I'm walking up on Broadway near Canal Street.
And there's a line of people.
And I'm standing in the line.
And a lady comes, and she hands over to me a blanket.
This is 2000, December 25.
And exactly what I needed.
I needed a blanket that time.
I was shivering.
And my socks were wet.
It had just stop raining.
And she tells me, Merry Christmas.
I don't know what happened.
I just hugged her.
I said, thank you.
I needed this.
I said what is this line for?
This is the homeless shelter, New York Rescue Mission.
And now I go to New York Rescue Mission.
I'm a part of there.
I love everything about what they stand for.
I think at that point, you need hope,
more than you need shelter, more than you need food,
more than you need a blanket.
You need a hope that it's going to be OK.
It's OK.
God is also saying, OK, I didn't create you
as a very intelligent creature, but I'm not repenting it,
because I feel that you will find your way back home.
And one day, eventually, you will find your destiny.
All you have to do is keep your head high.
And I remember when they gave me shelter to live there too.
And I was so happy to save $3 that I don't have to eat out.
I don't have to try to take a subway.
And you know, it's OK.
In this country, you can talk about reinventing and falling
flat on the-- and I like when Oprah
said it's great to fall on the ground.
You see the world in a total new perspective.
It's absolutely true.
And when you have fallen to the point when
you don't know if you'll ever get a next meal or not,
or you'll be thrown out of your apartment,
you have such a different perspective of success
when you get it.
IRFAN DAMA: That is true.
And they say it's not about how many times you fall,
it's how quickly you get up that makes a difference.
But what is really impressive to see
is you've gone through your fair share of hardships.
You just mentioned that you had a third restaurant that
closed down.
And seeing where you are today, it must have changed you.
VIKAS KHANNA: There was one thing
which was very stranger which always
happened to me for a long time.
I'll tell you a small incident.
I used to live in Queens.
And when everybody come, most of the immigrants live in Queens.
I mean, take Number 7.
That's the best train even now.
It's a favorite train.
So I'm sitting next to us a sardar-ji,
like a Sikh guy, who's elderly, like he must be 70s.
So he's asking me, like, son, what do you do?
I said I make-- you know, in my culture,
we don't say I make food.
We say [HINDI].
It means "I make bread."
It's such a complex language, the whole concept
of so many languages in one country.
So we never say "I cook food."
You always say "I cook bread" when
you translate it in English.
So I said [HINDI].
He's saying, oh, don't worry.
One day, you'll get a good job.
I said, no!
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: I said, but that's all I know how to do.
He's saying, why don't you drive a cab.
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: I said, I don't have driver's license.
He said oh, that's why you cook.
I said--
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: So he's saying, oh, no, no.
You are young.
You know, you could do double shifts in cab and everything.
You can do good money.
I'll put you through.
You look like a decent guy.
And I'm, like, but I only know how to cook.
He said, oh my god, you're really dumb, he's telling me.
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: And then he asked me, so you have any future?
I said, yeah, I've been making food.
He said, why, you don't need any training to make food.
And then he asked me this very simple question,
which has never left me.
He saw that I was not moving away
from this concept of that "I cook bread," literally.
So he's saying, where did you learn from?
I said, I learned it from my grandmother's kitchen.
And also, I learned how to roll a bread at the Golden
Temple, which is like a big temple in Amritsar, which
is where I was raised.
And he took my hand and kissed it.
He's saying-- prasaab-dha means God's food.
He's saying go and serve God's food.
He's saying, you continue to do that.
He's saying, you don't have to drive a cab, don't worry.
[LAUGHTER]
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
It's interesting.
I guess, hardships change people in different ways.
Some people, when they get to success,
they forget about where they came from.
But obviously, you haven't.
You've set up a number of humanitarian organizations,
the big one being SAKIV and Cooking for Life.
So can you tell us something about these humanitarian
organizations that you have created, and what's it about?
VIKAS KHANNA: It was after 9/11.
It struck a chord in your heart in a different way.
You figured out that one thing which will always sustain us
is togetherness.
And I remember that I was at the site.
And people were a little bit-- because I
look so much like my "cousins."
So some people were getting worried about me,
like what are you doing on this site?
And it was fear is a very dangerous thing.
It is not hatred.
Hatred is a very small part of fear.
What are you doing here?
And I'm, like, I want to help.
So the restaurant was right across the street
from the site.
So every single day-- initially nobody
would come-- but every single day, outside the restaurant
Salaam Bombay, I'll put a small buffet for all the people
who are volunteering at the site.
I will make one biriyani, one dhal,
and I'll have some fresh breads.
Because nobody was coming to the restaurant.
After that, that area just died.
Tribeca started crumbling, because nobody
wanted to take it as a tourist destination.
You don't want to go-- and people would tell me
we don't want to go out and eat.
I would tell my friends, please, come in
and support my restaurant.
And they will say, I don't want to eat near a graveyard.
And that would be, like, oh my god,
would I ever get out of this?
It was, like, something which was
so scary for an immigrant who was brown at that point,
standing right on the site, who wanted to be of some support
to even one soul at that point.
And at that same point, we had some riots in Queens.
And a lot of Sikhs were-- there was
a bit assault and everything.
And that is, again, pre-Google.
And we don't have those images.
Right now, we can get images of what is a "lunger."
"Lunger" is a community kitchen which
comes from the Sikh temples, where
the whole institution of Sikhism is
based on that everyone is equal.
There's no sense of division of societies in them.
So when you look at lunger, where
I learned how to cook-- so I drew a painting of a Sikh
who was serving a little child, a beggar child.
I don't know I was imagining myself as a child
or I was imagining myself as-- So I drew a sketch,
and I stood on the site.
And I kept telling people, you know, these are Sikhs.
They are different.
These are the people who actually raised me.
And there was one professor from NYU.
He asked me saying, why're you doing this?
I said, even if I could tell one person the story of who we are.
Everybody has to tell their own story.
And he said continue to do this.
This is the conviction which will make you stand out
in the United States of America, that I saw you standing there
for two hours.
No one spoke to you.
You were invisible.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
VIKAS KHANNA: He's saying you're invisible right now.
But as long as you believe it, you will become visible.
So this plaque what you're holding it, don't forget it.
This is something which is representing you
and York City and your people.
Don't forget it.
And I remember that was a very important somebody patted
on her back, on like that women who gave me blanket.
It was a similar kind of moment for me.
When I said that it is very important if you believe
in something, you've got to stand up.
If you need to be counted, you need to stand up.
And that is something which I learned
because I was born with a very strange physical disability,
in which I never played throughout my childhood.
So I have no memory of me playing at as a child.
I had club feet, which is a very common problem in First World
countries, but in my part of the world, that's a big problem.
Your feet are inside, you're a ghost.
"But Mummy, I'm a ghost."
That's what everybody in the class tells me.
But you learned how to stood up.
And that is what I felt that it is very important that what you
do is it cannot come from anywhere else.
The source has to be within you.
And I know, being a chef-- some people tell me.
Just go care, who cares what you're saying?
No, it's important.
It's important that I share in what I believe in.
Because what'll happen that this all of these stories add up.
And they become a small epic of our own life.
And that is what my mom taught me.
She's saying if somebody says that you're
a ghost, tell them thank you, angel.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
VIKAS KHANNA: And I did that.
I said, oh yeah.
So the foundations all of us started
based on that there was an equal amount of awareness.
There was some things I did with the Egyptian government right
before they collapsed.
And I wanted to have more accessibility on the World
Wonders.
Now, you would say why would you do that?
Yeah, I figured out that it was difficult for me
to access some blessed places.
So SAKIV was so much based on creating events.
We did events at the pyramids, at the Taj Mahal.
I want planning a next one in Brazil.
Maybe collect chefs and they all put the energy and food
into it.
You create awareness of events.
It's important.
IRFAN DAMA: Mmm-hmm.
I agree.
Not to forget where we come from.
I want to spend some time talking about your book.
You've told us how long you took to write the book.
It's a big work in progress.
But the most interesting thing-- there are a couple of things.
I glanced through your book.
And we spoke about it over lunch.
I hope you enjoyed lunch, by the way.
VIKAS KHANNA: Yes, great.
IRFAN DAMA: It's a big honor to have
Vikas eating at my restaurant.
That's so awesome.
Google's restaurant, I just [INAUDIBLE].
[LAUGHTER]
IRFAN DAMA: FYI.
[HINDI]
VIKAS KHANNA: We take everything what we're successful.
All successful things are ours.
IRFAN DAMA: But the one thing that I loved about the book
is you started with the Buddhist mealtime prayer.
And how do people in the Himalayan River Valley--
how do they view their meals and the food they eat?
And how is it so different from what
the Americans do and their approach to food.
VIKAS KHANNA: See, I find it very difficult
to compare two cultures.
I have always had this problem of living
in two different countries.
But one thing which I love about appreciation
of, when people have such a high regard of, sharing.
And there's a Buddhist meal time prayer.
And the book starts with, saying that every grain is
a the sacrifice of life.
May I be worthy of that sacrifice.
May my unwholesome qualities turn
to wholesome qualities when I consume this life.
I thought that was something so beautiful,
because even if you're consuming rice, that has life.
It has the potential tomorrow to fight against the gravity
and rise to the sun and create a new crop.
That is sexy!
[LAUGHTER]
IRFAN DAMA: That is true.
VIKAS KHANNA: When we look at the magic of soil--
we saw the movie "Vaali."
And I was so affected by "Vaali" that it
is all about that little sprout which
defines our existence on the planet.
And that Buddhist meal time prayer
made me feel about the little grain,
that we are all-- the day that we don't see it,
we are all struggling for that little sprout, which
we don't even think is so And in this prayer,
they made that sprout as the center of the universe.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
VIKAS KHANNA: So I was I said the book has
to start from that kind of note.
And how Americans eat differently.
What Americans can do, the rest of the world can do.
We could create Google.
The world just follows.
I was Googling Google headquarters
and doesn't Google Maps before coming to the Google office.
How can you Google more than that?
[LAUGHTER]
IRFAN DAMA: Exactly.
VIKAS KHANNA: I'm like are you serious, man?
As you know, one thing we also have
to understand that America is a reflection of the world.
We see traces of the whole world in the American hope
or American dream.
It's like there's something so powerful when you have,
when you meet American kids who are--
and I feel proud every day to be part
of that cycle in some way at least.
Even if I'm in the kitchen in Junoon.
And I'm feeding that creativity of the American mind.
This book-- on this high commission
could be produced in America, because of the American--
that curiosity to know more.
And in this book I said there are so
many places where lot of people will not
be able to travel to Mustang, which is northeast of Nepal,
where Nepal people have not gone.
And it's like, it's so many difficult places that where
I went to.
And I said where people can't travel,
I'm doing a small thing of bringing
that small piece of land of Himalayas to their Kitchens
through this book.
So when you look at the American creativity of thought process,
that is something which is so different.
The way Americans think, they way they write,
the way they approach in a very global way.
That is something which we all gravitate,
and we aspire from it.
I could have never thought this as a very important project
if I was living in Amritsar.
IRFAN DAMA: Right.
VIKAS KHANNA: I possibly would've never taught
that Himalayas could be something so large and massive
and splendor of the food and the culture and the people.
Till you came to America and you figured out
that it's so important.
IRFAN DAMA: I glanced through the book.
The book truly excited me-- mostly.
[HINDI] I'm going to get you to sign it.
No, I got this.
But I read through this.
And a lot of the recipes really fascinated me.
And I'm definitely going to use these recipes in my restaurant.
I'm going to have a Vikas Khanna Day.
I love so many-- the simplicity is
what touched me-- the simple mustard greens.
They're such incredibly simple dishes,
but the one thing-- and I told you
I was going to ask you this question-- is about the 108
caves of meditation potatoes.
VIKAS KHANNA: Yeah, yeah.
It's a very interesting place.
It's near Llasa.
It's approximately three hours drive from Llasa in Tibet.
And I went to Tibet because-- we all
go to Tibet because we love His Holiness.
It's something about Potala Palace,
which is the-- and Potala is fantastic, if anybody has not
Googled it, must Google it.
It had a red side and the white side.
Right side is the Parliament or the political side.
So he says the white side is a spirituality side.
So he says that both teams have been balanced in sync.
And it is like approximately three hours from there.
There is a place where they have 108 caves on the mountains.
So I decided one day I'm going to go to all those 118 caves.
And on the way, they had these two things
which were fantastic.
One is they served these potatoes, which
are boiled potatoes, and they come in a plastic bag
and with chopsticks.
And you keep feeding that starch as you
travel through these mountains.
And there was a second thing which was so shocking.
It's a true example of our existence
that how we define our cuisines and how we actually
continue to live and thrive.
VIKAS KHANNA: They had made a small kind of a-- it
looked like a soap-- a batch of potato starch, which
was boiled, and made into this small block.
It was sitting there.
And it's noodles actually.
So I'm like OK, but where are the noodles.
And the woman is, like, could you be little patient?
But where are the noodles?
This is just a block.
You cut it.
What do you do with it?
So they have this small kind of a piece of a-- like a lid.
You know the lids which come out of the tuna box and everything
So that kind of little finger handle, and then
she had made holes in it.
So what she would do that she wants to slide over
that little block of potato starch block,
and the noodles will come out.
It's in the book.
And I'm looking at this, and I was, like,
wow, that is fantastic.
So what she does is that she makes them
and then she tosses with a little bit of garlic chili
oil and all those things.
But one thing which I also found very interesting
is-- I'm not going against China.
Please nobody quote that-- but I found
a pasta making machine which is more than 1,000 years old
in northwest of Bhutan.
And I'm going to show you a picture of that.
And it is like a huge lemon press,
like the lemon press we have to squeeze
lemon juice or the garlic press?
They had this kind of wooden thing.
Now, this is that potato noodles with chili paste.
This is how she figured out that there's
a big block of potato starch thing which
was potato starch just cooked in water
and which was quite like thick like gelatin.
It's very much like jelly.
And then she scraps it with this little thing.
And this is what comes out.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
VIKAS KHANNA: And I was like, this is a beautiful story.
So the whole book when it was created,
it was almost 2,600 pages of research.
The whole book would've gone-- but then
it will become very unuser-friendly, and cost
effective.
Shipping will be a problem.
IRFAN DAMA: Exactly.
I can tell you right now, I can't serve that.
To make that for 1,000 bowls, I think my hand will fall off.
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: You know, practice is what makes them so fast.
One scrape, and bowl is ready.
How fast she was.
And there's one more thing which I
want to say about the dedication page of this book.
This book is dedicated to this woman whom I don't know,
and I will never possibly be able to meet her again.
I'm quite forgetful, and I know that.
So I had this small computer VAIO, that black one,
the cheapest one I used to have.
So I had everything documented there,
and this is the last stop, 108 caves.
So there was a small place, which
was like last time I'm going to have butter tea.
So I wanted to have my last butter tea in total peace.
And then we had a small van-- like the Maruti van
which used to come in India.
It's a 10-seater van.
My driver is like run, run, run!
So I ran out, and I forgot my laptop in the bag next
to my chair.
And I forgot, and I'm totally excited.
And now I'm getting carried away with the new sights
and everything.
I still had my little camera.
I took all this pictures myself.
So I'm clicking more images.
And suddenly, the bus stopped.
There was a Tibetan woman from the top of the hill.
She ran down the slope to give my computer back to me.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
Incredible.
VIKAS KHANNA: And I'm trying to give her something, because I
don't know how to react to this.
Like nobody has done this kind of running for me.
So she shrugged, and she said something in Tibetan.
I asked the driver.
She said that anyone would have done that.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
VIKAS KHANNA: And she must have that ran about two miles,
more than that.
And that sight never leaves me.
You know, the married women wear apron-looking dresses,
and they are so beautiful.
She must be in her 60s, but her running down that hill
and giving me the computer is why this book is born today.
I would have lost almost all my data, everything, all images.
And more than that, I would have lost hope that I can do it.
And that hope led to another hope,
and that led to another hope, which got me here.
IRFAN DAMA: That is incredible.
I have to tell you I spent two years in Delhi,
when I worked at the [INAUDIBLE] Sheraton.
And that was when I was first introduced to momos.
I'd never heard about momos before that.
There was a small little restaurant in chana ke puri,
where all the [INAUDIBLE] students used to go.
And they would have momos.
And I think the first time, I had a thing--
it had 60 momos or something.
It was so good.
So you have covered momos to great degree in this book.
Give us something real quick about momos.
It's such an incredible dish.
VIKAS KHANNA: You know, momos is a very interesting dough.
It's a very interesting dough.
It's just flour, salt and water.
And then use your instinct.
It needs to be a firm dough, because if you let it rest,
cover with a wet cloth for half an hour.
That's all you need.
But lot of people when I was doing any classes
or doing my training of my own chefs in the restaurant,
we were worried about the shape of the momos,
you know that intricate shape, in which we
do touch a lot of that shapes in his book.
But one thing was which is-- I tell them, tell
people who cares how the shape is.
But the beauty of momos is that you can stuff them
with anything you have, any leftovers, any restaurant
food which is left.
It needs to be dry for sure.
And if you have minced meat, just
add some salt and lemon juice to it.
You could just stuff that in.
Steaming is a great healthy way to eat.
But one more thing, which I figured out,
that you could actually make momos with whole wheat
flour too.
And you can use a lot of greens too.
And this is one of my favorite test stories about.
I go to this woman's house.
This is in Paro.
It's the capital of Bhutan.
This is actually the only city in the world
where there's no traffic lights.
I think there's one traffic signal
in Bhutan, the whole of the country.
And nobody breaks traffic rules!
When I got my driver's license-- again,
I come back to driving-- in Bhutan, they drive so well.
They have so much respect for nature.
They don't honk.
They don't do anything.
I don't know.
It's a totally different thought process,
in which they say, we don't honk,
not to disturb the other driver, but we
don't honk to disturb the nature.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
VIKAS KHANNA: So I was like, wow.
So this woman has this, and she is making me the butter tea.
If you've ever seen this movie called
"Seven years in Tibet, with Brad Pitt,"
the last line of the movie is that "Butter tea was never
my cup of tea."
This is a tea, which is made with tea, little bit of milk,
water, lots of yak butter, and salt.
I know it doesn't sounds delicious at all.
It is not.
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: First sip, you will
say I can't be having this floating grease in my mouth,
like are you serious?
But you went to anyone's house, it was there.
So I write about this that I got so upset with this butter tea.
So in my little apartment in Manhattan
which is the size of a matchbox, it only smelled of butter tea.
So anyone who'd come to visit me, I'll [INAUDIBLE].
And people are, like, are you weird?
We're never coming back to your house
again if this is the next time you're going to do this to us.
But this woman, had this kind of a stirrer, a whisk,
which is from a tree.
So I asked her can I have that?
She said you can have anything, but you can't have this.
It was given to me by my mother-in-law.
I said OK.
So I loved that.
A whisk I could not buy.
But I wanted to take a picture of it to put in the book
and say, eventually, when I was walking out,
her daughter gave it to me, because she
saw that my heart was like oh my god, that's a whisk?
It looked exactly like a whisk.
It's a top of a tree.
And they use that to make tea.
I thought this is really great.
And I thought, that organicness is something which connects us
all to something which is very pure, that simplicity.
IRFAN DAMA: That is very, very incredible.
I have to ask you that incredible story you told us
in 2005 when the Dalai Lama touched your forehead.
And then, you now have him writing the forward in "Return
to the Rivers."
How did that happen-- you managed
to get him writing for your book.
That's incredible.
Tell us about it.
VIKAS KHANNA: Destiny?
Pure destiny.
I always feel that there was something
so honest in what I was doing, when I was writing this.
I was not worried about if my next meal is going to come,
what is going to happen to my life.
It's like what am I doing?
But there was something in the universe which was constantly
guiding me and telling me you are doing the right thing, son.
And it was something is telling me
that I choose people to do projects,
like there was a bigger power telling me
that you didn't choose this project.
I chose you to do this project.
And when I met his Holiness, he was asking me questions.
He was literally trying to test me.
So I went for meditation with him.
And Kalachakra is the biggest Buddhist congregation
which happens in Bodh Gaya.
Bodh Gaya is a place in India where Buddha was enlightened.
So at Kalachakra, we have lot of people.
And I thought I will never get to be sitting with him,
because Richard Gere's there, and everybody from Hollywood
there.
And [INAUDIBLE] looking at me.
Basically, he pulls me on.
And he starts talking to me about the project.
I'm, like, really?
And then there was another guy who
was there, who was complaining nonstop.
Oh you don't know, I have so much money.
But I don't understand why my kids left me,
my wife is getting married and she didn't inform me.
And my [INAUDIBLE] that at him, and say "my friend,
you need scotch."
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: Stop complaining, he tells that way.
He does!
You think, you started this intent
through saying that you are so rich.
Stop feeling bad about yourself.
Stop feeling bad.
On top of that, you're telling me
how poor you are because you can't connect to anyone?
And I'm like oh my God, look at his presence of mind.
And then he tells me-- immediately, looks at you, says
did you go to-- I said, yes.
I went to Amdo.
Bundle is his birthplace.
I knew it somehow that he's going to ask me that question.
I don't know why.
And I said I learned how to make your favorite bread there.
It's "Amdo Bread" in the book.
And he just kept holding my hand.
And that guy kept complaining in the behind.
Like, but what do you want me to do it with my life?
You know, I have so much money.
He does this to get him to shut up.
But he wanted to hear the story of bread,
which is his childhood bread.
He goes back to Dharamshala and within almost three weeks,
I get a letter from his office, about congratulating me
of accomplishing this project.
And that's the forward.
IRFAN DAMA: Incredible.
I don't know how many people in the world
would be able to have this.
I am so impressed.
I've got to ask you one last question as a chef looking
to you.
You have accomplished so much.
It's so much.
I mean, we could never dream of accomplishing
13 books and so many appearances.
But you don't take time to rest.
Is there going to be time for life any time soon.
Is there going to be a Mrs. Vikas Khanna?
[LAUGHTER]
IRFAN DAMA: Someday, are you going to take a break
and just say time to enjoy what I have accomplished?
VIKAS KHANNA: I feel that this platform is fantastic.
I went to launch this book in India.
I wanted my motherland to see this book first.
I don't know what-- I'm not that patriotic.
I take it is as I feel.
So Jaipur Lit Festival is the largest literary festival
in India, where Oprah went last year
and then before that, Deepak Chopra's spoken there.
Salman Rushdie was not allowed to speak there,
but I was allowed.
IRFAN DAMA: Good on you!
Good on you!
Excellent.
VIKAS KHANNA: So they never had a chef there before,
Jaipur Lit Festival.
They never had a cookbook launch there.
It's the largest South Asian literary festival,
and I'm just going there.
And I'm a little worried because I
know there's going to be a lot of press.
So I'm asking the people at the festival,
do you rent people just to fill up my place?
I don't want to be standing there alone,
that, OK, I came all the way from America to open this book.
So all throughout, I'm asking people, so can you come?
They say, yeah, we'll come.
It's like I can pay you guys.
I'm thinking I should have 100 rupees notes
and I would give it to everyone.
Please come for this.
So I go there, there's a Bollywood
director who's talking there.
So he has almost like 100 people there.
So I'm like can we tell these people that
after this that-- he thinks chef,
can you be a little less paranoid?
You're scaring us.
You know what, it's going to such an insult,
like, here I'm talking that I don't want
to open this book in America first.
I want to open this book in India first.
And I call my mom.
And she's like no, I'm not interested.
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: I thought nobody's ready to come to my book
lecture.
And they said we put you in the Google Mughal tent.
I said I don't know what that means,
that people have to Google my tent?
So there's a place in Jaipur Lit Festival.
it's called Google Mughal Tent.
And they said chef, please, we don't want your anxiety
going all over the place.
We have people waiting here since last night in the tent.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
VIKAS KHANNA: I went there.
They were more than 3,000 people waiting
to see this book being opened in front of them.
IRFAN DAMA: Incredible.
VIKAS KHANNA: So I felt that was my bigger accomplishment
than having a life partner or having
anything else in my life.
I hold this book like this, and I
could hear people yelling and crying.
I said this is symbol of home.
As I told, I'm there, and I looked at all this kids.
And then it was difficult for me to get out of the crowd,
because I disturbed that whole festival for that day.
I know that.
Because I went up and told them the story of why
I came back home, because I said,
because in my favorite book, Jonathan Livingston
comes back home.
I wanted to go back home and see how the home was.
IRFAN DAMA: Wonderful.
Well, just by saying that you've no time for a life
or a wife-- the sexiest chef around.
I don't know how many hearts are broken in the audience.
But truly, an incredible story.
You know, how you can tell you that you talked to a real chef?
This is from a tandoor.
His hands are really, really worn.
These scarred hands.
VIKAS KHANNA: You never need to go for waxing.
Everything is burned, everything.
You never need to ever for it.
If everybody wants to go get a nice free waxing, say,
can I put my hand in the tandoor?
So you get perfect clean waxing.
People ask me, so you wax?
I said, no.
Oh but you have you're waxed one hand.
IRFAN DAMA: Tandoor.
And what an incredible story.
I'm now going to open to questions in the audience.
Does anybody have any questions for Vikas?
Vinod here will hand you the microphone,
so if you have a question, please raise your hand
and Vinod will come over and give you the microphone.
AUDIENCE: Before 2005 and after, would you say
was that anything that different than you
did, that you know what you wanted
and everything like a lot of success.
What was the difference before and after?
VIKAS KHANNA: The biggest difference, I felt,
was that there was a time when the transitional time
of Indian cuisine, I would say, from their reference,
that a lot of people, a lot of friends, we would meet,
who were totally in not very approval of Indian cuisine.
"I hate curry."
Like, you know, I heard that word many times.
But after that, I was convinced.
I would patronize the cuisine, not the people.
If you patronize something which is art,
it is much bigger than the people.
I think that is what I was convinced
in 2005, when I'd failed so many times.
Because somebody would say "change this," and I'll run.
I'll change it, because I wanted to patronize everyone.
In the middle of this whole transition,
I forgot that I would rather be a slave to art
than to be to people.
For me, the culture was the art.
The food was the art.
I just focused on that after that.
I just stopped worrying about-- even now,
when something has to be done the right way, we do it.
And I feel that people respond more to that,
than if you just keep changing for everyone's
individual perception.
And yeah, I didn't go to great schools.
Initially, cooking was the only thing I did.
But one thing I figured out you focus only on something
you're convinced about.
Rest is not important.
Rest comes as a very important by-product.
I don't know if anything made sense what I said.
AUDIENCE: OMG.
[LAUGHTER]
AUDIENCE: I'm a big fan.
I actually have started my own food page.
And I'm up every day, visitor of your page.
And that's when I came to know that you'll be in Google,
so I somehow tracked down my friend
that I really want to come to the campus.
And I really wanted to come and see you.
One question.
I've sent you many messages on Facebook, but haven't--
[LAUGHTER]
AUDIENCE: --had any response yet.
IRFAN DAMA: [INAUDIBLE] that pressure.
AUDIENCE: I sent you a link of my page.
Hey, what do you think about my page?
It's a food blog.
No, no response.
AUDIENCE: Awww.
IRFAN DAMA: See, this is why you should
be married, because my wife answers
all my Facebook questions.
[LAUGHTER]
IRFAN DAMA: And she's always on top of things.
She's my publicist, so.
VIKAS KHANNA: Hi.
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: I'm sorry.
AUDIENCE: Send again?
VIKAS KHANNA: I'm not the greatest person to click.
My lady who does my--
AUDIENCE: You should blame the publicist.
VIKAS KHANNA: Publicist.
[INAUDIBLE] here.
I'm just writing a big encyclopedia
of festive foods of India.
And I start this journey from Indus Valley,
what festivals they must be celebrating,
and what foods they must be eating.
In Greek, Greek people or Greeks, like what language,
they say that artist dies, art lives.
I'm a [INAUDIBLE] believer of that.
Right now, and I'm that story of Mirabai
which we hold in the mythology, who fell in love with Krishna.
And she couldn't see anything else.
She could even have consumed poison.
But the love was so much greater for something else.
So what has happened that I do have
a lot of people who does my social media, also.
But I am the one who says that today God has given me
a voice, after being mute and dumb for so many years.
At this time, I must discover more art.
So in this space and time, I will never become a shopkeeper,
like I will never have pickles coming out of my name
with a smile.
Nothing.
I'm the slave of art.
And that is what all my energy goes.
And I've apologized in the middle of this
if I'm ignoring something.
AUDIENCE: You're not.
VIKAS KHANNA: I'm not, but I just
feel that there's something that-- how many people give
an opportunity given that I live in India and America both.
In America, they don't know that I live in India.
And in India, they don't know I live in America.
So I think this whole confusion of time lapse, my whole life
is like in different space.
AUDIENCE: No, we have full tab on when you're in America
and when you're in India.
[LAUGHTER]
IRFAN DAMA: Wonderful.
VIKAS KHANNA: Can I cook for you to apologize?
[LAUGHTER]
AUDIENCE: Yes, do, yes.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow.
AUDIENCE: Can you get jimbu here?
You mentioned it's such a great alternative
to cumin-based tempering.
Jumbu, as we call in Uttarakhand.
VIKAS KHANNA: Oh my god, where are you from?
AUDIENCE: Uttarakhand which is Kumaun, and--
VIKAS KHANNA: Wowwwww!
I paid my money, he says right.
Somebody I figured out I was right.
AUDIENCE: So I think what is there is quite authentic.
Like, I think it's gone to Nepal as well as Uttarakhand.
So can you get it?
Right now, my only way is to smuggle it through,
like get it from India basically.
VIKAS KHANNA: Yeah.
That's what I suggest too.
IRFAN DAMA: Smuggle it.
VIKAS KHANNA: Smuggle it.
Hey, you know, every time I'm coming back,
and I'm at the airport.
And I'm just getting into the Customs,
and the guy says, you're the same guy from Gordon Ramsay,
right?
I said, yeah.
Are you getting in some spices?
I said yes.
He said OK, go.
IRFAN DAMA: Wow!
VIKAS KHANNA: But the only thing I do is I steal and I bring.
Anybody recording, also?
It's OK.
IRFAN DAMA: It's OK.
VIKAS KHANNA: Love is love.
But jimbu is a very unique herb, which
is used in Uttarakhand cuisine and it's
used in Nepalese cuisine.
One thing which is unique is that it is so delicate
that what you do is that you heat the oil,
not totally burn it.
You add jimbo.
Instantly, you add it over lentils.
It's such a fragrant, holistic smell.
It's only used in lentils, in Uttarakhand and in Nepal.
But if you would ever make a journey to Mustang,
in northeast of Nepal, where they-- you must Google this.
Google is free for you guys anyway.
[LAUGHTER]
VIKAS KHANNA: Mustang, this is the place
where they found about 1,500 years old caves of Buddha.
They use jimbu in making meat and in preserving meat.
I was like wow!
How do I smuggle this.
But you're right.
Some things are very difficult when you talk about
substitutions, , because you don't want to destroy
the beauty of it.
So I put the jimbu-- call it jimbu.
A lot of people say, it's not "Hi- MAL-yan,"
it's "hi ma LAY an."
I said no!
It's a Sanskrit word.
At least for one time in my life, I'm right [INAUDIBLE].
IRFAN DAMA: All right.
Well, thank you everyone for coming.
And Vikas--
VIKAS KHANNA: Likewise.
IRFAN DAMA: Thank you so much for coming here.