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Sam Richards: Okay, let's get started on the next session. I am Sam Richards, and I'm going
to be the moderator for this particular session and
I will sit off to the side down here in this comfortable chair,
and our panel can sit at the table, in their upright
chairs and respond to some questions. The way we're going to do this is
we'll take maybe about a half hour or so and really engage
them. And try to keep the answers very short, keep it lively, and
moving back and forth. Then we want to open it up to everybody
else. So we'll try to get as much
back and forth as we can, and if you have something right in the middle of the conversation here that you just
really really need to ask...
You know anything you want to ask, just throw it out. I have a few questions, so maybe my
questions aren't going to get us very far. So let's do it that way.
Just kick something out if you want, but let's try to keep the questions really short.
There are a lot of folks here. These are undergraduate students who are using social
media, and that's of course the topic of this session as you know. Social Media
and Students. And instead of us talking a lot
in this particular session, I think it might be nice to really hear as much as possible from them. So
we'll try to keep all of our questions short. Thank you panel for
being here. For the first time you respond as you go through, make sure you
introduce yourselves, and what your
role is at the university. But let me just--
You know I had a couple opening comments, but I'm not even going to do that. Let's
jump right in. So, the first is question: What social media
modalities do you find yourselves using
most of the time? Sort of the main media modlaities.
Each person doesn't have to speak but let's sort of cover them, so we have an idea of what you're
doing with it-not the average student. That's going to be my next question. So, anybody can start.
Whoever wants to jump in first...
We can start at this end. Make sure you use the microphones.
Max: Hi. My name's Max Wendkos,
and I'm the president of the Inter Fraternity Council here. I'm a Twitter and
Facebook guy, and I guess that's why I'm here today. We're trying to develop
our Twitter a little more this time to hopefully find new
ways to reach out to members of our Fraternity community. We're always trying to find ways to improve communication.
Email isn't the best way. I think they like to delete the
mass blasts to our list serve, so if we can figure out some new ways to get a
hold of them via social media, it's going to be a great resource that we can continue to develop.
Max: My twitter is maxWendkos.
If you'd ike to follow me, I have a lot of very interesting
things to say. (laughing)
Melanie: Hi everyone. My name is Melanie
Versaw. I'm the photography editor of onwardstate.com, and I'm also
the director of entertainment within the Penn State Marketing Association, and looking
to be the Chief Information Officer next year. (-I'm excited for that,-)
Like he said, Twitter and Facebook are probably the main ones.
Onward State recently started utilizing a site
called Yammer where you shoot yams to people. I will let someone else down there talk about
it more because you're a more Yammer enthusiast than I am, but
Twitter, Facebook and Linked In, actually since I'm actually in the business
school. I've been starting to utilize that more which is really interesting meeting
people through that site. I actaully just recently got
contacted by the President of the Marketing Association from 2005,
who's starting a bunch of new businesses. It's really interesting meeting people
on a site like that, when you're kind of just getting into it.
So that's my story.
Lienard: Hello everyone! My name is
Lienard Chang. I am involved in a few things on campus. I'm an on campus
representative for the University Park
Undergraduate Association. I'm involved in Nittany Nation which is our
student basketball section, (-we won yesterday, so I'm really happy about that!-) and I'm also
involved in Innoblue. It's an entrepreneurial start up group,
non-profit organization. I use Facebook. I use Twitter.
I don't use Facebook as much. I am a huge Twitter user.
I find it really easy to balance all the things I am involved in.
Just to to have one account, so I can post about Nittany Nation; I can post about
student government; I can post about Innoblue. I just
find it to be a huge resource. I get all my news from Twitter. I don't have
to go onto CNN. I just look at the trending topics and I get the
biggest news going on in the world and in the country.
Evan: Hello. My name is Evan Kalikow. I
am the Standard's editor, and co-founder of Onward State.
The main social media sites I use are of course
Facebook and Twitter. In Onward State we
also use Yammer a lot. Should I talk about Yammer? Okay!
(Question from Sam: How do you spell that?) Evan: Y-A-M-M-E-R
Yammer is basically a sort of hybrid between
Facebook and Twitter that you can use within an
organization. Onward State does not have a physical
"newsroom" so to speak, and we use Yammer-basically
our own private Facebook and Twitter,- to foster a community,
get story ideas, coordinate photography,
all sorts of things like that. It's really helped us build
our community. It's been terrific in the few
months that we've used it so far.
Eli: My name's Eli Glazier. I'm the editor in cheif of onwardstate.com,
and a co-founder. I think,
in order I guess I would use Twitter more than Facebook,
which is surprising because I remember getting a Twitter
in 2008. Davis was the one that suggested I
get one. I didn't really see a utility for it,
but as I followed more people
I began to see the value in it, and at this point,
I use Twitter probably 10 times as much as I use Facebook.
I think as a student,
it's not very common, but I guess we'll talk about that after.
Davis: Hi I'm Davis Shaver.
I'm the publisher and also a co-founder of Onward State.
Like the rest of the panel, you know, Facebook and Twitter are
obviously a hugh part of my social media life.
Yammer, too. One thing I'd add is that Yammer
usage at Onward State is just the latest iteration in
a process that's also involved Google Wave, Basecamp,
just googledocs. You know it's
a similar product in that space. I also use Quora,
which is a social questions site.
I guess that's the majority of them. (Question from Sam: How do you spell that last one?)
Davis: Quora is spelled Q-U-O-R-A, and
what it is is basically a comments engine,
so that you can ask a a comment and then benefit from your
social graft in seeking answers.
Sam: So let's do something quickly. Well Davis, (-while you have the microphone-) can you
(-and I should say Davis has 730 followers on Twitter, so-)
Davis: Unfortunately! Sam: Yeah, which we were talking at lunch about the pros and cons of that.
But you know that's a lot of followers. I think I'm pretty linked in and I don't have
anywhere near that. Tell us about
Onward State really fast. Can you give us a 30 second summary of what it is?
Davis: Sure. Onward State is a student run
news website, that opperates
a website at onwardstate.com, in addition
to Facebook and Twitter, which we view as separate editorial products,
that just fall under our Onward State brand.
Sam: And you have about 4,000 views
a day? Davis: Yeah, we get about 4,000 visits a day. We have
about 3,000 followers on Twitter in addition to about 3,000
friends on Facebook. Sam: That's pretty
cutting edge. Okay so tell us just quickly, (-and everybody doesn't have to respond,-)
about the avergage Penn State student. To give us a sense of what's going
on--how are they using social
media, digital technologies and so on. Evan: I mean
for the common student, I'd say that Facebook
is definately still king. I get invited
to probably 10-12 events everyday on Facebook,
which I always delete them. But
I think Facebook is still..
I mean, I wouldn't really have a social life without Facebook
because I wouldn't know what was going on.
I think more and more students are starting to Tweet
as they see their friends are doing it and some classrooms are using it.
Hashtags to ask professors questions and things like
that. Sam: Anything else someone else wants to add about students?
Davis: I think that Twitter usage has really epanded at
Penn State amoung the student body in the last two years. Personally,
I account a large amount of that growth to THON.
Thon kind of embraced Twitter, probably
sometime last year, and it
has kind of trickled down through the organizational structure (-as you guys all know-).
THON is a hugh organization of Penn State, so
as the overall committee used it to
promote thon's message, committee members and organization
members all began using it, and I think that drove a lot of
growth here. Sam: So where THON goes, we should follow I think is the
word. Melanie, did you have something to add about the average, typical Penn State
student? Melanie: I was just gonna tap in on Twitter. I know
when a lot of people first heard about it they were saying this is stupid--why
would I want to do this? A lot of people still have those strong feelings about it,
but like Davis I believe was saying, people are starting
to warm up to it and finally utilize it. People are learning that
you get your news like that (snaps), and it's fine-I don't know.
It's interesting to see it kind of turning over into a bigger deal now. Sam: So what
about other modalities? I mean I'm thinking Youtube. Obviously everybody's on Youtube, but
are they commenting? Is anybody using Youtube in an interactive way?
Melanie: I mean I do, but.... Sam: The average students do you think?
Melanie: I wouldn't say the average student would comment.
Evan: I haven't seen too many college students using
Youtube comments. I personally don't and my
reasons for that are that most Youtube comment spaces
quickly divulge into one of the worst cess pools
I've ever seen of any sort of online community. Like it could be a
video about a puppy rollerskating or something
cool like that, and then the most recent comments will be like "911 is an inside
job" ...and it's
just very hard to have an intellgent, ontopic
discussion on Youtube. Sam: But maybe that's the puppy's name, you know? (laughing)
Sam: I should add, at
Onward State, right so maybe you could respond to this for ISC work, btu
at Onward State, I mean you all are getting lots and lots of comments. I was saying at lunch, I look
at a very provokative article in the Collegian, and I see zero comments.
But I go to Onward State and an article that's really not even that provokative
and there are 10, 20, 30 comments-and sometimes a lot more. So it is
a space where people are really being engaged, and
I think that's important. Do you have anything to add about the kind of typical?
Max: (-You guys mind if I talk without the microphone? Can everyone hear me?-)
Sam: Nah, go ahead use the mic because it will go to the camera.
Max: Well I guess
when I read the comments out at an onward state article it's usually kind of
greek related. My experiences are that it's about 3-5
people that come on there. Usually 80% of them
just accuse every single person I represent of some sort of debauchry, and
drinking ourselves into an oblivion, and
most things that actually don't happen. And then there's
one person who goes on and defends us. I tend to not really read the comments under the
other stories, althought I do read them and use Twitter for all my news sources.
At times, I think the comments are
useful. I think I've actually maybe had this discussion with Davis or Eli because
they can fire me up when some random person comes in and misrepresents
everybody that I'm working for. I find myself in a hole
having to defend themself every single day. That get's old pretty quickly.
But it's important for people to have a voice, and I know
the Collegian has persued something similar where they also have a comment section. I don't think it's quite as
utilized as Onward State is. I also don't know how often people
actually check out the Collegian's website as opposed to actually
reading the hardcopy of the paper that's published. But
yeah, I guess it's more of a benefit than
a detrament. I wish though, sometimes people in those comment sections would
carefully consider what they're saying before they actually say it, and
make some sort of effort to validate their information before they just throw out every wild
accusation they can think of. Sam: Well, keep in mind that a lot of those--that might
be the administrators actually responding...(laughing)
Max: Sometime it is the administrators and I realize that,
which is extra frustrating. Sam: We find ways to get our ideas out there. Hey let's
talk about the classroom a little bit. What happens in the classroom? Because I think that's really
important here in a learning community. So your professors, right? How are they
using social media? I mean what do you see? How are they using it? Let's talk
about how they are using it, as opposed to how they're not using it. What are you seeing?
Max: I just have a quick question. There was an article in the Collegian recently about
a classroom where they were starting to use Twitter with hash tags...was that your classroom?
Sam: No. That was probably Michael Elavsky's. Max: Okay.
That's the only time I've heard of it. I haven't actually experienced that in any class that I've been in myself.
But I thought it was realy interesting, and actually ended up writting a paper about that article for one
of my classes. I think there is a lot of potential for that.
Students were commenting that through Twitter, they felt like
(-they were a little bit more,-)
they were more easily able to express their own opinions or ask questions when they might not want to
raise their hand in front of other students. It kind of
facilitied the flow of information and open discussion in the classroom, which I think is
always a positive thing. You know, anyone *whose been in a class at Penn State, it's probably more
rewarding when the students are paricipating. So I mean isf social media
can be used to increase the level of student participation, I think that
that's awesome. Sam: Yeah, I see that. We've done that in my classroom.
Well I mean I use a hashtag in my class... Do you have any
thoughts? Melanie: I actually had one of my classes (-an MIS class in the business building-)
that utilized Twitter. She tried
to do the hasgtag #MISSpring whatever, and people weren't
really into it. It was kind of right when Twitter was strarting to pick
up. She said that she got her summer class to always utilize it, but
with everthing else going on, just people weren't into it, which is
interesting. Sam: So you had one class? Melanie: I only had one, yeah.
Sam: Only one person using Twitter. Anything else?
I mean this is informative, right?
Lienard: So there's really not
many uses for Twitter in the classroom, but I do find it interesting.
I know Eli, Davis--they're
in IST445H (-I think-)... They went on a trip to D.C.
and I mean I'm not in the class, but they kept using the IST445H
hashtag and it was really interesting to see what they were
hearing in D.C. and I could just follow it from my computer here at
Penn State. Sam: So how about some of your Engineering Professors... Are they engaging
in social media, digital media, and digital technologies? Lienard: I mean to be honest,
I mean social media is never ever brought up in the class room. It's all technical
math and engineering. Sam: But you do a lot
of group work and all. So do students do it themselves, or are
professors participating? Lienard: Umm, no. There's really no engagment in
social media within the engineering relam from my experience. Sam: Are there any engineering professors
here? Okay. Enough said (laughing)!
Next time, can we hook that up? Alright! Anybody else?
Eli: I'm an international politics major,
so my classes are generally very small, and
disscusion based. Taking the
conversation outside of the classroom onto the internet, hasn't
really occured. Professors use Angel, which
I don't really like. Maybe
you do-I don't know. But I think it's very difficult
and it doesn't foster the interaction that Max was talking about.
On a student level, (-I think-)
Evan and I were in IST445H together,
that Lienard was talking about and Davis is taking now. You have to write
a gropu policy paper at the end, and we did that whole
thing on GoogleDocs, which has
was edited at the same time, and it was very helpful. But we weren't
really given that guidance by our teacher.
It was just something we decided to do by ourselves.
Yeah, so...
Evan: Yeah, just to add to that... I'm
also in international politics and econ, and I found that a lot
of my professors don't utilize social media in the classrooms.
Some of them still consider the abbacys * to be witchcraft?!
(laughing) But a lot of the students
will definetly use Facebook, Twitter and Google to
do work outside of the class
to foster discussions and things like that. It's definitely a very
student driven thing form my experiences. Sam: Well you know, this is
beautiful. This is the next question we're going to go to actually.
So how are you all--how are students utilizing digital
technology, social media, etc...to
take what happens in the classroom outside into their lives? I mean, how are
students building an overlap? There's a sort of
almost like an accepted line of demarkation between what goes on
inside the rooms of the classroom and then what happens in the day to day lives
of students. So you all, are taking it upon
yourselves, or at least this is what you're implying. Can you give us some ways in which that
happens that those of us teaching could be privy to? To actually
encourage us and so on. So think about all the
content in the class, and how do you really deal with that
content outside of the classroom using these technologies?
Davis: I think Twitter plays a big part in that, just by the nature of the fact that
on Twitter you have a single identity and there's no
regularity as in Facebok with who sees the content that you publish.
So you know, if I'm following Eli. Eli's tweeting about his international
politics seminar, I see that and I
associate that content with Eli.
Same goes if Eli is a party later and it tweeting about that.
So I think that helps encourage the connection
between our acedemic, personal and social lives. That's kind of
one of the reasons what like Lienard does with social media is really
interesting. He is involved with a number of different organizations
and he tweets about them each, but
those connections are tied just through
his Twitter account even though there's not much
inteplay between them on an organizational level.
Sam: Yes. Somebody else?
(Question from Audience) Well I guess my question is tied you--you're all
talking about overlap. You all represent--you have a personal
entities, but then you also have professional entities that each of you have cultivated here
on campus. How do you use social media
to retain that sense of yourself as a student and
to really communicate just with your friends and be your own personal selves
but also keep up that professional persona, too? Do you
like Lienard, if you have that many entities tied to your personal account, how do you
parce things out so that you still can communicate with your friends?
Eli: I think definitely, for me
I mean we have an Onward State Twitter account, so most
of the Onward State related things that I would tweet about, I would just tweet about
those on that account. But there's still a definite
need to be professional on my personal Twitter account.
So like I can talk to my friends, I can
make petty observations about what I'm
eating, or something like that (Evan: yeah, you've had a few of those incidents-)...
(laughing) Eli: Ha, it's true. But I think that
the sense of professionalism comes from just being a little more
aware of what you're tweeting, or what you're posting on Facebook,
because that's me in
personal and professional. So,
I'm not cursing unnesscarily... I mean
just being respectful
which for me keeps the sense of professionalism
of the account, but at the same time I can make fun of Evan
on Twitter or do whatever... (Evan: That's impossible) (laughing)
Sam: So Melanie you have a good example of this right? The one you were talking
about at lunch--somebody that you know? Melaine: Oh, on
LinkedIn? Right!
LinkedIn for those of you who don't know is a professional website for connecting with
people you've met through companies or even just friends.
There's one girl that I'm LinkedIn with who just
links her Twitter to her LinkedIn, so everyone on her
professional site can see her Twitter. She's twittering about
Mom's in minivans, and crazy things that you don't want on your
professional site. It's really--I mean the thing that students really need to utilize is
privitization. Some students just can't grasp the
concept that everone can see what they're writing. Like I privitize
a lot of my stuff, just cause I like don't like to be creeped on. But
it's just amazing to me that some students still
allow everyone to be able to look at all of they're content. People say this:
some people who are going to be interviewing you are going to check out your
Facebook first, and if you're doing a keg stand in your picture, you're not getting that
job. It's strange to me--some people are so unaware of it. It
blows my mind. Sam: Does anybody else have
a response to this particular question?
Lienard: I definitely try to find a fine line
between everything I do. I make personal observations as well on my Twitter.
If I'm speaking in capacity for Student Government, I'll be a little
bit more formal. In general, I'm pretty formal--I don't curse in general so
I'm especially mindful of that on Twitter. But when I'm
replying to my friends in normal conversation, I'm very informal.
For instance, Nittany Nation-student basketball section,- I add a lot
of exclamation points to show how excited I am. But you know
for more professional things like Innoblue, like student government, I
tend to be a bit more formal just to get the word out to other students.
Max: I actually hadn't thought about it, but it's really interesting. I think I use
all the different social media at different levels. LinkedIn is completely professional, all
the time. I would never link my Twitter to there. My Twitter then, is kind of
like a mix between professional and talking with my friends as
well. I would never curse, (-or say anything- I guess
sometimes I say things that are controversial, but I quickly jump on and delete them. But
I do make an effort not to do that. They're not controversial in the way
that they would reflect negatively upon my personal character. It's more just an observation
I'm making at Penn State that I might be unhappy with at the moment. Then my Facebook
is completely private. If you're not friends with me, you can't even see my profile picture.
If you are friends with me, you can't see anything but my profile picutre.
I limit who can write on my wall, who can chat with me, everything.
If I really have to say something that I wouldn't want to ever be in any publich domain,
that's what text messaging is for, or picking up the phone.
So I know that I'm very very mindful of that. I'd say
actually my position has helped me become more mindful of that and have a better appreciation of
opperating differntly in all these differnt relams,
to make sure that I can kind of separate my social life from my professional
life as much as possible. Sam: But you all are a little bit different then the average
student, right? You're in more public roles and public positions.
Would you say that? It sounds to me you're thinking more deliberatly about these
kinds of questions. Max: Yeah, I think the standard student (-from my
experiences-) isn't nessecarily mindful at all. Somtimes the things that I see on people's twitters,
and Facebooks, and even sometimes
LinkedIn is scary. They might just need
some coaching in some of these areas. But I
don't think they fully get it. When
I was first elected I'd say in my first two weeks
there was an alcohol survey that went out through the university
and I kind of panicked a little bit, thinking "oh no, more reason
for scrutiny". So I sent out an email to the Greek saying
listen if you're not going to take this resposibly, do not take this survey. Next thing you know,
I was on the front page and beign critized for it. Also in the
spring semester, the interfraternity council representative on UPUA made
some incredibly controversial remarks on his Twiiter, which led to him having
to step down. So I've seen the impact
of not being mindful in these different mediums
and I know it's been helpful for me.
Evan: Yeah, just to add to that...
I think regardless, if you're a student leader or
just a regular student, you should be mindful of different things
that you're posting on social media. For instance, my Twitter
is protected so you can only see what I write if I
let you. The down side to that is that I can't tweet
at Kanye West to let him know what my favorite Kayne West lyric is. But the upside
is that employeers can't see that I'm
telling Kayne West what my favorite Kayne West lyric is. (laughing)
So there are two side to every story.
(Question from Audience:) I just wanted to go back to a comment you made earlier about
Angel. I'm just very curious about this because I use Angel in my courses.
Does anybody here on the panel like Angel? How is it useful
for courses? Do you find it an effective way to communicate with your friends
who are working together on a project within that class? Melanie: No.
Noone likes Angel. One of my courses, for whatever reason,
every time they send an email from Angel, it sends seven emails. Seven of the
same email. What?! (laughing)
(Question from Audience:) I think that's a big disconnect between the university, in terms of how
we think we should (inaudible) each other about class work and group work?
That's always been my assumption. They're all in the class together, it's so easy to
just send an email out during the class because you know their email numbers--you know the list.
Is there a disconnect between what we think and what they're really doing?
Melanie: The only thing I really utilizte Angel for other than checking my grades and getting the
lessons off it, is getting the course roster
which is helpful. But I don't think I've ever
sent out a mass message to the class about anything. We generally just
exchange emails and use Gmail for it.
Max: I think the general concept of Angel is very good.
At least for me, there's just a lot of technical problems with
Angel specifically. It's not the idea. I think that if there was
a website that made communication a little bit easier..maybe integrated some
other email clients, that would be helpful. The lessons
are very very helpful to have available. I know that one thing I absolutely dispise about Angel right now
is that Google Chrome has far surpassed every other web browser for me, and you can't
send messages if you're opening Angel in Google Chrome.
What else can't you do? You can't upload doctuments into dropboxes.
I have to pull up a completely different web browser when I want to submit my file....
It's really kind of annoying.
(QFA) (Inaudible) like two versions ago, so don't hold it against Angel
because it was a very good platform. Sam: Back in the day,
back when dinosaurs ruled the earth. (laughing)
Paleolithic Era. (Question from audience:) Further writing it so that we dislike it
oh that's right we have (inaudible) Sam: Does anybody have anything
else to add about some innovative ways that professors are using
Angel? (pause...) Okay, enough said. (laughing)
(Question from audience:) What about a feed from Angel for example, would that draw you there?
Melanie: Like a twitter feed? I don't think Angel's updating the internet.
Sam: We can let somebody respond to that here who are the angel guru's.
But let me just kick something out real fast. I asked this question
about professors and how stuff in the classroom is linking with your
personal lives and so on. That didn't get many legs at all.
And I'm kind of shocked by that. I'm wondering--I want to ask
a follow-up to that: what could instructors be doing, or how could
they be utilzing social media technologies, to really
bring to life what's going on inside the classroom. Is there
anything that peple could be doing? I mean what do you
see? What are you sitting back wishing the professors understood about all of these
technologies?
Max: Through foursquare,
maybe... I'm just trying to think here... (laughing)
To see if we're actually there, ya know? The GPS
is...just a thought.
(Question from Audience:) Let me ask you a question though as a group, is again
with Angel-I have some pushback from students
to do group work, online, again using Angel as a
tool. they say wait a minute, they're of the old mindset-I paid, I
to be in this class for an hour, I don't want to be bothered with your
class material outside of that hour. And you're the sort of above
average student here, so how do you feel about having more than
three hours a week, dealing with your class content
with these social medias? Would that be a problem?
Max: I don't know about the rest of these guys here,
but honestly for me-just because of all of my extra curriculars,
I pretty frequently miss class, so I really heavily rely
on what they make available out of the class, to make sure that I continue to
give my school work proper attention and do well in the classroom without
actually necessarily being there every single time.
For something like Angel, and they could probablly integrate some other social media
for this, the professors that I appreciate the most are the one's who really heavily maintain
the calendar, and are always putting the lessons online
to give me the oppertunity to do well, while also balancing
the leadership roles I've chosen to pursure at the university. I don't know if that
applys to your everyday student, but I know from freshman yeah to now, it's
always been that way for me. I probably spend more time on Angel than I do in the classroom.
Sam: So using social media to
acutally expand this scope of the work in the classroom
is what I'm hearing, like you could be doing that not just with Angel but you could be doing that
with Youtube and all sorts of things. (QFA:) So at some point is that too much
content for the class-like work for the class?
Max: I think it makes it easier.
Melanie: Yeah, I mean people are always on their laptops or cell phones
anyways-it makes it almost easier to get updates about the class
or ask questions. I was thinking maybe in large lectures, a lot of
people are kind of scared to raise their hand and ask questions.
That's just how students are. They don't want to get ridiculed or whatever. But I think that
maybe utilizing Twitter for asking questions in large lectures
would be a big help, especially to the shy kids who just
won't raise their hand. (QFA:) During the class itself, or outside of it?
Melanie: I think it could work either way. I think during the class if maybe even there was just a
feed of questions that the professor could go through would help, but
outiside of the class, if you had a T.A. responding, I think it would be
really helpful. I don't know about anyone else. Sam: Anybody else here? Then we'll
go to a couple questions. Anyone else want to add anything about what instructors could be doing?
Davis: Yeah I mean, one of the things
I've noticed is that.... So I'm in this IST445H
course, and we have a group project. We
got the details of the project right about the time that Facebook groups came
out. Facebook groups is Facebook's new way
of organizing a small collection of people. I suggested
that we should use this to manage our course work.
It seemed innovative. It seemed useful. There's a built in docs platform.
What I found in organizing that group project on Facebook, is that
people don't want their course work on Facebook.
That's where their friends are. They're
just in a different mindset when they use that platform. Then
it informed me, and I kind of think that Faculty
and educational designers need to figure out how to put social into
the tech, rather than just trying to extend the tech into the existing social platforms.
You know, just because
this is working, doesn't mean you have to go there to get the benefits of it.
You can bring those back home, and integrate them into a more
structured way. Sam: Yeah.
(QFA:) I really appreciate this
discussion of department * * because I follow some of you on Twitter
and I really appreciate
the professional way in which, even when you are
posting things that are personal, that there's still a
recognition that this is public. There have been times when I'm following
students that's associate dean oriented, that I've been
uncomfortable with what I've been seeing, and had to unfollow them. So what I'm wondering
about is, this is a new kind of public space
and you have been talking about your relationship with
one another and how you can learn, and you're sort of more comfortable
in using these social medias. But I'm really interested
in hearing more about how we as administrators
and as a faculty member, can
have meaningful kinds of relationships with students that are
also respectful of the boundaries that have to sort of be in place
between faculty and student.
Davis: I think part of the difficulty with that
is just Twitter itself. Twitter seems to be the most likely way
that a faculty would communicate with a student. But one of the problems I've found
is that there isn't that mechanism to control
who sees a specific piece of content that you share over the network.
I think we're different because we understand that, and we understand
that we're broadcasting when we post something on our Twitter account.
Either the network has to change and they have to
integrate that grainularity of content
and privacy settings, or students need to be instructed better
about what happens when you publish something online.
I'm not sure, but I feel like the resources are missing.
Eli: I think that when I use Twitter
I follow you, you follow me. Dean Bradey and I,
(-Dean Bradey has a very prolific Twitter account, one of two accounts,-)
So when I tweet I
know that you're reading. I know that he's reading.
There're limits to what
I can say because of that, which is totally reasonable.
So that's personally. I think that faculty
could engage students more on Twitter. Maybe
by posing questions, or just being very involved
there, posting links, etc. Dean Bradey will post something,
I'll read it and be like -that's really interesting-
or whatever, and then he'll comment back and it becomes a discussion
outside the classroom, which I think is really valuable because
I mean I've taken one class with him, but it just extends
the conversation outside the classroom. It's really valuable because
fundamentally, we go to school to learn.
But if you can learn outside the classroom, that's sometimes more
valuable than learning inside the classroom. Sam: It's where most learning
occurs I'm sure. Evan: One thing I'd just like
to add in general: with Twitter, questions
get responses. I notice that sometimes I'll
tweet something and no one will say anything, so I'll feel a little bad about
that. But then I'll say something like "Hey guys, I have a funny
joke," and then I'll get ten responses which
is unheard of for a gentleman like me. Sam: So,
wait--they're reponses are "what's the joke?" Davis: No, I'll
say (laughing) here I have a
joke, "what do you call a dinosaur that falls down?"
And then I'll have like 10 people responding,
with various punch lines...
Dino-sore.
Sam: Okay, yeah. (laughing)
I was just getting ready to follow you on Twitter, but.. (laughing)
I don't need anymore silly jokes.
(QFA:) We do have a question tool
at PSU, that allows individual students to
type in a question and others can vote it up and down. The TA can actually
answer individual questions when they wanted to, and say hey-
we've got a bunch of people in the class (inaudible), so it's available
to them (inaudible). The other thing I wanted
to ask you guys was about text messaging (inaudible)
Sam: Yeah are you texting?
(QFA) Would you be open to that or is it kind of creepy?
Max: Completely creepy. Yeah...
Sam: What they all thought right there was "omg," right?
(laughing) That was their
thought bubbles. (QFA:) Why is it creepy? Max: I guess
you know it kind of falls in line with what I was saying a little earlier. I view text messaging
as my space for a more --(QFA:) We're not talking about what you're going to have for dinner-we're talking about a teacher
allowing you to text them if you have questions on the course.
Email is for old people-we know that.
Max: I like email. I'm completely fine with email and we're all getting smart phones these days
and we have quick and convient access to it.
I'm totally fine opperating through that medium. I think it's a Maxer of
making sure we can maintain that line between
professors and students, to the point where it's a professional relationship.
I think that text messaging would really really blur that
and I don't think there is any circumstance in which I would ever text message one of my professors.
I'd be uncomfortable doing it. Davis: I think it also
comes from the fact that you can't opt into a text message. You
just get it and it is pushed to your phone, whereas with Twitter, Facebook, and Email,
you have to make the decision that I want to check and see whether there's any
new information. I think that difference makes it more uncomfortable.
Melanie: I've only even texted one of my professors, but it
wasn't a classroom related thing-he's my buddy.
That might be weird, I guess. But I don't think
students would be open to that, and I know
we're just six kids who are more
social media guru's. But
I think that students would generally
be creeped out about that. I don't think it would be something that they would want to do. (QFA:) But they wouldn't have to...
Melanie: I know. But I still feel like calling
would even be a better option. If you have a question that you really
have to get out, I would think calling would be better than texting
anyway. Sam: Wow this is factinating.
(QFA:) Inaudible
(QFA:) I'm not saying let's party...
(laughing) But it's interesting there's a line here
that seems is very private, and that
is where crossing the line, even though
I'm emailing you and you're getting on your phone. What's the difference if I send you a text message
on your phone. (Another comment:) Yes, but it's a phone number--I may not want you to have my phone number.
There is that personal line.
Sam: What I'm hearing here is--what I just heard from Melanie was
"I'll give you my phone number, but call me don't text me," right? (QFA:) Which is totally not
normal--you'd never think of calling you kids right? Sam: Lienard, do you have something to add?
Lienard: I mean I think it's creepy as well, but I wouldn't mind
it. I think it could be a useful tool if I have a question at let's say 10:00pm.
I could text message my teacher. I think what makes it
less creepy is having a Googlevoice number, so your professor doesn't actually
know your number. It's kind of a pseudo number to use.
Max: Does every student in your class have access
to your cell phone number? (QFA:) Yes. Max: Have you ever gotten like a
drunk text message? (laughing) I just feel like that would inevitablly happen.
Sam: You're about to, right? (QFA:) I get those from my kids
but no. Max: Oh, okay. I just envision the scenerio
where they're sitting around on like a Saturday at 3:00AM... (QFA:) I would say that
if they did that, that's not okay...
But I just don't think a student would drunk text me.
Max: I would (laughing) (QFA:) You're facebook comments were interesting because
I'm in the situation where when I have students who try and "friend" me, I never
accept. I just feel like for me that's the line.
For me, it's a very personal space. Do you find that
you know other students that "friend" their professors? Melanie: One of my professors last semester
is very young-she's probably 24. She said that
(I didn't friend request her, but-) "a lot of you guys have friend requested me," being very nice
"but I'm not going to accept any of your friend requests until the semester is over."
"Until you're not my student anymore." By even then-why would you want to be Facebook friends after that?
It's weird. (laughing) Sam: Most
of my Facebook friends are students I should add...
(QFA:) Inaudible
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
Davis: They can archive a Tweet, but I don't think it's a continual program.
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(QFA:) I know seeking is one of the Twitter treats,
but I would say first of all-there are two things. One,
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
But there is believe it or not, a boundary I have and
it's bulletproof. So I think the whole concept
of fear is really dead and gone. It's about being comfortable
with the tool. Not every tool is right for everybody.
I don't like Facebook individually,
but it's based on orginazation for me, right? And
Whether you friend students--it's really
that boundary that both people are comfortable with.
So we're still negotiating that, but yeah.
I think that maybe not so much
the thing that keeps me so careful about it,
is just knowing how many people follow me and
then who they follow. (Other QFA:) Right. And I'd love to hear some of the (inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
I'm not a young student anymore, and so I sit there and I
wonder a lot of times, why would you tag a case
or beer as your friend, even though that is your friend's
area? It seemed like for a while there
people had no clue how to separate the two.
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
Davis: I think that will evolve over the next 10 years as people
like for Facebook. I've talked a little bit about my problem with
Twitter is you can't moderate you see's your content. You can do that on Facebook.
But I think that a lot of people don't realize that. People aren't
in the nature of saying okay-Joe's on this list,
bill is on this list, and my mom's on this list. I think that that will happen
soon, and I think it will make what you're talking about more feasible. Sam: Yes.
So we have two more questions. We have stubbs in the front, and then we'll go back here.
(
(QFA:) I was wondering if guys could jump back a bit. You raised a good point
would you like to see your professor (inaudible) questions?
I guess what else would you guys
like to see or even your peers like to see? I know
as educators we're like "we're just gonna put the flash on Facebook and everyone's gonna love it!"
and then we get a lot of "well you failed at that"
or "you didn't do it right" and then there's the other half saying "is this going to be on the test?"
(-these links you're posting is great...am I graded on it?)
Is that something that we should be concious of? Do you guys want to get to the point where
the things that are happening on Twitter and Facebook are things you're tested on?
Or do you think it's important to keep the grades out of it?
Eli: I think that it's important
that stuff in the classroom, (-obviously you can be tested
on it-) but I think out the classroom things like
Twitter links or whatever, should definitely be on an opt in
basis. I mean I'm connected
probably more than most people. I
choose to respond to links. I choose to read them. But when I'm out of the classroom,
I really have no responsibility to do that.
It's more of a personal choice. I think people
are busy enough that that would be detrimental to
a lot of people's GPA if they had to follow their professor on Twitter,
and read what they had to say, and just know it.
Sam: Anybody else? Davis: Yeah,
like I was saying earlier, I think that it's easy to
try and go to Facebook and Twitter and do that educational experience there.
But long term, I think what has to happen is that social
has to be integrated into the educational experience itself. It's not that
you're professor is going to Twitter to share a link, but that it's built in to
the course management system, or course management system that the school uses.
That's a paradime shift that I think we're a few decades away from.
Sam: Right.
(QFA:) I have a question, because when I think about technology
and incorporating social media,
the most convient when I was a child was the telephone.
My parents knew how to use a telephone, so as I was growing up
I learned how to use a telephone, but
in today's world there is so much social media
that's evolving so quickly...
I guess I'm wondering where you all are learning? And are you all
learning painfully what the boundaries are? I see
my studens making mistakes, but they are
recognizable mistakes. But as Max talked about, he made a couple mistakes
with social media as he becamse a public figure.
How can we help students know what
to develope the same insights as you all have? (-Because
to me that's-) The content of what you learn and
what's useful, but what you're really going to take away and use later on in life
is how do I learn efectively and efficently
in whatever it is I end up doing? Sam: Yeah, that's a good question.
So how could we help you? Max: I'm a huge proponent
for Penn State reshaping the way it does it's Freshmen seminar classes.
It is a class you have your first or second semester here.
Generally it's in your first...
When I took it, it was this joke. You kind of coast
through like "sweet-we get two credits of an A our first semester". It kind of gives us a little
boost as we adjust to a new academic
setting. It would be way more helpful for students
if it was kind of preparing us for some of the obsticals we were going to face. Some of the different
situations that we would find ourselves in. If you
could reach out to us right away and talk to us about
like, "listen those of you using Facebook, social media is developing into this so you need to be concious of what you're saying,
and what you're broadcasting," I think they would then keep that in the back of their head,
and it would almost become an accepted standard of everyone knows, IF they're all going through a course like
that. We don't just put whatever we're thinking out there. We don't post that
keg stand on Twitter, because it's not going anywhere.
You need a way to reach everyone when they're
coming in right away. There's so many different issues that apply to all students, too taht
if a course like that was developed, could help us in so many other areas. I mean we talked about
things like the alchol problems here... They take an online class, or something?
It wasn't here when I came in, but that's not really going to do much.
But if you could address them in a setting that was preparing them for the obsticles and problems they're
going to face, again--I think you'd see some positive results.
Sam: Anybody else have something to add?
Sam: Yeah, I mean that's a provacative
question. Did you have a comment?
(QFA:) (inaudible)
(inaudible)
Sam: They're thinking "what's Myspace?" right? (laughing)
Melanie: When was that? Eighth grade? Ninth grade?
I'm trying to think... We were probably 14 or 15, or at least I was
probably 14 or 15 when Myspace came out. It was a
huge thing for my friends and
my community. But it was once Facebook allowed people
not from colleges to sign on, and once people started that,
Facebook just had a huge impact on social media and
everyone pretty much just quit myspace. I don't know... I mean
it was just because Facebook was such a better way with communicating with people,
and a lot less creepy than Myspace.
Evan: Just to add to that--I was
relatively avid Myspace user back in
I don't know, 9th or 10th grade just because that's where
the people were. There was also
still a big Xanga* subculture that I
was also a part of. But once Facebook came around
and once I realized all of the messages
I was getting on Myspace were from robots asking me if I wanted
to meet sexy single coed's in my area,
I decided to just jump ship and use a better
site.
(QFA:) Is anyone here playing any of the Facebook games?
Things like mafiawars, farmville?
Sam: Yeah, do students play those? Good question.
Max: I don't. The big one that's kind of taken off recently
that I've been noticing is ESPN created a program called
CollegeU which is essentially just like a sports version of Farmville.
They're interesting. I spent my past summer in New York City working for
Major League Baseball. They were actually really exploring this-about how they could
integrate these social media games into
what they're doing as a company, all for the reason that Farmville is making
disgusting amounts of money by selling virtual goods.
Only 3-5% of the people that play Farmville actually buy these
virtual goods, but so many people are signed up and using it that they're
making hundreds of millions annually, so yeah...
Right?! So they were trying to figure out a way to
do that. Apparently ESPN beat them to it. I'd be willing to beat
they're probably bringing in a lot of money as well. I think that it's
a fad that students right now are going through, especially with something like Farmville. It got real popular.
I was getting requests to give me
sheep and stuff online for a bunch of days...
We're like 18-22, I don't know why we
involve ourselves in that. It always seemed really stupid to me. Melanie: I feel
like Farmville is more for the older generation that's on Facebook. Like I get all the requests from
my friends parents, or people like that.
I don't even know. I don't know anything about Farmville because I never tried to play but I always get the
requests from the older people on facebook.
I don't know if that's the same as everyone else. I never personally tapped into farmville.
Apparently it's a really addicting game, and I don't have time for that.
(laughing) Eli: Yeah, I guess in that vain I think that
procrastination is always popular on college campuses.
Farmville and those games are just a way to
procrastinate. I think they're popularity
is a result of that. Sam: (-so let's-) We're taking a couple
extra minutes here just to kind of flesh this out a bit. So let's go to procrastination
and social media. Maybe we can sort of finish on this. I think that
the kind of negative, synical
folk or prospective anyway is that the students are really using social media-it's just a
way to procrastinate. Go in, check my Facebook page and see what my friends are doing, and so on.
But they're not really utilizing it. Can you weigh in on
that a little bit? And first off, let's just
take that as the first question. To what degree is it just procrastination?
You're not being serious about your studies.
Davis: I mean I don't think it's as trivial a social action as just checking in...
I think that people get a big
emotional response from going on to Facebook and from seeing they're friends.
I think one of the instincts is to trivialize it
as procrastination. I'm not sure that encompasses all of what it is,
even though a lot of people do use it to do that.
Sam: Does everybody agree? Yes. Okay, so now-let's link that
to the fact that when I asked the question about what your professors are doing or what you think they could do
you really didn't have a lot to say. So, maybe
a lot of us are sitting back and triviliazing these social media technologies, but we're not
really thinking about all the interesting and innovative ways in which we could be utilizing
it to take our classrooms out into the social lives of our students.
So, any final thoughts about
what we could be doing? You know, if you
were all web geniuses and you have Farmville profits,
(laughing)
What would you want to see? What would you really want to see from your
classes? How would you want your classes linked up to your personal
social lives. Max: Well first off we need a better course management system.
It should maybe mirror some of the things that Google's been doing recently. It think it was Eli that mentioned
they used it for a project in GoogleDocs. If there was some integrative, real time
application somewhere in there where we could be on working together,
I think that would be really great.
I don't think you should look at Facebook. Hopefully we've established by now that that's
separate and more of a personal life thing for us. I guess you use it with
your students, but I would say for the most part
people really view that as more for their private lives, outside
of the classroom. I think THON has set a
great example for how they can use Twitter to engage people. The fact that they are
engaging people is a reason why some many people that are involved with THON have signed up for Twitter
is huge. If anyone didn't notice, they just had their 100 days at THON
celebration the other day. They had a scavengar hunt going on via Twitter in which they were
like giving clues, and everyone following them could see the clue and would then run
to where it was. Now, I don't know that that would nessacarily
work for every student, but maybe we could get to a point where you just want to
get students partcipating, and being more involved. Like offering an extra credit oppertunity
for the people following you on Twitter. Have them
interact more with eachother and with the material outside of class. It might not be
a 100% requirement in order to perform well, and I don't think it should be because everyone
might not want to be involved with Twitter or other social media
application, but it's not bad to reward those who do because
those are the people are giving the classroom and what you're teaching a little bit of extra attention.
Sam: Anything else? Anyone want to add something? What you'd see in your
ideal world? David: Well I mean, we made the point
on the panel that Facebook is kind of a different space than the academic
culture, but I think the fact remains that 500,000,000
Facebook users can't be wrong. (-There is a strong-)
That's a strong endorsment of the modality of interaction on Facebook,
and if they're was a way to crystalize those
and bring them back into Angel or whatever the next version
of it is could be powerful. Eli: I think
when we introduced ourselves, we talked about Yammer and I think that
Yammer presents a really interesting oppertunity
to do something like Davis was saying. Using
Facebook for academic purposes. The way it works
is you have a Yammer for your domain name--so for example, onwardstate.com-
you can't join our Yammer unless you have an Onward State domain name. So
If we could (-course management software-wise,-)
instead of a domain name, make it a course designation
or something like that, you could have this network where
different classmates could intereact. You could post linkes. You have
hashtags. Eventually you'll be able to chat,
like you can on Facebook. I think that
takes the Facebook popularity and
usuability and puts it more towards the academic side.
Evan: Yeah, and that seems to be one of the biggest problems
I see with Angel besides some of the technical things, is that
it still feels very academic and intimidating
for a lot of people. You go to an Angel discussion board and you just
see a list of topics that just looks like
and excel spreadsheet. People aren't
encouraged to reply or interact on there because they just think, "oh this is
work," but if it's set up in an
Facebook-esque interface, then people already know how to use
that and would be more willing to engage with other people.
(inaudible)
I don't have teenage children (inaudible)
I suspect that perhaps (inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
(inaudible)
do you think that that would be appealing to
those of you that are really thoughtful and mindful
of social media? Sam: In other words, an independent study
to hold our hands and sit at our desks.
(QFA:) Basically to tutor your instructor. Sam: do you think people would be into that?
I think that's a good idea. Sort of like the Teaching Learning Assistants-the TLA's
that we had for a while. Okay so we really need to
cut, but... (QFA:) I did want to also say with the .com
which is a set of training tutorials from IBS training,
they actually have tutorials on Facebook for people our age.
They have them for iTunes and other social media tools
we utilize. Sam: So there's a lot. Hey listen, thanks a lot you all!
(applause)