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>> WE'LL FIND OUT WHAT'S NEW AND
EXPANDED IN THE LATEST EDITION
OF HER BOOK, "INDIAN NATIONS OF
WISCONSIN, HISTORIES OF
ENDURANCE AND RENEWAL."
THE AUTHOR, A TELEVISION
VETERAN, DR. PATTY LOEW, IS MY
SPECIAL GUEST NEXT ON "I
REMEMBER."
>> HI, I'M JIM PECK.
WELCOME TO "I REMEMBER."
JOINING ME TONIGHT IS
DR. PATTY LOEW.
A FORMER JOURNALIST, SHE'S
CURRENTLY A COLLEGE PROFESSOR AS
WELL AS A DOCUMENTARY FILM
PRODUCER.
AND SHE'S ALSO AN AUTHOR.
LET'S TAKE A LOOK.
>> NOW A PROFESSOR IN THE
DEPARTMENT OF LIFE SCIENCES
COMMUNICATION AT UW-MADISON,
PATTY LOEW WAS A PRODUCER AND
HOST FOR WISCONSIN PUBLIC
TELEVISION FOR MANY YEARS.
IN 2007, HER DOCUMENTARY, "WAY
OF THE WARRIOR" AIRED ON PBS.
IT EXAMINED THE LONG TRADITION
OF MILITARY SERVICE BY AMERICAN
INDIANS.
CORPORAL MITCHELL RED CLOUD JR.,
WHO POSTHUMOUSLY RECEIVED THE
CONGRESSIONAL MEDAL OF HONOR FOR
HIS HEROIC ACTIONS IN KOREA, WAS
A HO CHUNK TRIBAL MEMBER.
THE TRADITION IS ALSO NOTED IN
DR. LOEW'S BOOK, "INDIAN NATIONS
OF WISCONSIN, HISTORIES OF
ENDURANCE AND RENEWAL."
SHE HIGHLIGHTS A HERITAGE THAT
BEGAN LONG BEFORE WISCONSIN
BECAME A STATE, HONORING THE
PEOPLE WHO WERE ALREADY HERE
WHEN EUROPEANS ARRIVED.
TRIBAL HISTORIES OF THE SEVEN
INDIAN NATIONS CURRENTLY IN
WISCONSIN ARE INCLUDED.
AS THEIR LAND WAS REDUCED, THE
MENOMINEE WERE SUSTAINED BY THE
FOREST AND TEND TO IT TODAY.
THE HO CHUNK, "THE PEOPLE OF THE
SACRED LANGUAGE," ARE
LINGUISTICALLY LINKED TO OTHER
TRIBES ACROSS THE COUNTRY.
THE OJIBWE RETURNED FROM THE
EAST TO THE GREAT LAKES REGION,
THEIR ORIGINAL HOME, WHERE THEY
FOUND WILD RICE, "THE FOOD THAT
GROWS ON WATER."
THE POTAWATOMI, WHO REFER TO
THEMSELVES AS THE "KEEPERS OF
THE FIRE," ALSO MOVED BACK FROM
THE EASTERN SEABOARD.
WHEN THE ONEIDA LIVED IN THE
EAST, THEY PROVIDED FOOD
SUPPLIES TO GEORGE WASHINGTON AT
VALLEY FORGE.
THE STOCKBRIDGE-MUNSEE BAND OF
MOHICAN INDIANS BEGAN ARRIVING
IN THE 1820'S.
THE REVISED SECOND EDITION OF
HER BOOK INCLUDES A CHAPTER ON
THE BROTHERTOWN INDIAN NATION,
AND THEIR ONGOING STRUGGLE FOR
FEDERAL RECOGNITION AS A TRIBE.
INDIAN SUMMER FESTIVAL, HELD FOR
MORE THAN 25 YEARS ON
MILWAUKEE'S LAKEFRONT, IS
CELEBRATED IN A NEW CHAPTER ON
URBAN INDIANS.
PATTY LOEW IS A MEMBER OF THE
BAD RIVER BAND OF LAKE SUPERIOR
OJIBWE.
SHE REACHED OUT TO NATIVE ELDERS
AND TRIBAL HISTORIANS TO PRESENT
A HISTORY FROM ORIGIN STORIES TO
EVENTS OF THE 21st CENTURY.
ANOTHER BOOK BY PATTY LOEW IS
"NATIVE PEOPLE OF WISCONSIN"
WRITTEN FOR ELEMENTARY AND
MIDDLE SCHOOL READERS.
>> YOU KNOW, I WAS THINKING AS I
WAS WALKING INTO OF THE BUILDING
TODAY FROM MY CAR THAT IT'S
COLD, AS WE TAPE THIS SHOW, IT'S
THE MIDDLE OF DEER SEASON IN
2013 AND IT'S SO COLD, THAT
HUNTERS AREN'T EVEN GOING OUT IN
THE WOODS.
I GOT THINKING, HOW DID THE
INDIANS SURVIVE WINTERS IN
WISCONSIN?
>> WELL, THEY MADE REALLY NICE
WARM WIG WAMS AND FUR AND
LEATHER AND ALL SORTS OF THINGS
THAT PEOPLE USED BEFORE THE
ADVENT OF COMMERCIAL CLOTHING.
>> I KIND OF WONDER WHY ANYONE
WOULD WANT TO SETTLE HERE, WHEN
THEY COULD HAVE BEEN IN FLORIDA
OR THE CAROLINAS?
>> OH, WHY WOULDN'T YOU WANT TO
SETTLE HERE.
WE HAVE FISH, WE'VE GOT DEER, WE
HAVE BERRIES AND ALL KINDS OF
WILD FORGEABLES.
>> WIND, ALL THAT STUFF.
RECENTLY, A GROUP OF CODETALKERS
FROM WORLD WAR II WERE
RECOGNIZED BY THE GOVERNMENT
WITH A MEDAL.
>> RIGHT.
RIGHT.
THIS WEEK, THE CONGRESSIONAL
GOLD MEDAL.
>> AND I DIDN'T REALIZE UNTIL
THAT MOMENT THAT, BECAUSE THEY
ALWAYS TALK ABOUT THE NAVAJO
CODETALKERS, WE HAD CODETALKERS
FROM WISCONSIN.
>> WE DID AND THE NAVAJO WERE
NOT THE FIRST CODETALKERS.
THE CHOCTAW ACTUALLY USED CODE
TALKING IN WORLD WAR I AND
COVERED SOME MAJOR BATTLES, IN
INCLUDING THE RETREAT OF
MEUSE-ARGONNE, SO THE OWE
ONEIDA, OJIBWE, COMANCHE, HOPI,
NAVAJO, A NUMBER OF TRIBES, I
THINK THE NAVAJO JUST HAD BETTER
PUBLIC RELATIONS.
>> WERE THERE OTHER TRIBES
RECOGNIZED AS WELL.
>> THERE WERE AND THAT'S WHAT
THAT CEREMONY WAS ALL ABOUT.
>> BY THE WAY, SHOULD I BE
SAYING NATIVE AMERICANS OR CAN I
USE INDIAN?
>> I'M ALWAYS ASKED THAT AND --
>> I BET YOU ARE.
>> MOST NATIVE PEOPLE WOULD
PREFER TO BE ADDRESSED USING
THEIR TRIBAL AFFILIATION.
I'M OJIBWE, FOR EXAMPLE.
BUT SOMETIMES YOU JUST HAVE TO
USE THE AGGREGATE AND FOR ME, IN
NATIVE AMERICANS, AMERICAN
INDIANS INDIGENOUS, I DON'T HAVE
A PROBLEM WITH ANY OF THOSE
TERMS.
SOME PEOPLE DO AND IT'S ALWAYS
GOOD TO ASK AS YOU DID.
>> WERE THE INDIANS ACTIVE IN
WORLD WAR I AND II?
>> THEY WERE, MY GRANDFATHER WAS
ONE OF 12,000 AMERICAN INDIANS
WHO VOLUNTEERED FOR SERVICE IN
WORLD WAR I AND I ALWAYS IMAGINE
HIM WITH HIS HAND RAISED TAKING
THE OATH PROMISING TO PROTECT
THE U.S. CONSTITUTION, AND HE
WASN'T A CITIZEN, SO HE HAD NO
BENEFITS UNDER THAT
CONSTITUTION.
AND MANY OF THE SOLDIERS, THE
NATIVE SOLDIERS WHO VOLUNTEERED
WERE NOT CITIZENS.
BUT THEY HAD COME OUT OF THIS
BOARDING SCHOOL TRADITION WHERE
IT WAS VERY MILITARY -- IT WAS A
MILITARYISTIC ENVIRONMENT, THEY
MARCHED TO SCHOOL, THEY MARCHED
TO THE DORMS, MARCHED TO THE
MESS HALL, DRILLED AT 5:00 A.M.
IN THE MORNING WITH LITTLE WOOD
I DIDN'T
WOOD -- WOODEN RIFLES.
AS ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES
DESCRIBED IT, A SEAMLESS
TRANSITION FROM THE BOARDING
SCHOOLS INTO THE FRONT LINES.
>> THERE CERTAINLY IS AN IRONY
THERE THAT'S HARD TO MISS, THAT
THEY ARE -- THEY ARE TAKING UP
ARMS AND FIGHTING FOR THE
COUNTRY THAT TOOK EVERYTHING
FROM THEM.
>> RIGHT.
BUT -- AND I ACTUALLY DID A
DOCUMENTARY A COUPLE OF YEARS
AGO, WE HAD THE WARRIOR, ABOUT
THAT VERY THING, AND I TOO FOUND
IT VERY IRONIC.
AND IF YOU READ THE HISTORY
BOOKS, THE EXPLANATIONS ARE,
WELL, THEY'RE POOR, YOU KNOW,
PEOPLE WANT THREE SQUARE MEALS
AND A PLACE TO SLEEP OR THEY
WANT ADVENTURE.
AND YET, WHEN I TALK TO NATIVE
VETERANS, NONE OF THOSE REASONS
CAME UP.
ONE OF MY FAVORITE STORIES WAS
ACTUALLY A MENOMINEE VETERAN
WHICH, BY THE WAY, HAD A 78%
ACTIVE RATE AMONG MENOMINEE MEN
AGES 18-44 DURING DESERT STORM.
78% OF THE MEN ELIGIBLE WERE
ACTUALLY SERVING IN ACTIVE OR
RESERVE DUTY, BUT -- SO I HAD
THIS CONVERSATION WITH THE
MENOMINEE VETERAN AT A POWWOW IN
CHICAGO AND I SAID WHY DID YOU
ENLIST DURING THE VIETNAM ERA
AND HE SAID WELL, YOU KNOW, THE
MENOMINEE, MY TRIBE, SIGNED A
PEACE AND FRIENDSHIP TREATY WITH
THE U.S. GOVERNMENT IF 1827 AND
WE PROMISED TO COME TO THE
SERVICE OF THE U.S., SHOULD IT
EVER NEED US, AN EVEN THOUGH THE
U.S. HAS BROKEN EVERY TREATY IT
EVER SIGNED WITH US, WE'RE STILL
ON ORGANIZE OUR OBLIGATIONS.
-- HONORING OUR OBLIGATIONS AND
I PULLED MY JAW UP OFF THE FLOOR
AND SAID, I THINK THERE'S A
DOCUMENTARY HERE.
>> ABSOLUTELY.
YOUR GRANDFATHER WAS A VETERAN
OF WORLD WAR I.
>> RIGHT.
>> AND THERE'S A GREAT STORY
ABOUT HIS HELMET.
>> HELMET COMING BACK TO ME,
RIGHT.
RA COUPLE OF YEARS AGO, I GOT
THIS CALL FROM A GENTLEMAN IN
JOLIET, ILLINOIS, SAYING I THINK
I HAVE YOUR GRANDFATHER'S
HELMET.
WORLD WAR I HELMET.
AND HE HAD ALWAYS NOTICED THE
NAME DENOMIE, WRITTEN ON THE
INSIDE OF THE HELMET, BUT THIS
WAS, YOU KNOW, DURING THE -- IN
THE DAYS BEFORE THE INTERNET,
AND THE SEARCHES THAT, YOU KNOW,
WE NOW ALL DO ROUTINELY.
AND SO HE JUST TUCKED IT AWAY
AMONG HIS WAR COLLECTION AND
FORGOT ABOUT IT.
AND HIS DAUGHTER, WHO IS AN
ELEMENTARY SCHOOL TEACHER A
COUPLE OF YEARS ARCS -- AGO,
ASKED IF SHE COULD BORROW ITEMS
FOR SHOW AND TELL AND HE GAVE IT
TO HER AND SHE SAID WHO IS THIS
DENOMIE GUY AND HE ALWAYS WANTED
TO KNOW, SO THEY GOOGLED THE
NAME AND BECAUSE MY DOCUMENTARY
WAS AIRING THAT MONTH ON PBS, MY
NAME CAME UP AND HE CALLED ME,
TURNED OUT HE GRADUATED FROM THE
UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN-MADISON
IN THE COLLEGE OF AGRICULTURE
AND LIFE SCIENCES, WHERE I
TEACH, AND SO IT -- HE'S
ACTUALLY BEEN COMING TO OUR
FAMILY REUNIONS AND HE'S SORT OF
PART OF THE FAMILY NOW.
>> WHAT A WONDERFUL STORY.
>> IT WAS.
IT REALLY WAS.
>> AFTER ALL THOSE YEARS.
DID YOU ALWAYS IDENTIFY YOURSELF
AS AN INDIAN WOMAN?
>> YOU KNOW, WHEN I WAS LITTLE,
I DIDN'T.
I GREW UP HERE IN MILWAUKEE.
I GREW UP IN THE PARKLAWN
HOUSING PROJECT, AND IT WAS A
MULTIRACIAL, MULTIETHNIC
ENVIRONMENT, BUT NO NATIVE
AMERICANS THAT I REMEMBER EVER
MEETING.
AND EVEN THOUGH I WOULD SPEND MY
SUMMERS ON THE
LAC COURTE OREILLES RESERVATION,
WHERE MY AUNT AND UNCLE LIVED, I
NEVER REALLY THOUGHT MUCH AS A
CHILD, IT DIDN'T OCCUR TO ME
THAT IF I HAD AN AUNT AND
KUNG-FU WHO WERE NATIVE THAT
MAYBE I WAS NATIVE TOO.
IT WASN'T UNTIL THE MID 1960'S
AND THE LATE 1960'S WHEN BLACK
CIVIL RIGHTS, YOU KNOW, MIGRANT
WORKERS, THE WOMEN'S MOVEMENT,
THE ANTI-WAR PROTESTS, AND RED
POWER, THE AMERICAN INDIAN
MOVEMENT, REALLY BEGAN THAT
IMMANE TO GET REALLY -- I BEGAN
TO GET REALLY INTERESTED AND
BEGAN TO READ AS MUCH AS I COULD
AND THAT'S WHERE MY IDENTITY
BEGAN TO FORM.
>> IT MUST HAVE BEEN ODD
READING, I'M THINKING OF YOUR
CHILDREN'S TEXTBOOKS AND
HISTORY, AND READING WHAT THEY
WERE WRITING BACK THEN ABOUT
INDIANS.
AND SAYING --
>> STILL WRITING ABOUT INDIANS.
>> REALLY?
>> AND SAYING, WAIT A MINUTE,
THAT'S CRAZY.
IS THAT KIND OF WHAT HAPPENED TO
YOU.
>> WELL, YES.
I MEAN, I WISH THAT I'D HAD A
DIFFERENT KIND OF EDUCATION BUT
EVEN YOU KNOW, MY OWN BOYS NOW
ARE IN THEIR LATE TEENS AND
EARLY 20'S, BUT EVEN THE
MATERIAL THAT WAS COMING HOME
WITH THEM WAS REALLY
PROBLEMATIC, AND YOU KNOW, WHEN
YOU ASK QUESTIONS LIKE, YOU
KNOW, COLUMBUS SAILED THE OCEAN
BLUE IN 1492.
>> AND DISCOVERED --
>> WHERE WOULD WE BE IF
COLUMBUS, YOU KNOW, HADN'T
ARRIVED.
WELL, FOR A NATIVE CHILD, THAT'S
A PRETTY INTERESTING QUESTION.
>> HAD A BIGGER HOUSE AND BETTER
VIEW.
A BETTER IMMIGRATION POLICY.
>> AND WE STILL WOULD HAVE HAD
THAT WATERFRONT PROPERTY THAT WE
DON'T HAVE NOW.
>> EXACTLY.
LET GO BACK, WAY BACK IN HISTORY
, BECAUSE YOU STARTED
"INDIAN NATIONS OF WISCONSIN"
WITH FASCINATING THINGS THAT I
WASN'T AWARE OF WHEN WAS
WISCONSIN SETTLED OR THIS WHOLE
AREA SETTLED?
>> WELL, THERE'S A COUPLE OF
DIFFERENT ANSWERS TO THAT.
IF YOU LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, IF YOU
READ AN ARCHAEOLOGY TEXT OR AN
ANCIENT HISTORY TEXT, YOU'LL GET
ONE ANSWER, BUT I LIKE TO START
WITH THE STORIES FROM THE
TRIBES, WHICH AREN'T LINEAR
ORIENTED, THEY'RE MUCH MORE
SPATIAL ORIENTED, SO YOU GET
TERMS LIKE LONG AGO.
IS THAT BEFORE THE ICE AGE, IS
IT AFTER THE ICE AGE?
MANY OF THE TRIBES IN THE UPPER
GREAT LAKES REGION HAVE FLOOD
STORIES.
>> THAT FASCINATED ME.
>> YES.
SO ARE THESE STORIES THAT RELATE
TO THE GLACIALS RECEDE, IS THIS
WHY THE OJIBWE LEFT, BECAUSE OF
A FLOOD AND MIGRATED EAST AND
THEN CAME BACK FOLLOWING A
CRISIS AND A PROPHECY THAT TOLD
THEM TO GO BACK TO YOUR ORIGINAL
HOMES WHERE THE FOOD GROWS ON
WATER.
YOU KNOW, SO THESE ARE THE KIND
OF STORIES THAT REALLY FASCINATE
ME.
THERE'S A WONDERFUL STORY ABOUT
THE HO CHUNK THAT STARTS WITH A
CAVE IN SOUTHWESTERN IOWA
COUNTY, WHERE YOU HAVE POTTERY
SHARDS FROM THE EFFIGY MOUND
BUILDERS, WHO WERE THE ANCESTORS
OF THE HO CHUNK, AND THE
MISSISSIPPIANS, WHO WERE THE
FOLKS THAT BUILT AZTALAN AND WHO
NOW, WE ASSOCIATE WITH THE CREEK
AND CHEROKEE AND CHICKASAW
PEOPLE OF THE SOUTHEAST AND
THESE TWO CULTURES CAME TOGETHER
IN THAT CAVE ALONG WITH MANMADE
SOILS THAT WERE ONLY FOUND IN
EASTERN CARE KEY BURIAL, YOU
KNOW, SITES, SO WE KNOW THAT
THERE WERE -- THIS WAS CONTACT
BETWEEN THESE DIFFERENT GROUPS.
>> IS THIS THE GOTTSCHALL CAVE?
>> IT IS, AND THEN THERE'S THAT
WONDERFUL STORY FROM THE
HO CHUNK THAT TALKS ABOUT
FIGHTING THE GIANTS, AND THE
CAHOKIANS, THE AZTALAN PEOPLE
AND MISSISSIPPIAN PEOPLE WHOSE
POTTERY SHARDS WERE IN THAT
CAVE.
THEY WERE QUITE TALL.
IN SOME CASES, THEY WERE OVER
6 FEET TALL.
THE HO CHUNK AT THAT TIME WERE
MAYBE 5 FEET TALL.
>> WE'RE TALKING A LONG LONG
TIME AGO.
>> SOMEONE WHO IS A FOOT TALLER
THAN YOU MIGHT LOGICALLY BE
DESCRIBED AS A GIANT, SO THESE
ARE THE KINDS OF STORIES THAT I
JUST FIND REALLY FASCINATE, AND
I LOVE TO CONNECT THE DOTS.
>> YOU TALK IN THERE ABOUT
PAINTINGS THAT WERE IN THAT.
WHAT KIND OF PAINTINGS WERE
THEY?
>> THIS RELATES TO THIS STORY
ABOUT THE HO CHUNK STORY ABOUT
FIGHTING THE GIANTS.
THERE'S THIS HUGE COMPOSITE
DRAWING OF RED HORN AND HIS TWO
FRIENDS, THUNDERBIRD AND STORMS
AS HE WALKS, WHO HAVE ALL THESE
ADVENTURES AND FIGHT THE GIANTS
AND ULTIMATELY,, AFTER EACH
CONTEST, THE WINNER GETS TO
ANNIHILATE THE OTHER SIDE AND
SO --
>> NOTHING --
>> YOU KNOW, HEADS ROLLED IN
BALLGAMES LITERALLY, HEADS
ROLLED.
BUT ULTIMATELY, THE GIANTS
PREVAIL, AND RED HORN AND HIS
BUDDIES ARE SMASHED TO PIECES
AND THEIR BONES CARRIED OFF, AND
RED HORN'S SONS GO AND AVENGE
THEM, AND IT'S A REALLY
FASCINATING STORY.
AND IT TELLS US LESS ABOUT YOU
KNOW, WHETHER SOMETHING LIKE
THAT COULD BE TRUE OR NOT,
BECAUSE RED HORN IN THESE
STORIES WEARS HUMAN HEADS AS
EARRINGS.
BUT IT TELLS US A LOT ABOUT WHO
THE HO CHUNK MIGHT HAVE COME
INTO CONTACT WITH, AND WHY
AZTALAN MIGHT HAVE BEEN PAL
SAIDED AND AZTALAN EVENTUALLY
DECLINED AND THE PEOPLE
DISAPPEARED.
>> YOU MENTIONED, GO BACK TO
WHERE THEY CAME FROM, WHERE THE
FOOD GROWS ON WATER.
>> THE WILD RICE.
>> WHERE DID AT THE GO?
>> WELL, INITIALLY, THE
ANISHINAABE, IF YOU BELIEVE THE
ANISHINAABE OLDEST STORIES, WERE
HERE IN THE UPPER GREAT LAKES
REGION, THERE'S A FLOOD, WE
TRAVEL EAST, WE LIVE ON EITHER
SIDE OF THE ST. LAWRENCE SEAWAY
ON THE EAST COAST AND THEN
THERE'S A CRISIS, WHICH I THINK
WAS THE INTRODUCTION OF THE
EUROPEAN DISEASES FROM VIKING
ENCOUNTERS, WHICH ARE VERY WELL
DESCRIBED IN THE ICELANDIC SAGAS
AND THEN THE PROPHECY TELLS THEM
TO FOLLOW A MEGIS SHELL, WHICH
WILL LEAD THEM BACK TO WHERE THE
FOOD GROWS ON WATNEYER.
WE KNOW THAT BY ABOUT 1300'S,
THE EARLY -- OR THE LATTER PART
OF THE 14th CENTURY, THE
OJIBWE ARE BACK AROUND THE
MADELINE ISLAND AREA, AT LEAST
THAT'S WHAT MY RESEARCH TELLS
ME.
>> DO WE KNOW WHAT THE LAND
LOOKED LIKE THEN OR DO WE HAVE
ANY IDEA HOW MANY PEOPLE MIGHT
HAVE BEEN HERE?
CAHOKIA WAS A HUGE AREA.
>> CAHOKIA WAS A CITY OF 50,000
PEOPLE AND THAT WAS NEAR
ST. LOUIS, IN PRESENT DAY
ILLINOIS, JUST DIRECTLY ACROSS
FROM THE ARCH.
YOU KNOW, WE -- IT EBBS AND
FLOWS, BECAUSE AS AGRICULTURE IS
INTRODUCED, SOME TIME AROUND
600, 800 A.D., PEOPLE START
STAYING PUT AND VILLAGES GET
LARGER, BUT THEN BECAUSE PEOPLE
ARE LIVING IN CLOSE PROXIMITY,
THEY'RE MORE SUSCEPTIBLE TO
DISEASE, AND SO THE HO CHUNK
ONCE WERE A VERY, VERY LARGE
TRIBE AND SOME TIME, MAYBE
AROUND IN THE 1500'S, THERE'S
THIS MAJOR SPLIT, AND THE PEOPLE
WE NOW KNOW AS THE MISSOURI AND
THE IOWA SPLIT AND LEAVE PAIN
BECAUSE THE MILLAGES HAVE GOTTEN
TOO LARGE AND THE ENVIRONMENT
CAN'T SUSTAIN THEM.
IN THE NORTHERN PART OF
WISCONSIN, THE OJIBWE ARE MOVING
IN SMALLER, YOU KNOW, MORE
EXTENDED FAMILY UNITS.
AND SO THEY'RE NOT QUITE GETTING
HIT WITH THE SAME -- THEY'RE
GETTING -- THEY'RE COMING IN
CONTACT WITH THE SAME DISEASES,
BUT THEIR POPULATIONS AREN'T AS
AFFECTED BECAUSE THEY'RE LIVING
IN SMALLER UNITS.
>> I SEE.
>> WHO WAS ANTOINE DENOMIE.
>> ANTOINE DENOMIE, NORTH OF
HIGHWAY 8, SOUTH OF HIGHWAY A.
ANTOINE DENOMIE WAS MY GREAT
GREAT UNCLE.
>> FASCINATING PERSON.
>> WAS HE EVER.
HE WAS LISTED AS -- HE WAS
DESCRIBED AS AN AGITATOR BY THE
INDIAN AGENT, WHO WAS QUITE
CORRUPT, AND HE WAS EVICTED FROM
THE RESERVATION BECAUSE MY
GREAT, GREAT WAS -- HE WAS
REACTING TO ALL OF THE
SKULLDUGGERY GOING ON BETWEEN
THE INDIAN AGENT AND THE STELNS
LUMPER COMPANY AND GATHERING X'S
AND SIGNATURES AND SENDING THAT
INFORMATION TO THE BUREAU OF
CATHOLIC INDIAN MISSIONS IN
WASHINGTON, D.C., SO THE INDIAN
AGENT EVICTION HIM FROM THE
RESERVATION.
MY GREAT, GREAT UNCLE GOES TO
THE ALASKA GOLD RUSH POSING AS
AN ITALIAN, BECAUSE INDIANS
COULDN'T TAKE PART IN THE
ALASKAN GOLD RUSH AND HE STRIKES
GOLD, ONE CLAIM SOUTH OF THE
BONANZA, WHICH WAS THE RICHEST
PAYING CLAIM DURING THE ALASKAN
GOLD RUSH, COMES BACK AND STARTS
A NEWSPAPER AND GOES AFTER THIS
INDIAN AGENT, HELPS TO GET
LA FOLLETTE HERE IN THE FALL OF
1909.
>> THIS IS FIGHTING BOB.
>> FIGHTING BOB, BRINGS HIS
SENATE INDIAN AFFAIRS COMMITTEE,
PUTS HIM ON A TRAIN, THEY VISIT
ALL THE RESERVATIONS IN
WISCONSIN DURING THE FALL OF
1909, COLLECT ORAL TESTIMONY
ABOUT ALL OF THE CORRUPTION AND
GRAFT AND SKULLDUGGERY GOING ON
ADD THE INDIAN AGENT ACTUALLY
LOSES HIS JOB BECAUSE OF
OFFICIAL MISCONDUCT, AND
MISAPPROPRIATION OF INDIAN
MONEYS.
>> A HAPPY ENDING.
>> THE FOREST COUNTY POTAWATOMI,
WHICH WERE LANDLESS, WERE ABLE
TO GET A RESERVATION DURING THIS
PERIOD OF TIME, SO A LOT OF GOOD
CAME OUT OF THAT SENATE HEARING.
>> ANTOINE MUST HAVE BEEN QUITE
A GUY AND HE WAS A NEWSPAPER
PUBLISHER.
>> HE WAS.
HE WAS A NEWSPAPER PURPLISHER.
>> HE WAS EDUCATED?
>> HE WAS MISSION EDUCATED, BY
THE CATHOLICS AT -- ON MADELINE
ISLAND, AND HIS CHILDREN WENT TO
SCHOOL AT ST. MARY'S BOARDING
SCHOOL ON THE BAD RIVER
RESERVATION, HIS OLDEST DAUGHTER
BECAME A NUN, IF YOU KNOW WHAT
WAS GOING ON, REALLY INTERESTING
POLITICAL TIME AT THE TURN OF
THE CENTURY, BECAUSE THERE'S
THIS TENSION BETWEEN THE
CATHOLICS AND THE PROTESTANTS,
WHICH IS WHY MY GREAT GREAT IS
TRYING TO GET THE BUREAU OF
CATHOLIC INDIAN MISSIONS TO
AGITATE AGAINST THE -- WHAT THEY
PERCEIVED AS THE CORRUPT
PROTESTANT GOVERNMENT STRUCTURE
SUPPORTING THE INDIAN
RESERVATION SYSTEM HERE IN
WISCONSIN.
AND THE INDIAN AGENT WAS ALSO
KIND OF A MINOR STALWART
REPUBLICAN AT A TIME WHEN BOB
LA FOLLETTE'S PROGRESSIVE STAR
IS RISING AND THE PARTY IS ABOUT
TO FRACTURE.
SO REALLY INTERESTING, GREAT
DRAMA.
>> WOW.
HOW DO YOU FIND ALL OF THIS OUT?
>> LOTS OF TIME IN ARCHIVES.
>> LOOKING AT THE MICROFILM AND
THINGS BACK THEN.
>> PART OF IT.
BUT FOR ME, THE BEAUTY OF THIS
BOOK REALLY IS THE ORAL
TRADITION, AND I REALLY TRIED TO
FIND STORIES THAT COULD BE TOLD
WITHOUT TEXT.
SO THE, YOU KNOW, THE ORAL
STORIES, THE DANCES, EVEN POWWOW
REGALIA.
>> THERE'S A PICTURE OF YOU IN
THERE WEARING A NATIVE DRESS
THAT IS JUST STUNNING.
>> MADE BY MY MOTHER, AND THE
BEAD WORK PATTERN THAT YOU SEE
RELATES TO MY FAMILY ANCESTRY.
>> SHE WAS AN ARTIST.
>> SHE WAS AN ARTIST.
ACTUALLY, WHEN INDIAN SUMMERFEST
WAS CREATED, BACK IN THE MID
1980'S, SHE CREATED THE FIRST
INDIAN FLAG.
>> REALLY?
>> RIGHT.
THE FEATHER BANNER.
>> AND SHE HAS A STORY IN
WORLD WAR II ALSO, DIDN'T THEY
WORK ON A VERY FAMOUS INVENTION?
>> YES, SHE DID.
SHE HAD ACTUALLY GRADUATED FROM
HIGH SCHOOL AT 16, KIND OF AN
OVERACHIEVER, AND WANTED TO BE A
DRESS DESIGNER, AND ENROLLED IN
LAYTON SCHOOL OF ART, WHICH IS
NOW THE MILWAUKEE SCHOOL OF ART
AND DESIGN, I BELIEVE, AND
BECAUSE SHE HAD THIS ARTISTIC
ABILITY AND SHE WAS REALLY GOOD
AT MATH, THE PERFEX CORPORATION,
WHICH WAS A DEFENSE CONTRACTOR
AT THAT PERIOD OF TIME, PUT HER
IN THE BLUEPRINT SECTION AND HAD
HER WORK ON THE DESIGN OF THE
NORDEN BOMB SITE AND DESIGNING
TORPEDO BEDS IN SUBMARINES.
>> WOW.
ONE OF THE THINGS YOU TALK ABOUT
IN YOUR BOOK IS URBAN INDIANS.
YOU WRITE A WHOLE CHAPTER ON
THAT.
WHAT IS THE SITUATION WITH URBAN
INDIANS NOW IN WISCONSIN?
>> WELL, IT'S MUCH BETTER THAN
IT WAS.
YOU KNOW, WHEN URBAN INDIANS --
WENT NATIVE PEOPLE RELOCATED TO
THE CITIES, DURING WORLD WAR II,
PRIMARILY TO TAKE THE JOBS, THE
PEOPLE WHO GOT JOBS IN THE
DEFENSE INDUSTRY WERE VACATING,
THEY WEREN'T ROSEIE THE
RIVETERS, THEY WERE CLEAN HOTELS
AND BEING MAIDS FOR THE WOMEN
WHO TOOK THE ROSIE THE RIVETER
JOBS.
SOME OF THEM STAYED, SOME
RETURNED TO THEIR RESERVATIONS,
THEY LOST THEIR JOBS WHEN THE
WHITE G.I.'S CAME BACK, AND THEN
THERE WAS A VERY CONCERTED
EFFORT ON THE PART OF THE
GOVERNMENT TO RELOCATE URBAN
INDIANS TO AREAS LIKE MILWAUKEE
DURING THE 1950'S, AND THEY WERE
PROMISED JOBS AND, YOU KNOW, THE
BROCHURES THAT SHOWED UP ON THE
RESERVATION HAD THESE BEAUTIFUL
SKYSCRAPERS, AND BASICALLY, WHAT
IT WAS, WAS A ONE-WAY BUS
TICKET, AND DIRECTIONS TO A FLOP
HOUSE.
AND HERE THEY WERE, REALLY STUCK
WITHOUT THE JOBS, WITHOUT THE
DECENT HOUSE, AND WITHOUT THE
SUPPORT NETWORK OR THE CULTURAL
SUPPORT THAT THEY WERE USED TO
ON THE RESERVATIONS.
AND A LOT OF THEM REALLY
LANGUISHED HERE IN THE CITY.
DURING THE 1960'S, THE WAR ON
POVERTY HAD MONEY FOR URBAN
INDIAN CENTERS, THE COMMUNITY
BLOCK DEVELOPMENT GRANTS DURING
THE NIXON ADMINISTRATION HAD
SOME URBAN MONEY FOR CENTERS,
AND URBAN INDIAN PROGRAMS.
BUT REALLY, NATIVE PEOPLE DID
FOR THEMSELVES, AND STRUGGLED TO
SURVIVE.
>> THERE'S A BEAUTIFUL HIGH
SCHOOL THAT JUST OPENED I THINK
RELATIVELY RECENTLY.
>> A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO.
THE INDIAN COMMUNITY SCHOOL OF
MILWAUKEE.
>> WOW, THAT'S GORGEOUS.
>> 278 ACRES IN FRANKLIN.
AND NOT JUST CULTURALLY
APPROPRIATE CURRICULUM INSIDE
THE WALLS.
BUT IF YOU LOOK AT THE DESIGN,
IT'S VERY ORGANIC AND IT BILLS
THE OUTSIDE IN, AND IT'S JUST A
WONDERFUL PLACE TO LEARN.
>> IT'S JUST A WONDERFUL THING.
THIS IS TERRIBLE TO DO TO YOU IN
TWO MINUTES REMAINING, BUT ONE
THING I REALLY WANTED TO TALK
ABOUT, AT LEAST A LITTLE BIT WAS
THE BROTHERTOWN NATION.
>> RIGHT.
WATCH THEM.
THERE'S SOME INTERESTING THINGS
THAT ARE HAPPENING.
THEY LOST THEIR CITIZENSHIP --
THEY ACCEPTED CITIZENSHIP AND
LOST THEIR RESERVATION STATUS.
>> SOME TIME AGO.
>> 1830'S AND BEEN TRYING EVER
SINCE TO GET IT BACK.
THEY'VE GONE THROUGH THIS VERY
ONEROUS PROCESS SET DOWN BY THE
BUREAU OF INDIAN AFFAIRS TO
PROVE THAT THEY'RE INDIANS AND
IT INVOLVED VOLUMES AND VOLUMES
AND VOLUMES OF DOCUMENTS AND
PHOTOS AND GENEALOGY AND SUCH.
ONLY TO FIND OUT AFTER A 30-YEAR
STRUGGLE, THAT WHOOPS, CONGRESS
WAS THE ONE THAT TERMINATED YOU,
CONGRESS IS GOING TO HAVE TO
REINSTATE YOU.
>> OH.
>> SO NOW THEY HAVE TO GO
THROUGH YOU KNOW, THIS OTHER
PROCESS WHERE THEY ACTUALLY HAVE
TO GO TO CONGRESS IN ORDER TO
GET ONE OF OUR CONGRESSIONAL
REPRESENTATIVES TO INTRODUCE A
BILL TO REINSTATE THEM.
SO THAT'S GOING TO BE HAPPENING
I THINK IN THE NEXT COUPLE OF
YEARS.
>> IT SOUNDS LIKE SOMEBODY
DOESN'T WANT THEM TO BE
RECOGNIZED AS A TRIBE.
WHY NOT?
WHO LOSES IF THEY'RE RECOGNIZED?
>> WELL, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT SURE
HOW THE OTHER TRIBES IN THE
STATE FEEL ABOUT THAT.
THEY HAVE SOME AFFINITY WITH THE
NEW YORK TRIBES THAT EMIGRATED
HERE IN THE 1820'S, AND
BROTHERTOWN TRAVELED WITH THEY
WILL, THE ONEIDA AND THE
STOCKBRIDGE, BUT YOU KNOW,
TRIBES HAVE GOT THEIR ECONOMIC
VENTURES WELL ENTRENCHED, SO
THERE MAY BE SOME RESISTANCE
THERE FROM OTHER TRIBES IN
WISCONSIN.
I'M NOT SAYING THAT IT'S GOING
TO HAPPEN FOR SURELY.
IT COULD.
BUT THERE ARE A LOTS OF GROUPS
OF PEOPLE WHO WOULD LIKE TO BE
RECOGNIZED AS NATIVE PEOPLE FOR
REASONS THAT RUN FROM THEY'RE
JUST WANNABES, TO WE WOULD LIKE
IT THROW UP A CASINO SOMEWHERE.
I DON'T THINK THE BROTHERTOWN
FALL IN EITHER ONE OF THOSE
CATEGORIES, BUT WE'LL HAVE TO
SEE.
>> IT'S A FASCINATING STORY AND
ALL ENCAPSULATED IN "INDIAN
NATIONS OF WISCONSIN, HISTORIES
OF ENDURANCE AND RENEWAL,"
DR. PATTY LOEW THANK YOU FOR
BEING WITH US AND THANK YOU FOR
BEING WITH US, I HOPE YOU'LL
JOIN US NEXT TIME AS WE CONTINUE
TO REMEMBER.
THANKS.