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>>>Coming up next on "Arizona
Horizon," the upswing in the
Phoenix area's housing market
may be stalling, but the area
has been named one of the best
intergenerational regions in the
country.
And hear from the authors of a
book on Arizona national parks
and monuments, next on "Arizona
Horizon."
>>> "Arizona Horizon" is made
possible by contributions from
the Friends of Eight, members of
your Arizona PBS station.
Thank you.
>>> Good evening, and welcome to
"Arizona Horizon," I'm Richard
Ruelas in for Ted Simons.
A bill that opponents say could
lead to denial of service to
gays and lesbians could be the
first one to make its way to the
Governor's desk this legislative
session.
The bill would allow individuals
to defend themselves from
lawsuits by using religious
beliefs as a defense.
Backers of the bill say it would
protect people like wedding
photographers who did not want
to shoot a gay wedding ceremony.
Those against the bill say it
could block gays and lesbians
from any business and could lead
to companies refusing to hire
anyone who is not Christian.
>>> The 2014 housing market is
expected to slow with big price
increases declining or even
reversing.
Demand has fallen sharply and
investors are showing less
interest in the market.
Mike Orr, director of the Center
For Real Estate Theory and
Practice at ASU's W.P. Carey
School of Business, is here to
talk about his latest report.
Thanks for joining us this
evening.
>> My pleasure.
>> Should we be worried about
what seems to be a slowdown this
year?
>> I think we should expect it
anyway.
Prices going up as much as they
have last year, eventually
demand starts to get depressed.
You can't have prices going up
20, 25% each year without demand
dwindling.
Prices are pretty much back to
where they would have been if we
just applied inflation to where
we were in 2001.
>> If we hadn't had the bubble
>> And the burst, which was so
much fun.
>> It wasn't all that much fun
for most people.
>> Now back to a normal,
balanced price, and demand is
relatively weak in that
situation.
We've really driven away the
investors because we don't have
many bargains anymore.
That was really driving all of
their interest.
They have taken their money and
they are buying elsewhere.
The market is relying on
ordinary buyers and the demand
is weak still partly from the
boom and bust.
>> Are people suffering from not
being able to get financing
still?
>> Well, that's part of the
problem.
A whole group, the Milliennials,
age 20 to 35 who have only seen
a real estate market that got
really scary --
>> It's a market they don't
trust yet?
>> And some are participating in
buying homes to a much lesser
extent than previous
generations.
The rental market is doing well
but homes to purchase are not
doing as well as the baby
boomers did at the same age.
>> What would it take, besides
time, to get their faith back in
the market?
>> That's a really good
question.
They don't have a lot of
examples of people who have
bought homes and done well out
of it.
They are not going to take the
example of their parents.
Many of those actually got
foreclosed, a counter-example.
If you sit them down and say
here's what you're spending on
rent and it would save you money
to buy a home, plus over the
long term, 40 years, generally
owning a home has been a very
good thing to do for your long
term wealth, that's not a
message many of them have
internalized yet.
>> With the investors being out
what does that signal?
>> That means we don't have a
lot of distressed properties at
bargain prices.
That's really a good thing for
the market.
But investors thrive on being
able to buy homes at 25% below
the normal value.
They are still doing fix and
flips, but not many are doing
the fix and then renting out.
Very few new rental homes being
created.
It could become an issue if we
get a population expansion where
people want to rent.
There's no more supply coming
along.
>> Investors pulling out doesn't
indicate --
>> They are not selling what
they have got, they are just not
acquiring any more.
They have got as much as they
need.
In fact, their financial
strategy is looking pretty good.
Having bought over the last four
years they are in at low prices,
they are getting good rents.
The rents might go up.
They will probably hang on to
those and keep them for a number
of years.
>> If stability is the goal
rather than a price run-up,
seems like you want to see the
owner occupied level where we
have it?
>> I would like to see a little
more demand.
We've got demand dropping to a
level which is causing concerns
for sellers.
At this time last year buyers
had the problems, there were too
many of them and not enough
homes for sale.
Now there are so few buyers that
some of the sellers are starting
to get a little nervous and are
competing with each other.
It's a good time to be a buyer.
You can pick and choose.
You can ask your seller for
concessions like help with
closing costs or even with a
down payment.
There are a lot of things to
make it much more pleasant to be
a buyer now.
You're in the sort of best seat
for negotiating.
It won't last forever.
So if you're in the market now
is really good timing for
buying.
All of these things are very
cyclical and Arizona and Phoenix
in particular changes very
quickly.
That's what makes my job fun.
>> Are values down across the
board in all regions?
>> I think what's happened is
prices have gotten to a point
where they are fairly stable,
they haven't changed a lot in
the last four or five months.
There's no upward pressure
anymore.
They may settle back a little
bit with the current situation.
We're not looking at a crash or
another bust.
No real further movement upwards
and maybe a little bit settling
back over the next 12 months.
>> But are there areas of the
county that you're seeing fewer
-- more or less price increases?
Or decreases?
>> It does vary a lot.
It's not so much the area, it's
the price range.
And the luxury end of the market
has taken longer to feel this
lack of demand.
It's actually feeling it now,
but for the last half of last
year it was doing very well.
That's partly because the stock
market is doing very well in the
past year and that tends to
provide impetus for the housing
market in the luxury area.
Plus, a lot of the lenders are
very anxious to write jumbo
loans right now.
They are competing to write
large loans to people who are
already wealthy.
>> That's where they can play.
>> Always fascinating, hopefully
you come back with good or at
least stable news next time we
talk, thank you very much.
>> Thank you very much.
>>> The Greater Phoenix area has
been named one of the best
intergenerational regions in the
country.
MetLife Foundation and
Generations United announced the
Maricopa region will receive one
of four best intergenerational
communities awards on March 25th
in Washington, D.C.
Here to talk about that is
Maricopa Association of
Governments is human services
director Amy St. Peter, and
Jacky Alling, senior program
officer at the Arizona Community
Foundation.
Let's first define what an
intergenerational region is.
>> We're very excited about
that.
Simply put, it's all people all
together.
It's accomplished by looking
strategically at the
infrastructure and the
programming and really allowing
opportunities for older adults
and youth to be able to come
together in really meaningful
ways and impact both of them
positively.
>> What's a building where this
goes on?
>> I'd be happy to talk about
that.
At the Arizona Community
Foundation we have an affordable
housing program which
jump-starts and provides
predevelopment loans to do
affordable and supportive
housing.
A recent project was to do the
foundation for senior living.
It's called Twenty-nine Palms
and it integrates services and
housing for seniors and young
adults with autism.
So there will be opportunities
for them to be resources and
assets to one another, and have
special services that will help
both populations, as well.
>> And I guess flip it, has
there been a model -- did areas
just try to put seniors in this
one apartment building?
>> Well, we're the original home
of the first segregated
retirement community.
I won't name any names, but it's
pretty notorious as being the
first one in the country.
There are benefits to that and
also social disadvantages.
>> Right, because those seniors
in -- let's say Sun City Leisure
World, are there by choice.
But some would rather live among
everybody.
What are the benefits of seniors
living among a younger
population?
>> People feel as though they
have value and add value.
When people have opportunities
to volunteer to assist others,
they feel much better about
themselves.
Sometimes if someone is always
just receiving services, they
don't necessarily have a good
self-esteem because they aren't
imparting value to others, they
aren't able to share their
skills and benefits.
Along with that reciprocity it's
really important because it
builds on both sides of that
equation.
>> Is it a situation where if we
don't try to engage this and let
it happen naturally in the
market, seniors do end up
segregated anyway?
>> Well, I'll speak from the
funding side because the Arizona
Community Foundation is a
philanthropy and we give grants
to nonprofits and agencies.
Funding often tends to be very
age siloed.
It's the natural course of
things.
>> Like building a subsidized
housing unit, it's going to end
up being --
>> Exactly, even in terms of
federal funding there have been
challenges with siloing
populations.
So we do think that if you think
about community development and
programs being good to grow up
with and good to grow old with,
it's pretty simple.
>> So what did we say in the
application?
What did we point to?
You mentioned the one
development.
What did we point to as far as
what we do well?
>> Exactly.
First the leadership of the
mayor who helped us submit the
application.
We're very thankful to him for
his leadership on that.
The application was fairly long
and expensive but the outpouring
of support from the community
was just absolutely wonderful.
We received letters of support
from older adult volunteers,
teens in high schools who have
been able to work with them.
Nonprofit agencies doing really
cutting edge work.
In that sense it's very easy to
submit the application, because
we had so much support on it.
We were able to point to the
number of intergenerational
centers, volunteer opportunities
and decades of history in this,
with doing excellent programming
in intergenerational work.
And some really cutting edge
programs where we're working
with communities in Phoenix,
Tempe, Scottsdale and the
northwest valley.
They are bringing in models that
have never existed before in
this part of country.
>> What was it that made us
recognize this being of value
years and years ago, to get us
to the stage where we can apply
for this?
>> For us, we got into this work
because we looked at the
demographics.
The largest population in
Arizona is youth under 18 and
the second largest growing
population in Arizona is
55-plus.
If you think in terms of our
future, it's sort of a
no-brainer, the more we can
integrate resources and not
compete it just makes great
community development sense.
>> Integrated resources meaning
a center not just for youth or
elderly but where everyone can
get together.
>> Grandparents raising
grandkids, are they successful.
At Golden Gate Community Center
they have integrated because the
youth want to learn about
traditional recipes.
They want to have those
interactions with older adults.
>> What do we get?
There's a ceremony in D.C.?
>> There is.
>> T-shirts?
Medals?
>> We will be getting a flag and
we will fly it high as soon as
we return.
More importantly, we are being
held up as a national model.
It's wonderful to get that
national recognition and press,
and for people to be able to
look to us for examples of what
can work really well in this
setting.
>> Something we have been doing
and haven't really doing it
much.
>> I said Maricopa County, I
meant Maricopa Association of
Governments.
People probably make that
mistake all the time.
>> Thank you very much.
>> Thank you very much.
>>> A new book titled "Arizona's
National Parks and Monuments"
gives details about Arizona's 20
federally recognized parks and
monuments.
Here to talk about their book
are coauthors George Hartz and
Donna Hartz, Donna Hartz
actually is mentioned first on
the cover.
>> You'd think if we were going
to talk about Arizona's parks
and monuments we'd begin at the
Grand Canyon.
But actually it begins with Casa
Grande.
Tell us about the fight over
realizing we need to save those
ruins.
>> At the time the westward
movement happens after the Civil
War, people began to see these
monuments and ruins out there
and people started -- Casa
Grande was just deteriorating
from weather.
But a lot of other ones were in
danger because of people going
out and digging up things.
At that point with Casa Grande
it was an effort by people both
here in Arizona and some also in
other places in the country to
get it preserved and try and
stabilize it so it wouldn't
continue to fall apart.
>> Were the people taking
things, doing so -- was there a
big market for relics?
Or were they doing it not really
realizing they would damage the
archeology?
>> A lot of them were being
pulled out for relics.
It was a real big problem.
People were -- they became very
popular and valuable and people
would just go in and willy nilly
dig them up.
The sort of damage done was
often indescribable.
>> What was said at the time
that made Casa Grande the first
one to get things going in
Arizona?
What was it that made people
think, we need to save this?
>> One of the things was it was
very visible.
It was along a road that
prospectors or soldiers were
traveling.
It was a visible documentation
of the deterioration.
It excited the interest of some
archeologists in the northeast
who worked with friends on -- in
Washington, and got $2,000
raised.
Not a lot but enough to at least
begin the process of stabilizing
it.
And it was the first ever
national archeological reserve
in the United States in 1892.
It started with Casa Grande.
>> It started with the idea that
this is still a relatively new
country at the time, there is
stuff here that needs saving.
Next, Montezuma Castle.
The Grand Canyon comes deep into
the story.
I don't know if that surprised
me when you started researching
your book but the Grand Canyon
was not the first.
Tell us about the efforts to
save Montezuma Castle.
>> It was one that suffered
significantly from the pot
hunters and vandals.
This is a picture from the late
1890s, we do not know if these
are good guys or bad guys.
But they are digging up pots and
they are probably going to take
them and sell them to a
collector.
They certainly aren't taking the
sort of records you wish were
taken as you're digging these
up.
>> Is part of this simply the
fascination from back east of
what this western life was like
and the frontier?
>> Absolutely.
There was a tremendous amount of
publicity.
One of the big things that
occurred up at Mesa Verde was we
had a man from Sweden who came
in and dug up, took things back
to Sweden and did this really
fabulous picture book that got
wide distribution in the United
States.
That really sparked it.
But it was an impetus to really
start to save these.
The damage was done and things
are gone and most of them are
still not back in the United
States.
>> So far we look at these first
two, they are big things.
The Casa Grande, the castle sort
of dug in, the well sort of off
to the side.
Then we get to the Petrified
Forest, which again, you just --
it's amazing when you flip
through the book to think, this
was just out there.
This was not protected.
We were not told to be in
reference of this, and please
don't take this home and make it
a coffee table.
This was just out there.
>> Yeah, just sitting there.
>> What was the thought, what
got to us sort of say that is
good thing to say?
>> The scientists and geologists
were fascinated by it.
It was a huge collection of
petrified wood and it drew a lot
of interest scientifically.
The publicity that surrounded
Petrified Forest caused a lot of
people to come in and big up
chunks of petrified wood and
cart them away.
That was, again, part of the
impetus to get this antiquities
act signed that gave the
President the authority to
unilaterally proclaim national
monuments and protect these
properties.
John Muir came down to Arizona
in 1905 to publicize how
important it was to protect the
Petrified Forest.
>> I guess as we hit the Grand
Canyon, it sort of shows before
it was protected what free range
kind of commerce was going on.
The Bright Angel Trail was not
free, right?
>> It started as a mining trail.
And there were quite a few mines
in the Grand Canyon at that
point in time.
There were also other
entrepreneurs who were mining
the tourists.
>> The mining didn't seem to be
going really well.
>> There wasn't a lot coming
out.
>> But people came with money so
let's mine the tourists, as you
say.
>> As the picture shows, Bright
Angel Toll Road.
So we had entrepreneurs charging
the public for acrossing public
lands.
They just set up a toll road.
They had no authority or right.
But because business interests
were so strong, even a President
like Teddy Roosevelt was
hesitate to move real quickly on
the Grand Canyon.
He proclaimed 10 national
monuments before the Grand
Canyon.
It was the fifth one done in
Arizona amazingly.
>> Why?
Because there was so much
revenue being made?
>> There were a lot of political
issues because there was a lot
of pressure to not protect it,
not to pull it away from the
ability to go in and mine or go
in and set up your businesses.
>> The state was already running
it in a way, it already allowed
businesses to set up, why are
the Feds coming in.
>> Yeah, I think it's a matter
of rights.
You know, does the federal
government have the right to do
this, versus the state.
And it didn't become a national
park until 1919, it was just
amazing.
>> And soon after, even though I
was born and raised right next
to it, I had no idea that Papago
Park was one of eight national
monuments, hole in the rock,
right there.
>> The folks in the Phoenix area
really wanted that preserved
because it was ready to be put
out for use.
>> Like, use meaning it could
have been anything.
>> It could have been a ranch or
anything.
>> Of course.
>> Once it got to that point the
people in the area recognized
they needed to preserve it.
It was a recreational place even
at that point in time at the
turn of the century.
They wanted to keep it
protected.
They didn't have the money to
buy the land.
There was a lot of pressure in
Washington to get it named as a
national monument.
Once that was done they started
pressuring Washington to make it
recreational, put in a pool and
a fish hatchery.
It didn't take very long.
By 1930 the government had
enough and gave it back to the
state of Arizona so we got it
for free, which was really G.
but it was indeed first a
national monument.
>> For 16 years.
>> Then Arizona gets a bunch,
it's been used in Arizona more
than any other state.
>> More than any other state.
The antiquities act has been
used 23 times in Arizona.
All of our national parks and
monuments except one were
originally preserved under the
antiquities act.
They couldn't do it under the
act here because it was part of
an Indian reservation.
They need to do work with the
Indian tribe and Congress, and
site got made a national
monument by congressional
action.
>> Yeah, the book is available
and I'm assuming on Amazon and
in bookstores?
From Arcadia Publishing.
Seems like you had a lot of fun
researching this, and the
government helped you out by
preserving a lot of these
stories.
>> The government has terrific
photographs and we had a great
time putting it together.
>> Sure, and thank you for
joining us.
It's a wonderful read with a lot
of great photos.
I appreciate your both being
here tonight.
>> Thank you.
>> Friday, on "Arizona Horizon,"
it's the "Journalists'
Roundtable."
The panel will talk about a bill
that opponents say could lead to
denial of service to gays and
lesbians, and hear more about a
local consultant tied to
national dark money.
Those stories and more Friday on
the "Journalists' Roundtable,"
back with Ted Simons tomorrow.
I'm Richard Ruelas, have a great
evening.
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