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Happy? Things that make me happy are when I don't have to look at the clock. Eating good food really makes me happy.
Just being here really. Life is good isn't it? Getting what you want.
Never thought about it. Diamonds.
He makes me happy. The sunshine, music, being outdoors and being healthy.
I like to party, I like to go out. I guess money also makes you happy.
Something that's not relying on money. Your friends, dancing. My cat. My nephew. A lie in.
My wife makes me really happy. And drinking.
Watching Liverpool beating Man-United.
Whatever really happens.
More to life..hmm.
ah, there can't be more to life.
There has to be, because I'm not happy at the moment.
The meaning of life...I often wonder if there is. I dont' think there's more to life.
I'd like to think there is though. I don't know really.
You don't know everything that goes on in life, do you? So...YES. i do think there is more to life than this. I don't know really.
I was hiding in the corner and
trying to imagine what it was like
if this was my first night and I remember mine. I left after
seven minutes
I was assaulted by these kind of super white teeth
and really obnoxiously friendly people and I didn't trust any of it.
I thought that it was was
I definitely didn't eat the food.
I was sure it was drugged.
This was a long time ago
and uh...
After a few minutes I left and went to the pub. There was a pub around the back that is gone now, but it was there at the time. Some friends were there
and I said that I was doing some kind of Christian course thing
So they asked me what it was like. I said it was alright and they said
did they have guitars?
and I said, "yeah". They said that's cult.
and uh... and uh... and I thought yeah
I thought it dodged.
and i didn't come back for a long time and
the *** that I am, I did come back in the end and I persevered.
and i found it very difficult the group I was in I found very awkward
and I clung to my seat
and stayed longer than I did the first time and here I am
uh... strange to be here with the microphone talking because actually to be truthful with you
I'm going to tell you a bit about my life and
journey, if you'd like.
I was born a cynic. I was born with a genetic
predisposition
and cynicism and I at age three
resented having to say grace, my parents were aethists
but we did have to say grace, which was quite weird in retrospect
and um
we thought it was the right thing to do
we had a farm
we ought to thank God for the eggs and those things.
I just thought of God on that basis, even at the age of four
like an obstacle to food
well you know if he was a delayer of gratification
and and uh...
and I hated it. All through life I hated
religion. I thought it was a dangerous meander into the
immaterial, into the unknown.
I thought material was good
drifting away was bad.
and um...
I thought it had two extremes. Particularly Christianity I enjoyed mocking it
when I was at school i particularly enjoyed mocking anyone who believed in anything
particularly
Christianity
and I thought it was one of two: extraordinarily dull or completely
insane
and uh... and uh... I went to doctor and he said
in a doctor sort of diagnosis he said I was basically insane
I said I wanted a second opinion he said
ok, you're also dull
and it's this idea of being two things at once
I really, really, really had a hard time with it
and
Particularly one of my main loathings about religion was speakers and
microphones
the irony of that
and um... i resented them and if they're on telly I loathe it. I loathe the
whole thing
I heard about a little girl who was in a church and she was probably sitting
where you are
and and she was looking at the preacher who is
caught in a microphone, on this wire
and she was staring at him and she said, when he gets loose, she said to to her mum
when he gets loose,
is he going to hurt us?
and I totally understand that feeling of not only boredom but fear
and my main kind of criticism was
why create
if your religion which is clearly man-made and out of a neurotic
response to existence, why create
more rules to fail. Surely life is
kind of hard enough you know
and if you maybe just try to be kind
but why have all these religious ideals and ideas
Stephen Frye said
What else is a halo but one more thing to keep clean?
and I really understand that. I just want to say why
why are you doing this
and if the world would get on and love each other, surely we'd be
better off
and um
also I supposed if I'm going to be really truthful
that religion was also essentially very controlling
it would assert control over people and it is quite oppressive
and I clearly was coming from a positive
stable...I was trying to describe to you how abjectly against it I was
and um... I heard about a boy in York. I come from the north
and heard about a farmer, no not a farmer...in this school assembly
a boy called Chapman
He was always at the back and hated everything to do with assemblies and the headmaster always had this
big red bible
and Chapman was gossiping right at the back and the headmaster just stopped
the service and said "Chapman!"
He held up the book and said
What would you Chapman if Jesus Christ came in through this door, that door right now?
and he said "Sir, I'd hold that big red book of yours and say
Jesus Christ
this is your life
Brilliant, great line.
Wish I could have had the balls to say that
I definitely was disruptive
and uh... as he could see them I thought it was all
taken actually from very moral high ground but didn't like being judged at all
I felt that all religion was this platform from which to view humanity
and I resent it
and
and uh... a friend of mine has a son called Monty and they were at the back of a church
recently
and Monty's four and was on his dad's knee and the preacher was
giving prayers and he said this
Lord, I'm sorry for what I've done wrong and uh... and Monty said to his dad
What's he done wrong?
and he said well, we've all done things wrong. That's the deal, we all just have to pray with him you know?
and he went "alright."
and then he got off his dad and he went along the side of the church to the loo
he went into the loo.
and came back again, he's only four
and to face, like a huge number of people who are standing in silence
and Monty just looked at them and said
you naughty, naughty, naughty, naughty, naughty people
he really did (laughs)
and sort of strutted off
and I always loved that it was definitely how my
perception was
if ever I went to church or any religious event
I always was made to feel really guilty. LIke there is someone saying "You naughty, naughty, naughty.."
just like Monty
and uh...
and so I guess most of my life, up till
sort of twenty, I resisted it and knocked it
and Phil Yancy, you ought to read a really good book. A guy called Phil Yancy
wrote a book called "What's Amazing About Grace?"
You have the song Amazing Grace and he's saying so what is so amazing about it
and uh... the first paragraph is a really sort of
face slapper because basically he describes a time - he's a pastor and writer
very intelligent and he's always
relentlessly looking under things. He's not very good at taking things
on face value, has to go around the back
and uh...
he was faced by this woman you came to see him and she
was a *** and she's been on *** for half her life
and she came to see him for some help
and he said to her
but he couldn't really think what to say but said have you ever though about going
to the church for some help
and he says he'll never forget the look of complete naive shock on her face
and she just said
church?
Why would I want to go there? I feel bad enough about myself already.
and I remember when I read that I thought, you know that's
that's a very common response. If you're here and if you've ever felt judged
by Christians or Christianity or a church, I'm here to say actually
sorry
and that has nothing whatsoever to do with this faith at all. Nothing.
that's my discovery. It's taken me a long time to discovery this. That actually
I'm usually
I'm wrong about a lot things but I've never been more wrong about something as this
I did see it as a tribe of morally superior people who made me feel bad, I now see it as actually
the people I have who are now friends in my life, who are
jewels in my life, it's taken a long time
and I would say
You know, atheism really fascinates me and in many ways
it still does, I enjoy reading Christopher Hitchens and Dawkins and people like that. I like it.
I think these things are kind of searching for truth actually
What I would say about it was that it didn't really feed me.
You go to atheism, I read it
on the basis of I wanted to know the truth, but also some kind of spiritual
quest if you'd like, and I leave it feeling empty.
And then again religion, you know Ella Wheeler Wilcox at this
She said that there are so many gods and so many creeds, and so many paths that wind and wind
but that being kind is all this sad world needs.
My mum has always said just be kind.
uh... and
I'd have agreed in in essence.
but I guess we all have catalysts that trigger or affect a change how ever small in us.
One of the big things, my main kind of
statement for atheism was suffering. I would always say, you know,
you're all bleeding mad on anything, just look at the basis of suffering on this planet. Just look.
and I remember going and painting for quite a long time in Southern Africa.
And I stayed in a mud hut, they hadn't really seen a white person before.
One thing that struck me most about them was that I had never seen suffering like it.
I don't know if you've ever been to a place where suffering is that intense
and uh...
you know, there's AIDS and poverty and all that kind of stuff, and malaria.
and I got to know a few people really well and one of them was a woman.
She lost her son to AIDS, and yet the paradox with her was
that she was completely calm
and had sort of inner strength that I've never really ever come across before.
And she annoyed me actually that she can she talked about Jesus and it did annoy me.
I sort of try to challenge it and I said well, clearly you haven't really read
I was a bit arrogant actually, if I think about it
and you know I talked about the bible and how it's just a mesh of
poetry and history and it's thousands of years writing all jammed into, you know
and uh...
we have these debates and and one of the things she said to me that I'll never forget
She said that I haven't been out of this village before, but I have a feeling that you come
you come from a country that has a lot.
And she said
"But what really feeds you there?"
and uh... and I said
"What do you mean?" She said, "Well, how
are you fed spiritually?"
And I said,
"Media, football,
actually. I just thought of things that, sort of,
you know, things. You know, I was floundered around trying to find an answer that
would satisfy her and I couldn't really find one.
And I did think of religioin but I didn't think that was particularly spiritual.
So I didn't really say much
and she said, "Well maybe you should think about that."
...And I went home and I did start thinking
because they moved me a lot. They had nothing and yet they were richer than probably I will ever be.
I was in my studio, my little studio painting away, and the radio was on and there was
a woman interviewing Jack Higgins, who is very successful crime writer and she said, "You
know what do you wish-- the last questions was --
what do you wish you'd known at eighteen?
If you could have known something
at that age so you could tell yourself that now?" And he said, "I'd probably say,
when you get to tthe top, there's notihng there. It's empty."
And there was a huge pause and she said, "Really?"
He said, "Yeah, it's empty.
I wish I'd known that."
This is one of those moments where you just stop.
I remember this woman in southern africa and I thought about it
a lot.
And thought
maybe his ladder is up the wrong wall.
And what is the wall we need to put it against where it isn't empty when you get to there?
Which is that?
And I have mates, a lot of my friends are artists and
we're all sort of
interesting in the way we live.
People get up to all kinds of things.
And we're all searching.
And in our discussions sometimes--we'll always end up on--
you know, "What is there spiritually? Is there a transcendence?" and
And, you know
religion is always kind of this hideous idea of of control. We didn't
want it.
But I remember Hitchens
--I love reading him. I think he'sa fantastic, brilliant mind. And he says this:
"Religion has run out of justifications.
Thanks for the telescope and the microscope, that no longer offers an
explanation of anything important."
I remember reading that and thinking, "Well I would have agreed with that
except will have this question of why then--for in spite of
the telescope and the microscope, in spite of all these
incredible advancements that are admirable--
Why does the human being still thirst for transcendence?
Why do billions of people still search for what they might call God?
What is that?
And, you know, "Freud said that religion is an illusion but it falls within
our instinctual desires." My question is why.
What is that? I mean, I know we have some obscure instinctual desires but this is
universal. Why?
And that was always my questions. They've always been Why.
I mean I was the problem child at school. I would always ask "Why are we doing any of this?"
Science, I think it's fantastic, but it seems to answer very different questions. Sort of
What rather than Why.
I was very hungover one morning
and I was lying in bed and I heard these church bells going. It was quite a while ago. And I thought,
Well I'll go.
You konw, just to see.
And I wandered down the back. And there were three lovely
old lady sitting in the pew.
And then another sea of pews empty. Then, I sat right at the back.
I picked up this -- I couldn't really hear the talk very well.They didn't
really have trendy microphones or anything.
There was a book out and I opened it. It was the one that looked
most interesting. It had a picture of
a pattern on the front.
And I went to the New Testament bit, which is what it said and
I happened to read this line
from the book of John. And I read it about eight times. It just said,
"Jesus said, I've come to give you life."
And I read it again and I read it again.
And it also said, "The thief comes to steal, kill
and destroy, but I've come to give you life" (John 10:10).
And I thought, "Well who is the theif and who are you to say such things?"
Who are you?
I made this slow realization that Christianity is spiritual
and I never thought it was. l thought it was legal. I thought it
was moral. I thought it was unbelievably dull
and populated by people who were just legalists
who argued about what *** orientation you should or shouldn't have.
And yet here was something about a spiritual life.
It sort of made me really think. And I thought about the women in Africa again.
I made this slow journey and I am very cynical
it's taken me years.
But I've got to the point now where I would say this is this is the greatest
cover-up in the cosmos.
It's one of the most beautiful things I've ever come across and yet it's a
fantasticly disguise
by us who do a lousy job
at representative it. And for that I'm truly sorry.
I was in Romania
a few years ago and
we were
doing stuff with some teenagers, just camping stuff
and teachig them games, sports, and stuff. And we're English and we were promised
the food was
uh... if you're Romain here I apologize but I find the food very... tricky.
I think English food is pretty bad, but Romanian food is also the same bracket.
We were promised tuna and I remember because I love tuna and we were promised a tin of tuna
And the English people particularly would be very impressed with this.
And we did get the tin.
And I've still got it. Here's the tin. What htit me most about the tin
was the fact that the the packaging really let the tuna down.
Like, I didn't want to eat the tuna! Here's a picture of the tin.
It just says crap.
And I read it and I just sort of laughed. I said "Does anyone want to eat this?"
So we did eat it, but it took a while.
I got an extra tin. I starting chatting to people saying, "This is really odd, isn't it?"
Because it reminds me of life in many ways. You think
something's horrible and then you actually discover that it isn't.
To my mind is a good metaphor to Christianity.
And they said "Really?"
And I said, "Well, yeah." They said, "You're a religious freak."
And I said, "Well no because it
does on the outside look crap."
I was never drawn to it. It didn't look appealing and yet
when you open the tin
there's something in it that's more delicious than tuna.
That's where the analogy slightly fails.
I would say that it took me a long time to open the tin.
But it's always worth it. I would also say that I'm not there because I'm on
some of the microphone speaking.
I'm so far from
really being there. It's a long journey, a fantastic one
but long.
I would say it was a bit like ships passing in the night for me.
A Christian statement they made a I would miss it
and misread it
and reject it.
I heard about a Texan was on holiday in Devon
and he approached the farmer and he said "Is this your farm?" And the farmer said "Yup."
And the Texan said "Well how big is it?"
And the farmer said,
" well it goes from that tree to that tree to that tree to my
house over there in the corner." And the Texan said, "Oh man...
where I come from on my farm I get in my car in the morning and I drive until the sun sets and I'm still
on my own land."
And the farmer said, "Yep I used to have a car like that once."
This is my favorite joke that I have to somehow
tenuously get it in there because
I think it basically summarizes
a statement being made and then completely missed. This is me with Christianity for most of my
first 20, 20-something years. I just sort of missed it.
I've sat in exhibition once... You know
in your group's today. I do find groups difficult but if you
cling to your seat and perservere, you will somehow
enjoy them. And you can say what you want and no questions are wrong, only unasked questions
are wrong. So ask anythng.
Well... within reason.
Well there are some questions for... I digress...
Anyway the point is that I sat next to a bishop at a wedding.
I guess when you meet a bishop for a time you think "I've got someone -- captive
audience -- I'm going to harangue him, harass him and ask him
really difficult questions like you can in your groups.
And so there he was and we wer drinking.
He was in purple and had very shiny smiley face. So I said to him, "Okay...
here's the deal. Why...
And i just *railed him with questions* about Christianity,
from the Cleaky club to
you know, I can't even remember what I said but it was it was pretty, you know.
Even though I was on this journey I was still angry.
and I said how couldn't normal people
possibly have a faith with all this kind of religious posturing going on?
Where is the, sort of,
earthy normality in all of this?
And he was amazing. He just
listened and he said "Yeah, okay."
So he told me this joke first. He said,
"Two bishops were discussing the moral decline in Britain.
One said to the other, 'I didn't sleep with my wife before I was married. Did you?'
And the other bishop said
'Oh, I don't know. What was maiden name?'
*laughs*
I just thought for a bishop to ask such a question was unique to me.
I mean to tell a joke.
He then tried to answer my question and he just said this monologue
like
already wrote down on a napkin. This is a seminal moment in life and I
knew I wouldn't forget it.
He said vaguely,
"Charlie, none of us is perfect
but I believe that we're perfectly loved.
It's the only reason why I agreed to wear these silly purple clothes.
We are human, we make mistakes. That is our condition.
It's really messy.
But I do believe that we're loved and forgiven if we desire it and this is
called the grace of God, Charlie.
Jesus is all about grace and forgiveness and love
and that is how change comes not through guilt.
And yes there are moral implications,
decisions we need to make, but it's a gentle journey.
Primarily a quiet, little relationship. I not an 'in' club
or 'out' club
or an exclusive thing at all. It's really all about love because that is who God
is.
That was kind of what he said. And I just sort of lit a cigarette and stared at him
and had some more wine. And he left and had a dance. It was outstanding.
And he left me sitting at the table rethinking about
the whole thing. And it reminded me slightly about what they said in Africa but in a
different way,
which is this thing about grace and acceptance and love.
And I suppose it reminded me of an onion --Christianity --
that you can strip it away, strip it away, and the core of it.
You've got to go through all kinds of things to get through it, like: resentment, institutionalized religion,
the Bible's confusing... and you pull it apart
and the very core of it, right in the middle
is love. That's it.
And acceptance.
And when you discover that...
And I think it's brilliant to just wake up every morning took
thirty seconds a day everyone go *deep breath*
I'm loved.
I know I'm loved despite everything.
It would be a very different country.
But we don't know it and this is the journey. It's why I'm obsessed with Alpha, it's why I do because
It's because I genuinely believe that's the truth.
But it's a hard journey.
And I have so many layers. I'm basically very closed, very tied down.
And my friends that night at that wedding --
I went to them and I said, "I just had this great chat with this bishop." You know, and I got enthusiastic about it.
They said to me "Charlie, Charlie, Charlie...
Stop your stupid little religious games.
Just be kind.
Morality is enough,
morality is it.
Just fight for that."
I remember reading
C.S. Lewis -- If you want to read a great book Mere Christianity, all his stuff, great mind --
and he said this, "Christianity will teach you,
in fact, that you cannot be good, not for 24 hours,
not on your own moral efforts.
Then it will teach you that even if you were
you still wouldn't have achieved the purpose for which you are made.
Mere morality is not the end of life. You're made for something quite different
from that."
And I remember reading that and thinking something beyond him read that
we have our I'm quite good run by the whatever but
it's beyond that
and i always thought that was about rules the rules will not looking
making judgments are actually one of them
and pam
and the problem with that is is that here i am rumbling away and candy said
that's a look and he said
I'd like your price
I don't like to christians and nothing like a price
it was an incentive not to sentencing
and and and quit and I tend to get leasing
is that the problem we have a problem that the person to be we fall into the
them how to speak
possibly book without question in my mind
because if you met the lift and just kind of suffocating grateful person
join us to be with
fascinating
but impossible to replicate
which is why we do about joe
so that's where this and dostoevsky the rights of arson right at the end of the
minute
labor camp for years to say
the meeting and greeting
amigo dot he's interviewed about his life and he just spoke of jesus and said
I believe there is no one left me a
more sympathetic in christ
now in his own like a man of the could be anyone else like him
and I think he's he's right but it's you know need helen often used you you do
you agree to media concessions but the real number is
is this person and what the love of god will use
announcement in the united states
like I was on my way this morning to morning off and then the helicopter
crash and I thought mclaughlin
for a long time and I thought about pain and suffering
questions foreign
that satisfied to five suffering in spite of it all and what we do to each
other
and it six children justice life we have
the core of it but in recent intensity to slow
and answer so many questions
so many I still have meant but it does not spread
so I can see
and tim one of my favorite things about jesus institute of the prodigal son
and I'm not painted it obsessively may bronze is over it
and the evening and I think the reason why I love it so much just because
Jesus is always suck always sitting but the wrong people the once he didn't have
religious after at the ones who were at the outcome swansea properties the f_
word every of the world
there would be unlikely once that he was with them
and as always challenged
for being with the wrong people
and so he told the story and tell the story classical instrument of the
prodigal son was really about the local the nature of cult
who runs the
anyone he's speaking
turns
towards him
and embraces them so I'd say to you again the next time you see someone
embracing
it's a hug
that's the heart face
and so a few photos otherwise in a tickets again taking the years together
but it's the middle of it
and I have felt in the context of a mass it fit like a lot of the n_
and it's quite neat
you know what I know it's get an easier when its fuel economy and a half months
and
and anyway back to me summarizes have are used to see
the repertoire for representatives in my fifties you get
if he can remember us perfectly and if you're not into it
he'll get you might get this fixative resounded
you might get back to some divine perspective so you know you might get
some of the trees and somebody amazingly
devout people he would just get it assoc
nothing kept
from lee bailey's is
on a good day between behind me on than expected
a lot of cancer
whether the consequences of that will from from what I've discovered that mr
anis
is this is the consequence of mean this is
but it's about
use a person
accepted patsick units it takes a long time scattered about some attempt to
conclude that
and the reason why it that it's possible from broad institute this
is the process behind
which is the critical to a propitious time to time yeah
is nothing you can determine this
I was so you have to climb as hell
an impressive people didn't get that
not possible
tx greatest gift
but it takes him again I keep saying it's it's a hard lessons learned at this
time
and cynical
uh... anthony there but I would say that you know them
but it looks
you would think it would not know it looks very artist judges of the building
sword
every sort of core tell us about in only looking at it
and i was an alpha conference whatever that is a few years ago and i was
uh... in america new york
and I think you know that my job was to obtain the bigger picture and he was
doing the same my paper and he's on his own
and it's got to cut its of america neocons here
and a city that you can you just don't get assuming some percussion
albino sam roberts testing or satellite so I went off and I went to school
shelton went to fulfill
and modulus law and disorder
and anyway we were looking for two things and I found I'll shoot
identifying with this
stretches
It's a cute little so let's look at the moment
and and and so I think I came and I can tell you is that you know and I
so I think that was a friday afternoon suspect for friday through sunday
serve on the stage for to the side concern is that
justin mischief and then when the flow once time adjustments really special
analysts multi you know and and I thought you student at the party and the
conferences from committing to
sheets that are higher than myself sick separately
acid selling tonight as she said something to slick a huge thank you
and since she said no rearming the worship with
synchro
an ethical recharge
and her friend
and then send them
I've got to go you know so thought I was enough to deal with and she just
uh sorry I just have one question
switzerland schism
were you on stage
the whole week
bana
analysis always had a real deniability so it's worth
with a banana
standing there.
And I'm just going on and on every song. Shakes his banana.
She couldn't hear anything. She couldn't hear the percussion. It wasn't even miked.
She just saw this guy
and clearly she thought, that's alright.
Christians are weird. That's the deal.
They shake bananas
and do weird things. And you've got to expect that. They're religious.
That's the way they are.
And I think that probably is true.
It is odd. But again, like the onion, if you strip it away and get
rid of all the weirdness and get rid of all
the subtext, the exterior.
Again, what you get in the middle is gentle.
Gentle kindness and love
and total acceptance. Really.
Really. And that's why I think that churches
could be the most beautiful thing.
Because it would just be a community of
people being accepted and working through that stuff and being loved
while they're doing it.
And that's the dream.
One of my last stories on that issue is: when I was
at school, the only sermon I ever remembered is one minute long.
Sorry about that.
And it was this bishop, Ugandan bishop, who came.
And he arrived and it was seven hundred boys,
who were the most cynical. And chapel we hated it. I mean, my main job was to fart
between prayers. That was what I did.
And he came in and
he brought in some sticks, which I've prepared earlier
And he said this.
He held up a stick
He said, "One stick will break"
and he snapped on his head.
And then he went,
he held this up and said
"Many sticks...
(I don't really want to mess my hair up actually)
He said, "Many sticks will never be broken." And he held it up and he said,
"This is my church"
and he said, "The string around my church is the love of Jesus.
It will never break.
Do you have this?"
And then he put it down
and walked out.
Only time that chapel school assembly had ever been completely silent.
And we slowly walked out and said, "No, we don't have that. We don't have that.
Maybe it only happens in Africa. Maybe."
I would say that's not true. It's for us everywhere regardless.
And it's still a recession, which is why I'm going to tap my work, but I have
this painting here.
It's the last thing
I'll show you and then I'll shut up, and you can have coffee and everything.
This has two holes. Do we have an image--Andy can we get a close-up?
These are real holes in the chest.
And I did it when I was thinking about everything.
I did it a long time ago but the whole in in the back of the...
It's actually shameful. It's meant to be a pearl.
It's fallen out in the car.
But there was a pearl.
There was!
In the picture you can see it. There's a little
pearl at the back of the coloured one.
And I'd say that that's like faith. Jesus can be right in the
recesses of your heart.
But gently he changes the colour of everything and brings everything into a new perspective.
It's taken a long time to realize that, but it's tiny.
And without it, I would say that's kind of how I felt for most of my atheistic perspective.
It was hard in sight seem too but it was colourless.
And I'm not saying atheism is colourless actually, because in many ways
you have everything to look at in the beauty of cosmos but within me it was
colourless.
It felt very, kind of, monotone.
There's something about faith that brings real richness of life and colour and love.
And, dare I say it, joy in spite of things,
in spite of things. Cause this life is tough.
I think I've really rambled on too long. But I would just say really stay
and enjoy this course and say what you want and drink your coffee and
be free.
I'll shut up. Thanks for listening.