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Too much of it went on in a vacuum. I can explain this in another way in which I explained
this personally, as I followed the whole ecumenical discussion on the Lord's Supper. Certain churches
still will not permit what is called intercommunion in theology. Certain Lutheran groups, certain
Protestant groups and Roman Catholic. And the Orthodox groups. Now it is my contention
that, that discussion will go on and goes on essentially at a kind of academic level
and a kind of a vacuum. My contention, the real way to make some in roads upon it is
if various people in these communions would quite deliberately go to receive the mass.
If I walked up for example to Bill Greenspun at St. Patrick's I mean what would Bill do
if I walked up there to receive the bread? David Yellin- Yeah.
Joan Beifuss- He would hand it to you? James Lawson- Yes (Muffled) As long as no
one, as long as we are operating on an academic level probably that discussion isn't for another
decade or so. David Yellin- Now these priests are (muffled).
Joan Beifuss- Let me ask you something else in the thing that sister Avens group did this
summer the nuns, they picked up an awful lot of fear of you and Jesse Epps out of the white
community, people really though you were the devil incarnate. Is that, now this is a result
of confrontation, confrontation with the city. Is this better, is this a healthy thing that
these people should be afraid of you, that they should kind of ignore you? Are we advancing?
Because they are afraid? (muffled) regard you as harmless leaders? Do you know what
I mean?
James Lawson- Yeah, the thing I would say is that probably the fear is their initial
reaction in a way without really either knowing me or knowing what I represent. In that sense
I would tend to say is a sign that health is possible for them.
Joan Beifuss- Not if they never find out what you represent?
James Lawson- Well there is a good chance that they may move past it, there is still
that chance. David Yellin- The fact that they recognized
it. James Lawson- Oh sure. The fact that they
re organized it is very important. David Yellin- And had said it to somebody
else is the beginning. James Lawson- It is very important. It is
no longer buried they now have to deal with it. They now have to deal with it whether
they like it or not and some of those people see me in other places in categories and they
do deal with, and they deal with it positively. One of the things I get all the time from
friends as well as from some of these persons is you know that same kind of thing and also
the reaction that we never really knew you. Now a friend of mine was just telling me the
other day, who was that? What's today? He was telling me some major layman out east
in one of our churches out there who was really turned off by me about being hysterical and
what not. And then he has been into a couple of Methodist meetings where he has seen face
to face and it has created (muffled) and he is now saying just the opposite of that.
David Yellin- Well you ought to go to more dinners.
James Lawson- You see to it that I get the invitations and I will go.
David Yellin- (Muffled) Plus the fact that thems the chances you take if you are a public
figure. James Lawson- Sure.
David Yellin- The heat in the kitchen or in the dining room gets very hot what you going
to do. James Lawson- Because you see what I am saying
to is that up to this time, many of those people have never given a dime for any black
person. (muffled). David Yellin- Now is your....
Joan Beifuss- (muffled) the thing I would question is did you see the news tonight about
Judge Horton being put out of the top 100 (muffled). You went to lunch but top of the
hundred somebody and what's his name came over and told him that Judge Horton would
have to leave and they had allowed Ben Hooks to eat in the green room up there but they
no longer allowed Ben Hooks to do that and Horton would have to leave. Then they had
a statement on television by Horton saying that he was terribly depressed by the whole
thing and if this is what happens to him then what happens to the general population of
the city of Memphis. My question would be whether or not these scared women in East
Memphis are not going to respond much more positively to Horton than to you or Jesse
Epps? James Lawson- They responded much more positively
to us. Also here is another point. Now here is a criminal judge that everyone from Lobe
on down is applauding the white mayor. (Muffled) James Lawson- Now what are you come on?
David Yellin- (muffled) Lobe refused to go from then on, that will get you some votes,
and I bet you, I wouldn't put it past him. James Lawson- I doubt it.
Joan Beifuss- I doubt it to. David Yellin- Well fine.
James Lawson- If he is human enough to respond in that way, that would be a very human way
of responding. My friend has been offended and he served me well and I am really an offended
person. This is a personal front to the city of Memphis and the mayor's office it self.