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and calling from new york city welcome the program death
i thank you pam
uh... i just wanted to talk to you actually uh...
we did you uh... earlier i want to talk you about why primarily the left in my
opinion is the joke
added at this point
because
it completely loses culture in the mix
and seems to
pretty much except capitalistic culture and sort of
the teknokrat see an everything that goes along with it
and it also speaking of you know obama speech
seems to imply that everything can be taken care of by our government
and our corporations
and policy in front of us
changing our cells or behavior
uh... our culture
and that
and a nut shell
the biggest from the left of it
uh... high amit
if you're talking about anonymity to address the second part of that first
okay
uh... when you're talking about the environment
i mean i think the implication you're saying is that
uh... we're going to ultimately need too
uh... restructure
uh... the way society functions if we're going to have any meaningful uh...
contraction of the the resources that we expand
uh... going forward pretty obvious you know k i mean i hav
let's stipulate that for the
to the sake of this discussion
i would say that in fact
that is not something that we're going to be able to do as individuals that's
going to require
governmental policy
if you're talking about big been huh
i would absolutely had it not about individual choice
but it's about a math sort of
collective consciousness
that has brought together but for the content of of culture and we are nowhere
near it
article
i would really going forward then it could be shake
and the way to shape that
it's not that hard
you have to create institutions
uh... in communities
that further
show that way
of living according that would be you know the way of going into the future
and that's not the hardest thing to do you buy houses
and use that these things up
uh... it's just
pathetic that the left
built throws money at you know one point six million
you know non-profit as a
that kind of adam eyes
you know capitalistic technocratic fifth into the work
it's been a complete failure
you know gets real money together
that up communities schools that teach people
built on the going forward
it not that hollered
you know well here's the difficulty dial
here's the difficulty there
where's that money going to come from
welcome back through i wouldn't hurt the money's gonna come from people on the
left basically calling out liberal who have the money
uh... that includes
sort of me although clearly have gone pretty radical
and uh... you know people liked you
and calling up people like you know america call people up but i was
listening to mark merritt earlier and i love market
but he will uh...
chatting with christine shaw
and that shouting about making it
making
this is what artists are concerned about making it
but that's the problem that means death uh... yeah i think they were for it that
that normative co-written book making it
are you a in there
and well let me let me just response and i think acting kier
i mean i i think you're right about uh...
you know uh...
uh... at least in terms of any criticism of marinara certainly novels certainly
uh... entertain but i think uh... you know the broader point uh... i think
mark man's not not really is not
necessarily the problem but i think the broader point i mean we talked about on
this program a bed and you know i would say
the best
and and and maybe on this program we don't do another viet minh in in part of
it is is you know
uh... as as this show has continued my capacity to sort of a absorbed
uh... sort of the this sort of who pulte role uh...
you know like sort of broader cultural uh...
uh... currents has been somewhat diminished
uh... just out of like sheer lack of time and a m and certainly that my child
has contributed to that but
the most i think relevant interview them
hive dot on this program a lease on this relaunch
uh... in terms of addressing what you're talking about
uh... you think is with fran liebowitz uh... back uh...
this sometime
music two years ago mission ever back on that and the week recovered quite a bit
use november thirtieth twenty eleven
data
and um... it
and and and and i would
anna and i think that's what you're talking about and i think you know uh...
uh... their there has been
in a in a anna i think is actually
a somewhat
recent phenomena
over the past twenty five years
a
total dominance
of money has an ascendant value
to the extent that involved
in in marrying is uh...
you know and a not to become an
certainly
decrepit merit and i don't know i a greater and greater reliability but he
said dancing doing i uh... american express travel with them cuba's would
have been taken aback rimini pw
i got back to that
uh... there's everywhere that that the left
it at the leptin wat it
no
it but the left does not have limit
he has no ability to put a check for the individual because the individual with
the institution right now to the left
and that understanding at this something else but
might be greater than the individual to check
sort of the agreed or the material of the more the
for the defendant theodore of the interest of the individual is just not
there on the left anymore
sublet change i mean this is a problem
something's changed and you know i guess a i think uh... much of this happened
over the past twenty twenty-five years thirty years maybe
wearing in for me
what and that you know i am not
you know i don't know perceive myself as um...
as any less uh... culpable then marinol
what u perceiving he representing uh... at least in my own estimation
and reaffirming the one of the examples i think i use this when i was talking to
fran liebowitz was
uh...
was
what i saw happen with independent film you know in the early nineties where
uh... you know i had made a movie that was uh...
very low budget and
uh...
uh... because of probably more of psychological reasons i could not
uh... i did not want to put myself in a position where was somebody else is
money
because i didn't want to have to listen to them
uh... one thing i noticed going through very quickly that happened in that
independent
film world around that time wise
the the
community that would support
those films
began to adopt
the
uh... the metric of the uh... for did not the for-profit industry but the the
these sort of is established industry
in terms of the the merits of the film in other words
uh...
there was a time in a depends on you know like when a guy like asa values was
making his films where
he would try and get it out there but nobody would measure the quality of his
film based upon its distribution deal they got
whereas what happen in independent film by the mid nineties was
if you have a distribution deal
no one would take your movie seriously even if they were supposedly in that
community
of independent filmmakers
and i found myself having the same reaction evened out arnelle i had made a
good found that did not get distribution at that time
and
that is not the problem
but that is indicative
of the a change that took place in our society where there was not even a
subculture anymore
that
did not
used money
has a gauge too
uh... measure value
and you know that specifically has to do with the arts and some level but i think
is indicative of a of a broader cultural problem and we are so far away
from
um...
from that fight i don't even
know how to
frankly even to engage it
i mean work
so far gone that i i i think we're done frankly but uh... that's my opinion
but uh... you know the you really it really does come down
to delete and they come down to philly are typically especially or close to
being l_r_ paragon for truth and knowledge in value and buxton
his sort of
you know creating though they have more money than they've ever had you know and
you know you know who they are and and you know roseanne pop the big game in a
leash accused father felt an anarchist
and you know
and i love harry belafonte in what he does but even need to be doing more with
these people have a lot of money and i spoke to the article or create a class
and they need to be like stepping up so that my one of my major point
do you know highly um...
without
sort of other trying to position myself uh... outside of
uh... of those people who your indicting because i'm not convinced that i'm not
worthy of that indictment but i think in the main you're right
uh... and uh... you know i think
uh...
the only person that i have come across
uh...
articulates that
uh...
uh... that articulates
that articulates that message
and she was articulating that in and do you know i i was barely aware of her
when we were doing the old majority report
and uh...
uh...
remember when she articulated that to me on
if one of the first or second interviews that she came on this is back in like
two thousand four or two thousand five
when she said the problem here below loaded
chasing her i mean you know how much i mean i i i come from him well so i
understand how much wealth and i understand
how much cardboard aldrich are in and city
milwaukee or whatever but used something if not brain client and
i'm tryin and it's hard but i want to try to be a fun thing and i encourage
those with them but much more in the way of creativity in
anthem
much more aware of resources and
night will ever have
you would be required yeah and i don't mean to and that you end up
and i and i could and i congratulate harry belafonte could be actually called
out people like to use the and others approach does not
quite doing what he expect them to be doing
at their level of wealth and influence
of the real the real question is the real question in in some respects is
what um...
uh... you know assuming that let's not let's not be bleak year for a moment
uh... but assuming that there is that there is a a a possibility for a
cultural change in this is where i would end up with
friendly but at the end of every interview i think i've ever done with it
sort of
where she would say this has to come from the culture
uh... and uh...
the corporate
oil before before you can really planned for the really progressive politics you
have to
you know kind of have the underlying
you know institutions and uh... ideologies there that will print
produced at and help that right opening
that's how i view the culture yeah and the question is is likely know what how
do you
to how does that get impacted and maybe it is you know i mean i think like
did the we uh... there's a chicken-and-egg scenario here is
obviously it may be too late for those uh... artists who are in their forties
in their fifties
uh... their sixties to expect that they're going to have this change
although maybe i don't know uh...
you know uh...
i don't know how that happens but obviously it's gonna happen while these
kids are
abolish people are are teenagers
before they get to that point
where
relate when i think that that's one of the problems that we're asking a
demographic to by their very nature of pollute
worked on themselves their whole life in early
training falcon one nina not often not that they're you know one-dimensional
men and women necessarily but
that day you know really put a lot of themselves into themselves women
you know and uh... you find the certain type of person wont fame and wealth and
get that and if the weather which is this is an iso department
and and i would encourage if anybody knows of anybody's written on this much
you know in a and maybe i should talk to mark crispin miller about this because
the most preserved
sort of important thing i've ever read about this a red
uh... twenty five years ago and actually quoted crispin miller back to him
and did not know that he had written it cuz i couldn't remember who the author
of the book flights
and it was of red rather sort of embarrassing moment when you when you
quote somebody disseminate sag every member who wrote it does that was made
um...
uh... but he had written a wonderful piece in in a book called boxed in
about
uh... television
that i think they would foster wallace uh... quoted in that's how i think i'd
come across it
was um...
about television essentially
the message
from television the the
contextual hoover message of television
is that
uh...
you need to be on television
if that bet to really be important is you need to be on television and it
basically was sending a message of celebrity
and so when i look at it like you know what's happened with you too
where people are
forfeit
based upon
a combination of search engine optimizer asian
and ekdam tell it to
uh... but that
hill like mags talking about making it
he's still for him of the reality is is that
uh... his work and you know getting to true through that work
is still genuinely important to him inouye
uh... that i'm eddie yeah
exists uh... you know in in uh... and and and we get which is using him as an
example because uh...
my cultural uh...
no strip fluency is pretty limited at this point we talk about the same person
uh... but
piaget even away from them
in its capacity to
uh... you know uh...
is measured in its capacity to recommit the new and
uh... acclaim
as opposed to what its central messages posted
to reveal about the uh... human condition
but this is a conversation that www here to justice now but uh... colin moore and
we will to will continue on this
and i would say that if you have anything that you think i should we do
you think there's writers out there who are talking about this
uh... mary pugh
if you are working with a little using celts that you'll
newpostlink book you know that that we could want that one had a great great
great uh...
rapid report that
who have compared the
uh... if there's more those im go to send it into it
prayer at maturity reporters at gmail dot com because i
would love to be able to expand the show in that way
uh... but i just literally don't have enough time of the day to get exposed to
that's often and i'm not even sure where we're double
uh... you know or very little of it but uh... oh i'll tell you anything about
bonded and thanks for the year
becomes a keypad i appreciate they stand
'cause