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GALEN HOOKS: Dancing since he was two, on stage in front of a crowd of thirty thousand
people by the time he was five and choreographing Britney Spears world tour at only sixteen,
Wade Robson has achieved more before the age of thirty than most choreographers achieve
in a lifetime. Michael Jackson was the personal mentor to this Grammy nominated, Emmy award
winning artist who has created memorable works for artists including NSYNC, Usher, Maya and
Pink. I am your host Galen Hooks, and I am lucky enough to have Wade Robson in the studio
with me today. Wade, welcome to the show. WADE ROBSON: Thank you, thanks for having me.
So I've known you for a long time.
WADE ROBSON: Yeah. GALEN HOOKS: You have one of the most interesting lives of anybody I've ever met.
I mean you've had experiences that people could only dream of. It started when you were
two years old, correct? WADE ROBSON: Yes. GALEN HOOKS: Your brother had a VHS of the making
of Thriller. What happened? WADE ROBSON: Yeah, yeah, my older brother um had the
tape of make the VHS of Making of Thriller. I don t know, I guess I saw that and just
flipped out on it and wanted to watch it every day. But I would remember I would run into
the kitchen and hide every time the werewolf part came on cause I was too scared, and then
run back when they were dancing. Obviously there were tons of kids that
loved it and connected to it, but I just, I wanted to do the dance every day. By the
time I was three I think I had learned a, you know, a good amount of the choreography. So
I was sort of, you know, a bit of dancing before walking, I don't know which one came first.
So I was in crawl mode GALEN HOOKS: Oh my gosh.
WADE ROBSON: doing this, you know. GALEN HOOKS: So I mean, by the time you were five you were very good
at impersonating Michael, and you entered a dance contest, right? WADE ROBSON: Yeah,
Michael's company was holding these dance contests all over the country. This was
'87, the Bad tour. And um so I'm from Brisbane, Australia originally. So they were holding
the contest there. Um I think it, the way it went down was all my mom's friends were
saying, you know, "He's really good, you should put him in it." And she didn't really take
it seriously and they're like, "Come on, put him in." I had like a full custom you know
Bad outfit made, right, with the buckles and the red stripe GALEN HOOKS: Yeah. WADE ROBSON:
and the full deal. And but it was also like my mom's belt wrapped around me like four
times. GALEN HOOKS: Awww, cute. WADE ROBSON: 80s studded belt, you know. And I guess it went
well, and I ended up winning it. Went on in the finals and won that and then the prize
was to meet Michael. He was having a show in Brisbane and we went to the show the
first night. There was like a meet and great after that, and same thing, had my outfit
rocking again, the Bad outfit. You know there's tons of people around, um but he was sort
of tripping out on my outfit and asked me if I danced. And I said, "Yeah." And he said,
"Do you wanna perform with me in the show tomorrow night?" So yeah, so the next night, it's Michael
and Stevie Wonder on stage. And we went to the show and it's coming towards the end
of the concert and then I started dancing, started going off, started going crazy. All
the other kids are looking at me like what's this kid doing? And then I remember at one
point Michael came up to me and, you know, sort of like gave me one of these sort of things.
And I took it as, you know, get into it, like let's go a little deeper. So I go down stage
center and throw my hat into the audience and just start going crazy. Turns out that
what he meant was, "Come on, let's go," like, "It's over." And so like someone escorts Stevie
Wonder off, Michael is leaving, all the other kids are taking off and I'm just gone to the
world, right, down stage center, you know how it is. So that was like the first time
I ever experienced that obviously at that level, you know. GALEN HOOKS: Wow. So after
the show he told your mom not to, he he made her promise not to let you take formal training,
right? WADE ROBSON: Yeah. GALEN HOOKS: Do you think that that had a huge effect on how you
dance now? WADE ROBSON: Yeah, for sure. I mean, yeah, of course. I'm sure my movement
would be very different, you know, I'd be maybe Wade Robson the prima ballerina, you know.
Who knows. GALEN HOOKS: In another lifetime… WADE ROBSON: Yeah. GALEN HOOKS: …we'll get to see that.
WADE ROBSON: You know it's interesting. I think probably for me personally, maybe some of the good
sides to it, to not having so much formal training was, I don't know, I was particularly
forced to kind of really find my own movement, you know, and my own style. But at the same
time, like there's times when I wish I would've done more formal training. It's not the
kind of… I'm sort of like, you know, do as I say not as I do. I tell everyone to kind of
get all the training they can. GALEN HOOKS: I mean it's interesting cause even though
he said, you know, he wanted to keep your art raw and not train, he didn't say anything
about you teaching. And when you were twelve you started teaching. You'd be the youngest
person in the room, I'd be in your class WADE ROBSON: Yeah, yeah. GALEN HOOKS: …you'd be
the youngest person there, but you obviously are very um sure of yourself, but did you
feel like you had to prove yourself a lot in classes? WADE ROBSON: Yeah, it was trippy,
I mean cause I started off subbing for other teachers at first, right. So people
would come to class expecting their, you know, regular grown up teacher and see this little
little white boy over in the corner getting ready to teach, you know. So a lot of people
would sort of freak out and first say, you know, "No way I'm taking class from a freaking
kid." But then I think you know the people that stayed and gave it a chance, I mean
you know, there's a lot of twelve year olds or younger, especially now, even younger
who are great dancers um who can come up with great steps. But maybe at the time one of
the differences were that I think I had some understanding of how to teach. GALEN HOOKS:
Yes. WADE ROBSON: And um how to break things down. So these people that gave it a chance
you know um were doing things by the end of class that maybe they didn't think they could
do or, and then I got a following relatively quickly and people started saying, you know,
demanding to Moro Landis you know, "He should have his own class." And um so I don't know,
something to do with the, maybe the naïveté of being young and you don't care. You just go,
you just do your thing. GALEN HOOKS: That's awesome. But um you know not long after that,
just a few years after that you were choreographing for Britney Spears. There's an interesting
story with that, right? You started choreographing for her but she didn't know your age?
WADE ROBSON: Yeah. Britney's management had seen a reel of mine or something like that, um
but it was also kind of one of those who you know things. One of her dancers, TJ Espinoza,
I knew him at the time and I guess he had talked me up like crazy to Britney. So
yeah, they had seen this reel but they didn't know my age at all. I was sixteen at the
time, and I think she was seventeen. So anyway I, you know, got hired and the first thing was
doing some choreography for her first tour. Um so I flew out to Orlando to start work,
and I walk in and, you know, we meet and and she thought I was like one of their friends
at first, you know, and then realized, you know, I was the guy that's coming to choreograph
this stuff. And and I think she had a little bit of a freak out session and sort of like
took TJ in the corner and was like, "What are you doing," you know, "He's sixteen years old."
He's like, "You're seventeen," you know. And he's like, "Just just give him a chance,"
you know, "Let him do what he's here to do." So, you know, we started rocking and
all went well. That turned into, you know, we'd ended up doing tons of stuff together.
GALEN HOOKS: Wow. Well, yeah you, I mean you started as her choreographer but you would
start to give more ideas and then you ended up directing her tours. WADE ROBSON: Yeah,
so it all sort of happening relatively quickly. It was one of those things where I think it
was like, you know, I did that first, the choreography for that first tour for Britney and then there
was, I think it was as soon as there was a second leg of the tour. I just sort of came
to her and said, "You know, I've got all these ideas, why don't you let me direct it?" And
she sort of looked at me like, "Are you sure, have you done that before?" And I just said,
"Sure." And just one of those situations where you just, you know, you put yourself
in that place and go I'm gonna figure it out when I get there. GALEN HOOKS: Wow.
WADE ROBSON: Um one of the tours we did, the Pop Odyssey tour, and I think at the time it was one of
the biggest tours ever, so just sheer scale, the amount of trucks and the size of stage
or the stadium tour, you know, and I was seventeen and I was the writer and director of the show.
GALEN HOOKS: Jeez. WADE ROBSON: And I look back now and I go like, you know, there was so much
money being spent, um and I just wonder like how Johnny Wright, the manager, like how he
sold that, you know. "All right we're gonna spend you know millions and millions of dollars
and this seventeen-year-old is gonna helm the whole thing" you know. GALEN HOOKS: Wow.
WADE ROBSON: Um so it's crazy when I look back. But at the time it was like, "Well yeah, it's
just what we're doing." GALEN HOOKS: Let's talk about the Wade Robson Project.
WADE ROBSON: Okay. GALEN HOOKS: Which was 2003. You produced and hosted it WADE ROBSON: I know, it was
like a lifetime ago. GALEN HOOKS: it was a lifetime ago. When you think back to
those days on MTV, you had your own show. How did that happen? WADE ROBSON: Well at first
I think with the work that I had done, um with Britney and NSYNC and all those other
artists at that time, I became a bit of a visual, a recognizable choreographer, um
which at that time was definitely more rare than it is now. GALEN HOOKS: Yeah, yeah.
WADE ROBSON: You know with shows like "So You Think You Can Dance" and that sort of thing. So there
was a friend of mine, a producer, came to me and said, "Let's create a dance show." At
first it was, funny enough it was, the concept was a bit different. Um it was in a way maybe
slightly more similar to like "America's Best Dance Crew" or something. GALEN HOOKS: Okay.
WADE ROBSON: It was actually more about b-boys, b-boy crews and that sort of thing. And you
know as it developed and it changed, and really one of the big things was that MTV wanted
to see me dance, and I'm in by no means a b-boy. So yeah the, you know, the concept
changed and it and it led towards you know me teaching these people on stage and
that whole thing. It was a lot of fun. We got some some great talent there, you know
people that are like working now. GALEN HOOKS: Yeah. WADE ROBSON: You know like tWitch was
on the show, he was a finalist, David Moore, Jersey, you know. GALEN HOOKS: That's so crazy.
WADE ROBSON: Yeah, it's wild. I mean obviously there had been dance shows before, but it
had been a while and I, maybe it was sort of the beginning of this new GALEN HOOKS: Yes.
WADE ROBSON: …you know, cycle… GALEN HOOKS: Definitely. WADE ROBSON: of them happening all over again.
GALEN HOOKS: I mean you re talking about you being a household name and it was in the days before choreographers
were really household names and recognizable. Was that a conscious decision to be that?
WADE ROBSON: No, not at all. Um that it just sort of happened. I mean it was a part
to do with I guess Britney and NSYNC and then management being really um open to that and
being really in inviting as far as you know wanting me to receive the credit for what
I was doing on camera. So no, it wasn't like a strategic thing. GALEN HOOKS: You weren't
marketing yourself. WADE ROBSON: Yeah, it just sort of happened. GALEN HOOKS: We talked about
how that also made you reevaluate fame and what it how that affected your life.
WADE ROBSON: I remember I had this moment when we shot the finale of of the Wade Robson Project.
It was great, it was amazing, it was fun and I had this moment, like the moment that we
said cut and it was over. And I sort of looked around, realizing at that point eeesh, I don't
know if this was never the plan. I don't know if this is the direction I really
wanna go. You know, as you said, I'd gained a certain amount of notoriety before the show
and then it just it turned into a different thing um after the Wade Robson Project. What
I realized had changed is a lot of the recognition was like for being the cool guy on MTV, you
know, um which just for me personally, it just didn't feel, that was never really the
plan. I mean, I was always, you know, from so young just so interested in being more behind
the scenes and being a creator in that fashion. So I just had a bit of a shift at
that point. I kind of stopped that train that was heading in that direction and um and just
sort of stepping back and realized, you know remembering where I really wanted to be, just
sort of behind the scenes creating, you know. GALEN HOOKS: Did a lot of the people you were
around also influence that decision? I mean you saw, you saw Michael Jackson, the
biggest star in the world from the time you were five years old to, I mean you had a relationship
with him until his passing. You were around WADE ROBSON: Yeah. GALEN HOOKS: Britney and
Justin Timberlake when they were the biggest stars in the world. So what did being exposed
to their lifestyles and how fame affected them, how did that affect you? WADE ROBSON: Yeah,
particularly with um you know growing up friends with Michael, um you know that, I mean obviously
that's a whole nother scale, but that level of fame, and you know rightly so for all
the amazing things and the amazing work that he did, but I saw how that tormented him
as well. So you know when I was really young I of course idolized him and wanted to be
anything and everything that was on that sort of scale. Um and then as I was getting a little
older and going through that experience and then kind of referring back to the sort of
stuff I saw with Michael's life um and realizing yeah, again for me personally, I don't know
that I want that particular version of life. It was interesting, cause at the same time
that the MTV thing was happening and that was sort of sky rocketing I met who
is now my wife, Amanda. GALEN HOOKS: Wow. WADE ROBSON: And she's from Hawaii, you know,
didn't grow up in the entertainment business whatsoever. And when I met her, because I'd
grown up in the entertainment business, kind of all I've ever known, when I met her
and you know she grew up Hawaii, surfing, soccer, family, nature, I was going [GASP]
you know like "I want some of that in my life." So there's
these interesting contrasts that were happening at the same time GALEN HOOKS: Wow. WADE ROBSON:
and sort of, you know, her coming into my life and that show and that sort of level
of fame. You know, I really stepped back on a lot of things in the work realm and
ever since I've continually trying to sort of really find that balance. So in that
sort of perspective shifting, the interesting thing that happened is after I kind of did
that for a while I felt reinvigorated you know, and I felt re-inspired to sort of come
back to the work with a different perspective. GALEN HOOKS: Well you're, you have such
a rich life of experiences. All of it started with your incredible ability to dance. What
do you love about dance? WADE ROBSON: With dance, you know when you're when you're deep
in the moment of dance and just how time drifts away. You know,
and like usually everything in life we're always thinking about something we want in
the future or relating it to something that's happened in the past, you know, but when
you're in that moment just none of that stuff exists and time just slips away.
All of us in life are looking to be a little bit more present and as dancers we're
so lucky that we kind of have that window of opportunity to see what that's really like
to not be so caught up in sort of psychological time. So and then it's just hoping that we
can take that glimpse and use that sort of more and more in our day to day life.
GALEN HOOKS: Awesome. Thank you for talking with me, Wade. WADE ROBSON: Thank you, thanks
for having me. GALEN HOOKS: Awesome talking to you. WADE ROBSON: You too. GALEN HOOKS: Thank you guys for watching.
If you have any questions for Wade that I didn't
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date with all of us here at DS2DIO as well as all of our master choreographers that we
have on the show. Thank you for watching, we ll see you next time. Bye.