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Multiple times on this show we have discussed the
astonishing, repeated discoveries of soft tissues
still preserved in the fossil record, with
particular fascination for dinosaur tissues and
even blood still preserved in fossil dinosaur
bones. Last year two researchers from the Creation
Research Society published a paper detailing the
finding of more soft dinosaur tissues preserved in
a Triceratops horn. One of those researchers was
Mark Armitage.
Mark studied biology at the University of Florida.
He holds a masters degree in Biology with emphasis
on electron microscopy from the ICR Graduate
School. All his biological training is going to
prove important for the subject at hand today. He
is currently a Doctoral Candidate at Liberty
University in the School of Education. He served as
adjunct professor of biology at Master’s College
for three years and adjunct professor of biology
and electron microscopy at Azusa Pacific University
for four years. Mark’s micrographs have appeared
on the covers of eleven scientific journals, and he
has published over 30 technical papers on
microscopic phenomena in such journals as American
Laboratory, Southern California Academy of Sciences
Bulletin, Parasitology Research ,Microscopy and
Microanalysis.
He is a lifetime member of the Creation Research
Society, and is past President for the Southern
California Society for Microscopy and
Microanalysis, currently serving as treasurer.
He joins me now via skype.
I have wanted to have you on the show for quite
some time, so welcome to the show Mark
>>Thank you Ian, it's great to be here, and yes -
some of those long words are real tongue-twisters,
aren't they? haha.
>>Haha - yes. I'd like to start off with the iDino
project - I've talked about here on the show
before, and you've been heavily involved with it,
what can you tell us about it?
>>Well thank you Ian, it's great to be with you, I
appreciate the opportunity to speak to you and your
listeners and viewers, so we have a little show and
tell today which we'll get to, but idino - what is
"iDino?" iDino is an acronym that we came up with
because we wanted something catchy that people
would remember, but it does have a meaning - it
stand for Investigation of Dinosaur Intact Natural
Osteotissue - meaning we're studying dinosaur
remains, mostly their bones, and we're looking for
intact, natural - in other words, pre-existing,
original, osteotissue or bone tissue. Because bones
- bones are interesting organs in your body; they
are organs. They're comprised of a lot of mineral,
calcium, phosphate, other minerals, but they also
have a lot of soft tissue in them. And there's a
particular, very interesting part of the soft
tissue called an osteocyte which is a bone cell,
and they come in several different flavours, we can
talk about that, but osteocytes are very
characteristic cells. And any microscopist, any
person who's ever done any study of bones, really
any - mammalian, reptilian or amphibian bones,
avian bones, recognize osteocytes INSTANTLY -
there's just no confusing osteocyte with any other
kind of cell. And so they're a wonderful cell to go
hunting for in dinosaur tissues. Now we began this
work because we, as well as you and probably your
viewers and most every creationist on the planet
was very excited to see the work of Mary
Schweitzer, uh, who is a researcher, a
paleontologist from North Carolina State
University, and uh she published a series of very
interesting papers where she went to the Hell Creek
formation in Montana, which is very well known
fossil graveyard, in fact it's well known for
Triceratops, but also T. rex, and they found a very
large T. rex fossil and uh, and a very large femur,
and of course when you're in the field as a
paleontologist, you want to remove bones, you
jacket these things. First you paint them with a, a
plastic - a methylacrylate, and then you bind it up
with essentially casting material. Like, if you
broke your arm, you would put on a cast, well they
put casts around these bones, and then the flip'em
over, and they put a cast on the other side, and
they pull them out of the dig. And so as everybody
knows, this large femur that she had was too heavy
to be lifted out by helicopter, and so they had to
fracture and saw the femur up and she sent some
pieces back to her lab, and you know the story -
she dissolved some of these in a weak acid, and
found all kinds of soft tissue in it! She's found
uh, blood-like vessels, and blood-like cells. They
don't - you know, they don't use the terminology
"This is a blood cell," "This is an osteocyte," uh,
they call it an "osteocyte-like cell" because they
don't want to state the obvious, for whatever
reason. But I'm sure they have their little
paradigm to protect. But at any event, we're very
excited about that work, as was most people, and so
we went to the Hell Creek formation in May of 2012,
and we spent three days searching and digging, and
we found the largest Triceratops horn ever located
on that ranch. About a 40 inch long, 9 inch wide,
intact, what they call a "supra-orbital" horn. As
you know the Triceratops has three horns, and this
was one that was over the eyes - supra-orbital, it
was above the eye, very large specimen, but it was
in a very bad state of decay.
It was fractured into many pieces, when we took it
out it fractured into many pieces, it was filled
with plant roots, it was filled with mud, it was
kind of moist. Really unlike the femur - the T. rex
femur that Schweitzer found, which was completely
encapsulated with this hard bone mineral, all the
soft tissue in side, no no no - the horn we found
was highly vascular and a lot of holes in it where
the vascular bundles went through, and it was
loaded with this wet mud, they call it matrix, it
was loaded with matrix, so it must've been exposed
to fungi and bacteria, and algae and insects,
microorganisms, I mean, it runs the gammut of what
it could've been filled with - plant roots.
So we were rather dejected, frankly. When we pulled
it out of the ground, we thought "We're not going
to find anything here." But I brought it back to
the lab, and I worked on it for about six months,
and lo and behold, we not only found osteocytes,
but we found entire SHEETS of osteocytes - I mean,
stretchy pieces of material that were maybe, 3 to 4
centimeters long that you could stretch like a
piece of taffy and let go, and it would come back
into confirmation, so I thin-sectioned some of
that, and uh looked at it under the microscope, and
here I have a microscope which I'm going to show
you some images from in just a second here, but I
thin-sectioned that, and located these osteocytes
in three dimensions! In other words, you could
focus down through the tissue, and see these
osteocytes emplaced throughout the whole Z-axis
in that tissue.
So we were stunned by this! And of course it's way
different from the find that Mary Schweitzer and
others have found, because this shouldn't have been
there at all! This should not have been there even
after, well we would think these things were buried
what, maybe four to six, maybe eight thousand years
ago? Maybe. Um, even in that time frame, that stuff
shouldn't be there! So it's really an enigma, and
I've gotten in trouble because I tell people I
think it's a miraculous preservation, I think God
miraculously preserved this for us to find it. I
get in trouble for - you'd be surprised, a lot of
creationists call me out on that one, but I do - I
really think that God chose this specific time and
us for this task to find these things, and so
we published it.
We published this in a major journal - in fact,
this got fast-tracked into the journal. I think it
was 30 days from the time we submitted it until the
time it was accepted, which is unheard of! Most of
my papers take a year to a year and a half to get
published, and so this was published very quickly.
And of course, at the time I was running an
electron microscope laboratory, a premiere,
multi-million dollar laboratory at California State
University, North Ridge, in the biology department
and uh the paper was published. Before that, one of
the pictures of the soft, fibrular bone mass with
the osteocytes in it, was published on the cover of
American Laboratory, and that didn't sit well with
some of the faculty members, and so shortly after
the paper was published, I found myself out on the
street without a job.
>>Very frustrating - and you are not the first this
has happened to.
>>I'm not the first one that this has happened to.
It is frustrating because I made no conclusions in
the paper, I just presented the factual data, uh
the only conclusions I drew were that "This needs
to be investigated further. We have a lot of work
to do." And that was it. So to be, and I have to
tell you, I can't talk much about the situation
with the university right now because I have
attorneys, they're preparing a lawsuit, and the
lawsuit is about to be filed, and so, suffice it to
say, some people in the department didn't
appreciate it, and somehow they seemed to work a
way to have me very quickly removed from my
position. I'd been there for over three years, 38
months, I'd received many accolades from many of
the professors, in fact the chairman of the
department of biology wrote me a letter of
recommendation and he said "Mark is probably the
best staff member that this department has ever
hired." At that point it was a 50 year old
department, so I felt rather proud of my
accomplishments there. So it's very unfortunate,
and I really feel sad for the students who were
learning the skills of microscopy, and abruptly had
to change mid-stream in the middle of their
masters' thesis because I got yanked out of the
lab, and I was the instructor of record - I was
teaching scanning electron transmission electron
microscopy, of course light microscopy with the
light microscopes, and also confocal microscopy.
This brand-new flourescent microscopes with just
lasers, and really really cool technology, so it
was very disappointed to be thrown out in the
street as a result.
>>As we've discussed here on the show before,
certainly the findings of Schweitzer and team were
not the first - there was reports of dinosaur blood
found in dinosaur bones back in the 1920's. So
neither this finding nor Schweitzer's were
the first.
>>No no no, my paper - in fact, this was not my
first paper on this phenomena - back in early
2000's, I published a paper in the Creation
Research Society Quarterly; I recieved a piece of a
T. rex femur that had been in a museum drawer for
about a hundred years. And so I fractured it open
and found soft tissues inside of it, so this was
actually my second paper.
And also it's rather frustrating because when I
interviewed for this position at California State
University North Ridge, I gave my entire
publication history, which included all of my
Christian and creationist publications, I gave full
disclosure as who I was, they knew who I was, in
fact, there was even a critique on the California
State University North Ridge website - a critique
of one of my papers, written about 10 or 15 years
ago, by a geologist at CSUN who had just excoriated
me on my paper, and so it's on their website. So
anybody could've researched Mark Armitage, and CSUN
and this critique of my work would've popped right
up, so I didn't do anything nefarious, I was
completely above board and open about my position,
uh, I didn't try to proselytize people, but you
know I did [garbled] my professor, Dr. Richard
Blumsden, the late Richard Blumsden who was with
the Institute for Creation Research, and he was
also with the Creation Research Society, he used to
say to me "My boy - don't be afraid of where your
science takes you!" And so, Dr. Lumsden I hope I'm
doing you proud, because I haven't been afraid of
where my science has taken me.
>>Okay, so the iDino team went looking for
soft tissues
>>well yes, in the horn and also in ribs, we found
Triceratops ribs, and of course all this is
presented in the paper - by the way, the paper was
published in an international journal called Acta
Histochemica, which is a journal of cells and
tissue, and so it was a natural fit
for that journal.
And it was published in 2013, so it's readily
available. In fact if you just google "Armitage
Triceratops," the paper will come up and you can go
and purchase it online from Elsevier. And
Elsevier's a rather large publisher - they publish
the "Lancet," they publish "Cell," and they've been
publishing since the 1600's, So I think they know a
thing or two about publishing. So it's a great
honour to be published in that journal, so yes we
did find, we found soft vessels in the horn and in
the rib, mostly in the rib, it appeared that most
of the vessels were permineralized or fossilized
inside the horn.
But also very interestingly, in the rib, we found
(because we fractured away some of these vessels)
and inside those vessels, you could see all these
tiny round microstructures which we had to call red
blood cell-like structures. [laughing] We couldn't
just come right out and say "These are red blood
cells." But they are obviously packed inside the
vessel, the vessel is soft and pliable, you've got
all these round structures in there - I mean, come
on! Any common sense person would say "that looks
like blood," and those look like blood vessels.
But interestingly, in the horn, most of the blood
products were crystalized, and so in the iron heme
group, and the hemaglobin does this when it
dessicates it'll crystalize and form these
beautiful little crystaline structures. with very
squared off edges and very sharp edges, so you can
see that, and all the vessels were all
permineralized, they were all hardened. But on the
other side of that, between the vessels and the
hard bone mineral, were these sheets of soft
bone tissue.
Before they get hardened, these osteocytes are
really cool little cells. They actually come from
blood cells - they descend from the white cell
line, and they differentiate into what we call
osteoblasts and osteoclasts and then osteocytes. So
there's three different types. The osteoblasts of
course are building cells - so they're busy
building bone, so what they'll do is they'll all
line up in the same direction, they're all linearly
in the same direction, in the same plane, and they
will cement themselves in with this bone mineral.
But at the same time, they build little tunnels
between cells. They're called cannaliculi. They're
tiny little tunnels, and they put a little thread
called a filopodia, it's an extension of the cell,
and all these filopodia go in all three directions,
and they're all touching each other. All these bone
cells - even in hard bone, are all touching each
other, and they're all alive!
And so what they're doing as you're walking or
running or stretching, you know, excercising,
they're measuring the mechanical stress in your
bones, as you're doing these things, and so they
will decide which area of the bones need to be
deconstructed and repaired, and others can stay the
way they are. And so osteoblasts build the bone
mineral, osteoclasts dissolve the bone mineral, and
those populations have to stay equal throughout
your lifetime. Now what happens is as you get
osteoporosis? Well the osteoblasts die off. And so
the ones that are building bone cells die off and
the osteoclasts are busy deconstructing bone. So
you get big voids inside of your bone that are not
repaired because the osteoblasts are dying off. So
they give you a drug that increases the population
of the osteoblasts and keeps those populations
equal. And so I think I heard somewhere that your
entire bone is replaced every twelve years with
these little cells that do this, and so it's crazy
- it's really an amazing study in anatomy, and I
would encourage anybody to do a unit on bone cell
morphology and structure and function, it's just
crazy what these things are doing. But as I say -
these osteocytes are characteristic, uh, you
recognize them instantly, and so when you're
dealing with a dinosaur bone, and you find
osteocytes in it, and I'm going to show you some
here on this screen here, these are bone cells -
that's an osteocyte right there, from a dinosaur
cell that's on this microscope. That's one single
cell which I've isolated out. These cells are so
characteristic that to claim that your bone is
contaminated with something from the environment
is ridiculous!
>>That's a major point
>>Because it's a huge - because the "contamination"
claim is "Well you know, there is osteocytes from
some other, more recent organism sequestered inside
that bone." So you're asking me to believe that a
bird or something died, next to this fossil
Triceratops horn, and that the bird somehow broke a
wing, as it was crashing into the ground and dying,
and the osteocytes had the presence of mind to
crawl out of the bird bone and hunt around and find
a Triceratops horn and crawl deeply into the
Triceratops horn and take up residence in the
proper conformation - remember these things are all
aligned in perfect, X-Y space! So they're all
pointed in the same direction!
And all in the same plane! So it's ludicrous to
make the contamination claim. And so we don't see
that claim made too much more these days. The other
claim has been that these are bacterial biofilms;
what is a biofilm? well these microorganisms, when
they're busy breaking down nutrients they find in
the soil, they want to go get that stuff - that's
food for them. And so they break it down and they
consume it and in their place, they make this sort
of sugary film that they all live in, and somehow
that sugary film, this biofilm that they made, took
on the perfect shape of this osteocyte which is
ridiculous to assume that the biofilm could take on
a shape like that. I mean, these are very
characteristic shapes of bone cells. And not only
that, we're seeing inside the bone cells,
nucleus-like structures. Now remember - we can't
call them nuclei! [laughing] We have to call them
nuclear-like structures, right? But here you're
expecting the biofilm to not only find the proper
place where the osteocyte is, replicate it in its
entirety, including the internal organels, I mean
it's ridiculous to assume this, and so the biofilm
theory has gone by the boards. In fact, Mary
Schweitzer did an excellent series of experiments
where she actually found in the nucleus-like
structure, she found histones - which are the
packaging proteins that package up DNA. As you
know, DNA can be strung out into long, thin
strings, which its deconstructed that way in order
to copy it, right? You're to copy DNA and the
messenger RNA has to be unwound. But the winding up
is done by these proteins called histones that wind
and superwind and triple-wind and quadruple-wind
until we get these chromosomes, what we recognize
as chromosomes, and so she found actual dinosaur
histones inside the nucleus-like structures in this
wonderful series of experiments, so I think we've
all agreed now that this is real dinosaur tissue,
it's staggeringly amazing that this lasted a
supposed 65 to 70 million years, and didn't
decompose, and now she's published a recent paper
which says "Well it was the blood - the blood that
somehow preserved it." And again, it's like a
tenth-grade science project to publish a paper like
that - that's just too fantastic.
>>Even within the paradigm of a 6,000 year old
earth, with these dinosaurs being killed 4,500
years ago in a world wide flood, these preserved
tissues are an astonishing find.
>>It is astonishing - and one of the things I
learned in microscopy, particular my master's
program and as I've continued to do research, when
you want to study tissues, particularly under the
electron microscope, fast preservation is
paramount. We go through - we try to be as humane
as possible when we're sacrificing organisms for
study? I mean, that's the least we can do is
anesthetize them and you know, expire them gently.
But we have to almost instantly profuse their
tissues in a strong chemical called a fixative -
you've heard of formaldehyde, well, there's others,
there's glutaraldehyde which is one that's
preferred in electron microscopy, followed by
osmium tetroxide, and these are very dangerous
chemicals that require the use of a hood and
goggles, and you can't breathe this stuff, and, why
do we do that? Because we're very interested in the
shapes and the morphology of the tissues and if we
don't preserve them quickly, and often we do this
on ice - often we put our specimens on ice because
autolosis - the natural breaking down of tissues is
a standard MO - it's a standard operating procedure
for all cells when they die, they release these
chemicals that just deconstruct everything! And
break it apart so that the proteins, the amino
acids and everything are useable, and so, autolisis
is a really a serious problem - it's compounded
when the tissue is found in the presence of water!
It's even more highly destructive. So that's why
I'm gonna stick to my guns and I'm going to
continue to say that I think this preservation is
really pretty much miraculous, I think God has
somehow preserved these things for us to find and
to get out to the general public, and to show that
this tissue was there, it HAS to be young, it
cannot be old at all.
>>You put together a DVD on the research, and put a
video on YouTube as well, please tell us
about this DVD
>>Sure, absolutely, the idino DVD has a lot of
photos of the dig, it has a total description of
the dig, it describes our laboratory and gives an
overview of the kind of instrumentation that we use
in our laboratory, for example a lot of people are
not familiar with a lot of the different type of
light microscopes, so we talk about light
microscopes - dissecting and compound, we talk
about the scanning electron microscope, we talk
about the transmission electron microscope, and we
give a basic understanding about how these things
operate. Cause it's pretty technical, so we try to
explain it in a way that's easy for the average
person on the street to understand, and then we
talk about how the tissues get processed, how they
get put into the microscopes, how the images are
taken, and then there's video of all the different
types of microscopy we do, you can see the
stretchiness, you can see the osteocytes. We
actually focus through a very deep section of
tissue and we start out on the top surface and we
focus all the way through and all the way back out
so you can see all these osteocytes placed in this
thick tissue that we found. And uh, what else? Oh -
it shows my laboratory at California State
University North Ridge, all the microscopes and
equipment that we used there, so it's a fairly
comprehensive treatise on how what did we find,
where did we find it, how did we process it, what
the results were and the equipment that we used on
it in the laboratories that we used today it's an
hour long, it's $25, people can email me and I can
email them the information about it and we mail it
right out for people who order it, but it's very
high quality, it's got video shot through the
microscope, and they can see that stretchy stuff,
in two or three places on the dvd where I show the
stretchiness of these tissues.
>>And people can get a sneak peak of what's on the
DVD from your YouTube video - what are we looking
at here?
>>Essentially what it shows is about a five or six
centimeter long, maybe 3 centimeter wide flat
ribbon of this tissue, this sheet of tissue that we
found deep inside the horn, and I grab it with two
very fine needle forceps and I stretch it. I
stretch it in two different axes and as I let go,
you can see it come back to its original
conformation, so just like a piece of taffy, you
would stretch that, I would stretch it out and let
it go, and it came back to its original form.
And again, I subsequently took that tissue and I
thin sectioned it very thin, and you can see that
it's loaded with all these bone cells, these
osteocytes. So it is in fact the bone soft tissue
from the dinosaur that was stretchy and that we
thin sectioned and showed you the structure inside.
>>So how many bones did you examine searching for
soft tissue before you found these ones?
>>That's a great question - we actually started
with a bunch of bones that had been collected years
and years ago, because we wanted to work out the
protocol, we wanted to understand what the
scientific procedures were so that we would be
ready when we did find a bone which might have soft
tissues in it. And so the first year of the
project, I concentrated on learning how to dissolve
the bones in weak acid, it's called EDTA, so I
learned how to work up the reagents, how to process
the bones, and of course everything was because
there was nothing soft inside of them. So by the
time I got to Glendive, Montana, the Hell Creek
formation, I was ready. My laboratory skills were
ready, and so when we found the horn, again I said
earlier we were very disappointed because we
thought "This is not going to yield anything." And
I was shocked frankly, when I got it back to the
lab and I started taking it apart, dissecting it,
and finding the different pieces of soft tissue in
it, so at that point I was ready to do the
decalcification and remove all the bone mineral and
expose all the internal piping.
It's kind of like - picture a cement slab in like,
your kitchen, you've got a cement slab and you've
got all this piping inside of it, and there's
liquid water and soft stuff that goes through the
piping, but everything else is hard. Well the bone
is like that - it's got all this concrete around it
called bone mineral, and inside are all the blood
vessels - the piping, and so we use this acid to
dissolve away all this concrete and get to the
piping. So that's essentially what we did. Ya.
So now, I can tell you also that we're in the
process of working with a piece of frill - and this
of course is that large piece that came up off the
Triceratops' cranium and covered the back of the
neck, and so that whole piece of frill, we're
starting to look at that now for the same kinds of
tissues and cells. We haven't had any luck yet, and
I think the frill that we're working with was out
of the ground for too long, I think it was out of
the ground for about two years, and so we're
planning on going back to Montana this spring and
see if we can't find some more frill.
I will say that our discovery of the soft tissue in
the horn was a world first - no one had found that
before, and so we're hopeful if we find it in the
frill we'll publish that quickly, and that would
also be a world first. So you know the charge that
creationists are brute beasts that have no
training, they don't understand science, they
certainly don't practice science, they don't work
in scientific positions," "they don't do any
research because they don't understand science,"
and "they've never published anything," all of
those objections are certainly blown away with the
work that we're doing with iDino. And we need to
get the word out that particularly with the
Creation Research Society, about 700 practicing
scientists with advanced degrees, and of course we
have a large membership beyond that but 7 or 800
Phd and Ms advance degree scientists who are
practicing in their field and there's a lot more -
a lot more that are still "in the closet" and don't
want to come out for obvious reasons - we get fired
from positions when we make an impact, and show
that we can do science too, so. It's much easier
for them to just throw us away than it is to debate
us on the world stage.
>>You had some other exciting facets to all of this
research, what can you tell us?
>>Yes, the new research is the frill, however, we
have made some new discoveries with respect to the
triceratops horn. As I mentioned osteocytes are
very easily recognizable cell. And so in the first
paper what we concentrated on were the sheets of
tissue which had the osteocytes embedded in them,
and so this was soft tissue with the osteocytes in
place. Well, what I didn't do which is what Mary
did, is she looked at the solutions after the bones
had been soaked in this acid for a while, she
pipetted out some of those solutions and looked in
there and found free-floating osteocytes, and so
she never found sheets of osteocytes, she found
some pieces of osteocytes sort of connected
together but she didn't find the large sheets that
we found. She did however find the stretchy blood
vessels, we didn't find those. But again, I think
that's because that T. rex femur was just a solid
jacket of hard bone mineral that was protecting all
that soft stuff inside. The Triceratops horn is a
completely different anatomy from a femur - it's a
completely different kind of bone.
Well we're greatly encouraged because we've made
several new discoveries with the Triceratops horn
since the initial publication of the paper, and one
example is that we went back and looked at the
solutions - when you dissolve these things in weak
acid, we hadn't looked at the solutions previously
because we found these entire sheets of tissues!
Loaded with osteocytes, so why bother? But we did
go back and we looked at those, and we found tons
of individual, free-floating osteocytes, and so
we've documented all that, we've taken a lot of
pictures of that, and we've also learned to handle
individual cells and fix them on to slides, cause
that's important if we want to do the histone work,
like Mary did on the T. rex femur. We want to go
look for histones in those osteocytes as well.
So learning how to handle these individual cells,
and fix them on slides so they're not moving
around, that's been tricky but we've mastered that
now, and also we found a tremendous amount of
collagen inside this soft tissue. We did a test
called the picrosirius red stain which stains for
collagen, so we've got a large amount of collagen
and we've taken pictures of that, so we're looking
forward to publishing that, but one interesting
thing is we took a piece of the outer horn and we
shipped it off to a carbon dating lab. And they
tested it out at about 30,000 years plus or minus a
couple of thousand years, which is very
encouraging, particularly since these bones are
supposed to be 65 million years old.
>>Give or take a week
>>Ya, give or take a lifetime. We have now sent a
part of the horn core which is the very densest
part of the inside of the horn back to a dating
lab, and we expect that number to come way down
because it's loaded with collagen. In the presence
of collagen carbon dating goes way down and we
expect to be within 10,000 years or less on those
dates. We've also sent pieces in for DNA analysis,
so since the initial publication we've had some
very exciting discoveries and results and we're
looking forward to publishing the new stuff.
>>Awesome - and we'll look to have you back on the
show when you get more published.
>>Wonderful, I'll be happy to come and give you all
the details when that gets published.
>>Apparently you're working on a children's book
related to this as well?
>> Yes - we are working on a children's book, it's
gonna be illustrated, it's going to be for children
ages maybe 7 and up? Maybe age 99? I dunno - I
still feel like a child, but it's called - well, it
uses and osteocyte we called "Old Stretchy" and so
Old Stretchy is an illustrated bone cell who tells
the story of the triceratops horn throughout the
book, it's gonna be in colour, hard cover, fully
illustrated, with a lot of pictures too of the
actual work that we've done, so we're looking
forward to publishing that and if people want to
email me, I can send them a prepublication order
form and they can get a special price if they order
it before we publish it, so, if you want to post
that, we can do that.
>>Well Mark this has been absolutely fascinating -
thank you so much for coming on the show, I know
the viewers will really appreciate this, so from
them and myself, thank you.
>>Thank you and my pleasure - we'll do it again
when you're ready!
>>You can contact Mark for more information about
his book and the iDino project DVD via email:
micromark@juno.com Research does cost a tremendous
amount of money, but you can see the fruit research
bears, and I can testify that Creation Research
Society is very prudent with their funds and has
accomplished an awful lot with extremely little. I
know they would appreciate your financial support
for the iDino project as well as many other
research projects they fund, and you can support
them at CreationResearch.org
This interview was edited for television, but you
can catch the entire fascinating interview on our
YouTube channel - just head on over to
GenesisWeek.com and you can find it there. Stick
around, we'll be right back in one minute!