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--> HELLO AND WELCOME TO
PRAIRIE PULSE.
COMING UP LATER ON PRAIRIE
PULSE WE'LL EXPLORE THE
ONGOING MYSTERY SURROUNDING THE
KENSINGTON RUNESTONE HOUSED IN
ALEXANDRIA, MINNESOTA, BUT FIRST
WE HAVE JOINING US WEST FARGO
MAYOR RICH MATTERN, THANK YOU
FOR JOINING US.
--> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
--> TELL US A LITTLE ABOUT
YOURSELF AND YOUR BACKGROUND.
--> I'M ORIGINALLY FROM THE
HOMETOWN OF LAWRENCE WELK,
GRADUATED FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF
NORTH DAKOTA WITH A JOURNALISM
DID AGJOURNALISMDEGREE AND DID K
AT THE UNIVERSITY.
I HAVE A COUPLE OF GREAT GIRLS
AND LOVELY WIFE, BEEN MARRIED 26
YEARS.
--> OTHER THAN BEING ELECTED,
WHAT MADE YOU DECIDE TO RUN FOR
THE WEST FARGO MAYOR?
--> I'VE ALWAYS HAD AN INTEREST
IN POLITICS, EVEN AS A KID I
WOULD READ EVERYTHING I COULD
ABOUT POLITICS.
AFTER GRADUATING I HAD A RADIO
JOB AND THEN TV JOB IN BISMARK,
I HAD A CHANCE TO COVER
LEGISLATURE AND THEN MOVED TO
TELEVISION OVER HERE.
AFTER I LEFT TELEVISION I
DECIDED THIS IS SOMETHING I
WOULD LIKE TO TRY, I CAME HOME
ONE NIGHT AND TOLD MY WIFE I
WOULD REALLY LIKE TO RUN FOR THE
WEST FARGO CITY COMMISSION,
EXPECTING HER TO DROP HER JAW
AND SAY ARE YOU NUTS?
SHE SAID I WILL SUPPORT YOU AND
WORK TOGETHER ON A CAMPAIGN.
I STARTED AS A WEST FARGO CITY
COMMISSIONER AND AFTER FOUR
YEARS, THEN THE MAYOR DECIDED
NOT TO RUN AND ENCOURAGED ME TO
RUN AND I'M JUST STARTING MY
THIRD TERM.
--> SO, YOU JUST RECENTLY WERE
ELECTED.
--> LAST YEAR.
--> THAT MEANS YOU'VE BEEN MAYOR
HOW LONG?
--> GOING INTO MY NINTH YEAR.
--> WHAT ARE SOME OF THE BIGGEST
CHALLENGES YOU SEAT THE CITY
FACING AS YOU GO INTO THIS NEW
TERM.
-->
--> ONE OF THE BIGGEST CHALLENGES
AND IT'S A GOOD CHALLENGE AND I
LOVE THAT CHALLENGE IS OUR
GROWTH, WE'VE HAD TREMENDOUS
GROWTH.
IN THE YEAR 200 OUR POPULATION
WAS 14,900, WE'RE PREDICTING
WHEN THE NEW CENSUS FIGURES COME
OUT WE'LL BE A LITTLE OVER
26,000, THAT'S TREMENDOUS GROWTH
IN A TEN YEAR PERIOD.
WITH THAT COMES INFRASTRUCTURE
GROWTH, WE'VE HAD TO GEAR UP
WITH STAFF, THOSE TO ME ARE A
POSITIVE CHALLENGE, I KNOW THERE
ARE MANY CITIES AROUND THE
COUNTRY WOULD WELCOME THAT KIND
OF CHALLENGE RATHER THAN
IMPLODING, WE'RE EXPLODING.
--> HOPEFULLY WE'LL GET TO THAT.
HOW MUCH TIME DOES IT TAKE?
--> IT TAKES DIFFERENT TIES, IN
THE FALL AND SPRING I SEEM TO BE
AT MY BUSIEST.
IN THE SUMMERTIME WHEN EVERYBODY
LEAVES TOWN IT SLOWS DOWN A
LITTLE BIT AND I WELCOME THAT.
THERE IS NO FULL-TIME MAYOR IN
NORTH DAKOTA, YOU HAVE TO
BALANCE, THAT'S WHY WE HAVE A
CITY ADMINISTRATOR AND STAFF,
YOU SET POLICY, I DON'T GET
INVOLVED IN THE DAY-TO-DAY
OPERATIONS BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW
HOW TO SET A SANITATION ROUTE OR
WOULD I WANT TO KNOW HOW, BUT
WHEN IT COMES TO WE HAVE TO
INCREASE THE RATES, THEN I NEED
TO GET INVOLVED AND SAY WHY AND
EXPLAIN TO THE PUBLIC HERE IS
WHY WE HAVE TO DO THAT.
--> YOU TALKED A LOT ABOUT YOUR
GROWTH AND I GUESS YOU -- WE'VE
SEEN VOTERS REJECT THE PLANS FOR
A NEW SCHOOL, START WITH THAT,
SCHOOL OVERCROWDING, HOW WILL
YOU DEAL WITH THAT?
--> THAT IS A BIG ISSUE, TWO BOND
ISSUES HAVE BEEN REJECTED.
WE NOW HAVE A NEW SUPERINTENDENT
AND I THINK HE HIT THE GROUND
RUNNING AND HE IS GOING TO,
SCHOOL DISTRICT AND SCHOOL BOARD
ARE GOING TO HAVE TO EXPLAIN
REALLY I THINK IN A BETTER WAY
OF WHY IT'S NECESSARY AND HERE
IS WHAT WE WANT TO BUILD, AND I
HAVE A POSITIVE FEELING WITH THE
NEW SCHOOL ADMINISTRATION THAT
THE NEXT VOTE WILL BE A POSITIVE
ONE.
--> NOW, CAN YOU REALLY PINPOINT
WHY WEST FARGO IS GROWING SO
RAPIDLY AND WHY PEOPLE WANT TO
LIVE THERE?
--> ONE OF THE BIG REASONS OF
COURSE IS OUR DIVERSION, IT'S
WORTH OUR WEIGHT IN GOAL, IT WAS
A 20 YEAR PROCESS TO GET IT
BUILT, 1993 OR ''94 IS WHEN IT
WENT IN OPERATION, THEN WE HAD
THE 1997 FLOOD IN FARGO, THAT'S
WHEN WE SAW THE CURVE START TO
RISE IN HOUSING WHEN PEOPLE
REALIZED THAT, HEY, THEY HAVE A
DIVERSION OVER THERE AND
FLOODING IS NOT AN ISSUE EXCEPT
FOR OCCASIONAL STREET FOODING
AND THOSE KIND OF THINGS SO THAT
HAS REALLY BEEN A POSITIVE FOR
US.
WE'VE GONE OUT OF OUR WAY AND WE
REALLY TRIED HARD TO WORK WITH
DEVELOPERS.
--> CAN YOU TALK A LITTLE ABOUT
THE BUSINESS CLIMATE IN WEST
FARGO?
--> WELL, THAT'S ALWAYS A
CHALLENGE, YOU WANT TO HAVE A
CERTAIN RATIO OF BUSINESS TO
HOMES, AND WE'VE GROWN SO MUCH
IN OUR HOMES THAT THAT RATIO IS
STILL AT AN IMBALANCE, BUT --
NOW WE HAVE JUST HOPED A NEW
INTERCHANGE, NINTH STREET
INTERCHANGE, ACROSS FROM THE
URBAN PLAINS CENTER AND SANFORD
OWNS LAND ON THE FARGO SIDE AND
WE HOPE THEY START BUILDING
TOMORROW SO WE HAVE A CORRIDOR
THERE THAT IS JUST RIGHT FOR
RETAIL DEVELOPMENT, BUT ON THE
OTHER HAND, THE BIG BOX PEOPLE
IN ST. LOUIS, BECAUSE OF THE
NATIONAL ECONOMY, ARE REALLY
RIGHT NOW IN A PAUSE MODE BUT I
THINK THAT WILL TURN AROUND, WE
ARE IN NEGOTIATIONS WITH SEVERAL
COMPANIES AND HOPEFULLY
SOMETHING WILL BREAK SOON, BUT
WE HAVE TREMENDOUS OPPORTUNITIES
FOR SOME RETAIL DEVELOPMENT.
--> WITH THAT, HOW MUCH LAB IS
AVAILABLE, I GUESS -- LET ME
BACK UP A LITTLE BIT, SUCH A BIG
HOUSING GROWTH, OBVIOUSLY WITH
THE POPULATION YOU WOULD HAVE.
WHERE ARE YOU EXPANDING?
I KNOW SOUTH OF I-94 IS GROWING
BY LEANS AND BOUNDS.
--> MOST OF IT IS THE OPEN LAND
IS SOUTH OF THE INTERSTATE,
THERE IS SOME TO THE NORTH, BUT
PREDICTIONS ARE THE LAND THAT WE
HAVE AVAILABLE NOW, WE HAVE
ABOUT 26,000, IF WE WERE TO
DEVELOP AND FILL ALL THE LAND
THAT WE HAVE AVAILABLE RIGHT NOW
OUR POPULATION WOULD BE
SOMEWHERE AROUND 42 TO 45
THOUSAND, SO WE HAVE A LOT OF
LAND, WE CAN ALMOST DOUBLE OUR
SIZE WITH WHAT WE HAVE AVAILABLE
RIGHT NOW AND THAT IS NOT
COUNTING WHAT MAY HAPPEN IN THE
FUTURE.
--> EARLIER YOU TALKED ABOUT THE
LAND AVAILABLE NOW BUT THERE ARE
SOME ISSUES I GUESS WITH THE
CITY OF FARGO WITH THE LAND
EXPANSION, WHO CONTROLS WHAT
SECTIONS OF LAND?
--> THAT ANNEXATION BATTLE TOOK
PLACE A NUMBER OF YEARS AGO AND
I THINK WE HAVE THAT ALL SETTLED
NOW, SO I'M REALLY NOT CONCERNED
ABOUT THAT AS MUCH.
IF WE WERE -- THERE IS TALK OF
THE FARGO DIVERSION,
FARGO-MOORHEAD DIVERSION, ONE OF
THE ISSUES IS WHERE WOULD THAT
DIVERSION GO.
RIGHT NOW ON THE WEST SIDE OF
OUR CHEYENNE DIVERSION IT'S
LOWER, WATER RUNS THAT WAY
SOMETIMES, THAT'S NOT EASILY
DEVELOPED BUT IF THEY WOULD PUT
THAT DIVERSION, IF IT END UP A
MILE OR TWO WEST OF OUR
DIVERSION, THAT LAND BETWEEN
WOULD THEN BECOME FOR OUR
GRANDCHILDREN AND THEIR CHILDREN
THE LAND THAT COULD BE DEVELOPED
FOR THE CITY OF WEST FARGO, SO
THAT DIVERSION, WHERE IT IS
LOCATED IS VERY IMPORTANT TO THE
CITY OF WEST FARGO.
--> NOW, YOU TALKED ABOUT THE
SAME SYSTEM, 14,000 TO 26,000,
MOST CITIES I GUESS USUALLY FIND
A PLATEAU, DO YOU STILL SEE IT
GROWING SIGNIFICANTLY OR ARE YOU
GOING TO PLATEAU SOMEWHERE?
--> IT HARD TO SUSTAIN THE GROWTH
WE DID, IT WAS A TIME WHERE IT
WAS JUST -- IT HAS STABLIZED,
BUT FROM WHAT WE ARE SEEING
BECAUSE OF THE ECONOMY AND SOME
RELUCTANCE EVEN KNOW NORTH
DAKOTA ECONOMY HAS BEEN GOOD,
THERE'S RELUCTANCE ON HOME
BUILDERS, IT'S SLOWED DOWN BUT
WE HAVE SEEN PLANS COME IN FOR
NEXT YEAR, I HAVE BEEN
SURPRISED, I THINK IN THE NEXT
COUPLE YEARS WE WILL SEE SOME
MORE REALLY GOOD GROWTH IN THE
CITY OF WEST FARGO.
--> HOW ARE THE PROPERTY TAXES IN
WEST FARGO?
--> THEY ARE COMPARABLE -- LET ME
BACK UP.
EVERYBODY THINKS THEY PAY TOO
MANY TAXES INCLUDING THE MAYOR.
IT'S BALANCING PROVIDING
SERVICES AND THAT PROPERTY TAX.
FOR US IT'S IMPORTANT WE
INCREASE OUR RETAIL BASE BECAUSE
OF THAT SALES TAX THAT COMES IN
FROM THE RETAIL BASE.
WE USE SOME OF THE MONEY TO HELP
WITHIN FROM A STRUCTURE COSTS,
SO THAT IS WHY IT IS REALLY
IMPORTANT TO ME TO BUILD THAT
RETAIL BASE.
BUT I'D SAY THE TAXES ARE
COMPARABLE IN THE METRO REGION,
OURS ARE.
--> OKAY.
WELL, NOW, SOMETHING RECENTLY
HAPPENED, LET'S TALK A BIT ABOUT
WEST FARGO JOINING THE FM
FARGO-MOORHEAD CHAMBER OF
COMMERCE, HOW DID THAT COME
ABOUT?
--> THERE WAS A MOVE, THE CHAMBER
LOST THEIR CHAMBER DIRECTOR AND
DISCUSSION OPENED UP AMONG
CHAMBER MEMBERS IS THIS THE TIME
WE SHOULD JOIN WITH THE FM
CHAMBER.
THE EXECUTIVE BOARD PUT IT TO A
VOTE AND THE MERGER WAS GOING
THROUGH.
AND, SO, I THINK THERE'S A LOT
OF POSITIVES WITH THAT AND
WORKING TOGETHER AND WORKING ON
LEGISLATIVE ISSUES AND --
--> TALK MORE ABOUT THAT, WHAT
ARE THE REAL BENEFITS?
I'LL PLAY DEVIL'S ADVOCATE, WHAT
ARE THE DOWN SIDES?
--> I THINK THE LARGER THEY ARE,
THE BIGGER VOICE THEY HAVE WITH
LEGISLATORS, TRYING TO INFLUENCE
LEGISLATIVE PROPOSALS AND WITH
THE LARGER GROUP YOU CAN ALSO
BRING IN MORE TRAINING AND
EDUCATIONAL THINGS FOR CHAMBER
MEMBERS, AND, SO, I THINK THAT
IS -- THERE WILL BE A LOT OF
POSITIVES IN DOING THAT.
SOME HAVE SUGGESTED THAT SOME OF
THE SMALLER BUSINESSES CAN'T
AFFORD THE INCREASED MEMBERSHIP
COSTS, BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT FOR
SURE.
--> NOW, WHAT ABOUT THE DOWN SIDE
TO BEING A METRO CHAMBER?
--> THE DOWN SIDE FOR US IS THAT
THE CHAMBER SPONSORS EVERY YEAR
THE WESTFEST PARADE, IT'S A HUGE
DRAW, BRINGS IN THOUSANDS AND
THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE FOR A DAY
ACTIVITIES, A BIG PARADE.
THE CHAMBER WON'T BE DOING THAT
ANYMORE.
I KNOW THE DEMAND IS THERE TO
KEEP THAT GOING, BUT CAN WE FIND
A GROUP TO DO IT?
AND ARE WE AS A CITY GOING TO
HAVE TO WORK WITH THE GROUP
TO -- WE ALREADY WORKED WITH THE
CHAMBER, SO THAT IS GOING TO BE
A BIG CHALLENGE FOR US, I'M
CONFIDENT THE WEST FEST PARADE
WILL KEEP GOING BUT RIGHT NOW
IT'S TROUBLESOME TO ME HOW WE
ARE GOING TO DO THAT.
--> I MOVED HERE SEVEN YEARS AGO
OR SO, THE STATE LINES WITH
FARGO-MOORHEAD WAS INTERESTING,
NOW YOU HAVE WEST FARGO, THE
FIRST, AND FIFTH LARGEST CITIES
NEXT TO EACH OTHER NOW
COMBINING, IT'S AN INTERESTING
SITUATION.
--> IT IS.
I THINK NOT JUST FARGO AND WEST
FARGO, I THINK THE WHOLE REGION,
A LOT OF PEOPLE TALK ABOUT DOING
THINGS TOGETHER AND COMBINING
AND THOSE KIND OF THINGS.
THE FACT IS THE POLICE
DEPARTMENTS WORK TOGETHER, THE
SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENTS, THE FIRE
DEPARTMENTS, THERE'S A LOT OF
THAT ALREADY GOING ON, THAT
PEOPLE DON'T REALIZE, AND THEY
SHOULD TAKE A LOOK AT IT BECAUSE
THERE ALREADY ARE A LOT OF SWAP
TEAMS TOGETHER AND THERE ARE A
LOT OF EFFICIENCIES BEING
CREATED.
THE DISPATCH CENTER, THAT'S ALL
ONE DISPATCH CENTER SORKS WE
HAVE CREATEDE OH SO, WE HAVE
CREATED A LOT OF EFFICIENCIES
TOGETHER.
--> IS ATTRACTING BUSINESSES TO
WEST FARGO BECOMING EASIER THAN
IT USED TO BE?
--> I THINK SO, I THINK SO.
AT ONE POINT WEST FARGO WAS
BUILT ON MEAT PACKING AND IT WAS
A VERY BLUE COLLAR TYPE CITY AND
I FREELY ADMIT YEARS AGO HAD A
KIND OF ROUGH AND TUMBLE TYPE
OF -- PEOPLE SAW IT THAT WAY.
AND NOW IT IS COMPLETELY TURNED
AROUND, IT IS MAINLY A WHITE
COLLAR CITY, HAS SOME GORGEOUS,
GORGEOUS NEIGHBORHOODS AND, SO,
THAT HAS ATTRACTED A LOT OF
BUSINESS BECAUSE OF THAT SWITCH
OVER.
FOR EXAMPLE, THERE USED TO BE A
COUPLE MILES BETWEEN THE FARGO
AND WEST FARGO BORDER, YOU LOOK
AT IT NOW AND CAN'T TELL THE
DIFFERENCE EXCEPT FOR THE SIGN
TELLING YOU YOU ARE COMING INTO
FARGO OR COMING INTO WEST FARGO,
THAT'S HOW THE GROWTH HAS BEEN.
BUT IT'S ALWAYS A CHALLENGE TO
CONTINUE TO ESPECIALLY IN THIS
ECONOMIC CLIMATE AROUND THE
COUNTRY, ATTRACTING BUSINESSES
HERE, AND, YOU KNOW, THE ONLY
THING WE STRESS A LOT IS
EXPANDING OUR CURRENT BUSINESSES
BECAUSE THAT'S YOUR BREAD AND
BUTTER IS GETTING THEM TO EXPAND
IN MY MINE, THAT'S WHERE THE BIG
EXPANSIONS ARE GOING TO COME, I
LOVE -- I WENT TO ONE LAST WEEK
WHERE A COMPANY EXPANDED AND
SPRUCED UP THEIR BUILDING AND IT
GREAT TO SEE.
--> YOU SAID IT, WHEN PEOPLE COME
FROM OUT OF TOWN AND GO TO WEST
FARGO, YOU DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU
ARE.
YOU FIND THAT ANY ISSUES AT ALL?
--> NO, NOT AT ALL.
I THINK WE WORK, WE HAVE SOME --
WELL, VETERANS BOULEVARD, THE
NEW VETERANS BOULEVARD IS A
PERFECT EXAMPLE, ONE SIDE IT'S
FARGO, THE OTHER IS WEST FARGO,
WHO IS GOING TO BUILD THE ROAD?
WORKING WITH FARGO TO GET THINGS
DONE, AND, AGAIN, I WANT TO
STRESS THAT THE TWO CITIES
COOPERATE MUCH MORE THAN PEOPLE
THINK, MUCH MORE.
--> WHAT DO YOU LIKE BEST ABOUT
BEING MAYOR OF WEST FARGO?
--> I LOVE WORKING WITH PEOPLE,
I'M AN OUT GOING PERSON, I WAS A
REPORTER FOR MANY YEARS, I LIKE
TO WORK WITH PEOPLE.
SOME OF THE THINGS YOU GET TO
DO, THERE ARE SOME CHALLENGES,
SOME ISSUES YOU HAVE TO FACE,
PEOPLE ARE YELLING AT YOU,
PEOPLE DON'T CALL YOU UP TO SAY
THANK YOU, THOSE ARE RARE, IT
SEEMS LIKE.
THEY SAY: I HAVE THIS PROBLEM.
THE PEOPLE YOU GET TO MEET, THE
THINGS YOU GET TO DO.
LAST -- COUPLE WEEKS AGO I WAS
INVITED TO WASHINGTON TO TESTIFY
ABOUT THE HOW WEST FARGO IS
AFFECTED BY THE DOWN STREAM
INTERESTS, LAST SUMMER I GOT TO
RACE THE OTHER MAYORS IN A CAR
RACE AT THE FAIR GROUNDS.
YOU ARE SITTING THERE TALKING TO
YOUR CONGRESSIONAL DELEGATION OR
GOVERNOR OR YOU ARE TALKING TO
SOMEBODY AT THE GAS STATION THAT
IS INTERESTED IN LET'S GET A CUP
OF COFFEE AND TALK.
IT BEEN FUN TO ME.
--> ARE YOU GOING TO CONTINUE TO
BE THE MAYOR OF WEST FARGO AND
SEEK ANOTHER TERM?
--> ASK ME IN FOUR YEARS.
--> IF PEOPLE WANT MORE
INFORMATION ABOUT WEST FARGO
WHERE IS THE BEST PLACE TO GO.
WWW.WESTFARGOND.ORG.
--> THANKS FOR BEING HERE.
THE KENSINGTON RUNESTONE IS ONE
OF THE BIGGEST MYSTERY.
LET'S GO TO ALEXANDRIA,
MINNESOTA, WHERE THE STONE IS
HOUSED TO FIND OUT.
--> I CAME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT
--> AND I WOULD MAINTAIN THAT HE
DEFINITELY HAS AN AGENDA AND AX
TO GRIND AGAINST THIS ARTIFACT.
--> THE RUNESTONE MUSEUM WAS CON
INSTRUCTED 1958 AND IT WAS
FOUNDED TO HOUSE THE KENSINGTON
STONE, IT WAS FOUND BY A FARMER
AND HIS SON WHILE CLEARING
GROUND ON THEIR FARM IN 1898
WHILE CLEARING GROUND.
IT WAS IN THE ROOTS OF AN ASPEN
TREE, WHEN THEY PULLED IT UP
THEY FOUND LETTERING ON IT AND
THEY FOUND IT WAS WRITING AND
THAT'S WHAT STARTED THE MYSTERY
OF THE RUNESTONE.
WE HAVE RESEARCHERS THAT ARE
ADAMANT ABOUT IT'S AUTHENTICITY
AND OTHERS THAT QUESTION THE
AUTHENTICITY.
--> THE FIRST THING WAS TO
CONDUCT AN OVERALL FORENSIC
EVALUATION AND WE DID THAT AND
WE WERE ABLE TO DOCUMENT SEVERAL
INTERESTING THINGS, AND THEN
THERE WAS A SECOND PHASE THAT
HAPPENED A COUPLE YEARS LATER
WHERE I CONDUCTED A TOMBSTONE
STUDY WHERE I LOOK ATOMBSTONE
THAT HAD SIMILAR MINERALS AND
WEATHERING, I THINK A CEMETERY
IS THE CLOSEST PLACE YOU WILL
COME THAT THE ENVIRONMENT THE
STONE WAS IN.
I TRIED TO DOCUMENT HOW LONG IT
TOOK FOR CERTAIN MINERALS THAT
HAD ALREADY WEATHERED AWAY ON
THE RUNESTONE, HOW LONG DID IT
TAKE ON THESE STONES.
I CONCLUDED THE PROCESS TOOK 200
YEARS WHEN THEY STARTED TO COME
OFF THE SURFACE, WHEN THEY WERE
ALREADY GONE ON THE RUNESTONE, I
CONCLUDED IT WAS OLDER THAN 200
YEARS AND THAT IS FROM 1898 WHEN
IT WAS PULLED OUT OF THE GROUND.
THE CONSERVATIVE ESTIMATE IS THE
WEATHERING PUTS IT NO SOONER
THAN THE LATE 1600'S.
--> I DON'T BELIEVE IT BECAUSE
WHEN WE LOOK AT THE CLAIMS THAT
WALTER MAKES, WE ARE NOT TALKING
ABOUT THE AGE OF THE STONE,
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE AGE OF
THE ACTUAL GROOVES THAT FORM THE
RUNES.
WALTER CLAIMS THEY ARE VERY OLD.
IN ORDER TO SHOW THAT HE LOOKED
AT THE RUNE GROOVES AND THEY ALL
LOOKED FRESH.
THE CLAIM IS THE RUNE GROOVES
WERE CLEANED OUT WHEN IT WAS
DISCOVERED BECAUSE THEY HAD
DIRT, THEY WERE SCRAPED OUT, TO
THE RUNE GROOVES AREN'T OLD,
THEY LOOK FRESH, EXCEPT SOME
TINY CHIPS THAT LOOK WEATHERED.
HERE'S A COUPLE PROBLEMS WITH
THOSE CLAIMS IN MY OPINION, A
COUPLE PROBLEMS, ONE IS FIRST OF
ALL YOU ARE ADMITTING THE RUNE
GROOVES DON'T LOOK OLD.
SECOND, THE FACT THAT THE
SURFACES OF THE RUNE GROOVES
LOOK OLD SIMPLY SAYS THOSE SMALL
CHIPS OFF THE SURFACE OF THE
RUNE GROOVES, I SHOULD SAY UPPER
PORTION MAY BE THE WEATHER
CORTEX OF THE ROCK.
HERE'S ANOTHER PROBLEM I HAVE
WITH MR. WALTERS MINERAL
ANALYSIS.
HE TOOK THE RUNE STONE TO SWEDEN
SOME YEARS AGO, 2003, I WAS TOLD
AND MANY OF US WERE TOLD HERE IN
MINNESOTA THE RUNESTONE WAS
GOING TO SWEDEN SO REAL EXPERTS
IN ARCHEOLOGY AND RUNIC STUDIES
COULD LOOK AT IT AND PROVE IT
FOR ONCE AND ALL AND THE
GEOLOGISTS WHO LOOKED AT IT WERE
SCEPICAL.
--> I THINK THE PREPONDERANCE OF
THE EVIDENCE ARE CONSISTENT WITH
THE BEING HERE, CARVED IN THE
14TH CENTURY, IT WAS INDIGENOUS
TO MINNESOTA, SOMEONE CAME HERE
THAT HAD THAT KNOWLEDGE
PRESUMABLY FROM EUROPE AND
CARVED THE STONE AND I BELIEVE
IMMEDIATELY BURIED IT AS A LAND
CLAIM.
--> WELL, I THINK THE AUTHOR OF
THE INSCRIPTION WAS MOST LIKELY
A MONK, THERE ARE A NUMBER OF
REASONS WE THINK THAT, AND WE
ALSO SPECULATE THAT IN THE
MIDDLE OF THE 14TH CENTURY WHICH
WAS NOT LONG AFTER THE MEDIEVAL
KNIGHTS TEMPLAR WERE PUT DOWN,
WHICH ARE ONE IN THE SAME WITH
THE MONKS WHO FOUNDED THEM IN
1128.
--> WHAT HAPPENED TO THEM IS I
BELIEVE THEY CAME OVER HERE, I
THINK THE KENSINGTON RUNESTONE
IS ONE OF THE DOCUMENTS THEY
LEFT.
--> THE IDEA THAT THE TEMPLARS
WERE IN AMERICA, I HAVE NO IDEA
WHERE THIS EVIDENCE COMES FROM,
I'VE SEEN AND READ ABOUT WHAT HE
SAYS.
I JUST FIND IT UNBELIEVABLE.
--> AND, SO, AS FAR AS THE ROUTE
THEY COULD HAVE TAKEN, ONE IS
ONE THAT HAS BEEN PUT FORTH BY
MANY PEOPLE WHICH IS THE HUDSON
BAY, NECESSARY SON RIVER, LAKE E
WINIPEG, RED ROCK, I THINK THEY
MAY HAVE GONE THAT ROUTE.
--> IT COMES IN THE MIDDLE OF
MINNESOTA, IT LITERALLY HUNDREDS
OF MILES FROM ANY MAJOR LAKE OR
WATERWAY, LET'S SAY HUDSON BAY
OR EVEN LAKE SUPERIOR.
BECAUSE YOU WOULD EXPECT NORSE
EXPLORERS WHEN THEY CAME TO
AMERICA WOULD HAVE FIRST COME TO
THE COASTAL AREAS AND SETTLED
THERE OR EXPLORED THERE.
WHEN WE LOOK FOR THE
EXPLANATION, WHAT DO WE GET?
WE GET CO-INCIDENCE PILED ON
COINCIDENCE, THINGS THAT ARE
UNLIKELY.
HERE IS A RUNIC SUBSCRIPTION
FOUND BY A FARMER IN 1898, THE
FARMER OPPORTUNITY OUT IS
SWEDISH -- THE FARMER TURNS OUT
IS SWEDISH, AN IMMIGRANT TO
AMERICA, HE HAS IN HIS
POSSESSION AFTER THE RUNESTONE
IS FOUND HE HAS BOOKS WITH RUNIC
WRITING IN THEM.
--> I WOULD HAVE NO PROBLEM
SAYING I WAS WRONG, THIS IS A
VIKING SITE, THERE WOULD BE
FUNDING, THERE WOULD BE
EXCITEMENT.
I WOULD BE FAMOUS.
--> PEOPLE ARE CERTAINLY ENTITLED
TO THEIR OPINIONS, BUT,
UNFORTUNATELY, THEY HAVEN'T PUT
FORTH ANY EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT
THAT, AND, YOU KNOW, DOING
FORENSIC WORK AND ANALYZING
LOGIC PROBLEMS IS WHAT I DO FOR
A LIVING ALL DAY EVERY DAY, AND
THE FACT IS THAT THERE ARE MANY
FACTS FROM MULTIPLE DISCIPLINES
INCLUDING GEOLOGY WHICH IS A
HARD SCIENCE DISCIPLINE
CONSISTENT WITH IT BEING A
MEDIEVAL ARTIFACT.
--> WE JUST FEEL THAT THE STONE
IS AVAILABLE TO ANY SERIOUS
RESEARCHER AND WE MORE OR LESS
TAKE A NEUTRAL POSITION IS IT
AUTHENTIC OR NOT.
IT'S THE BEST KEPT SECRET IN
MINNESOTA, GO OUT AND TELL ALL
YOUR FRIEND AND NEIGHBORS TO
STOP IN AND SEE US.
--> THAT'S ALL WE HAVE O ON THE
SHOW THIS WEEK.