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really offsets
just to get some day data points here since I
between 2008-2010 about the cost of a bachelor's degree to public university
one up 46 percent in real dollars
the actual spending on students
rose only six percent and also since 2007 there's been at least fifteen
states
that have cut a their their stake of the university funding by thirty percent or
more
so basically what we're seeing is States
I am cutting aid in aid by
by eight were saying actual should've aid
as opposed to loans I
to their state university's the fed's making up for that money
presumably making up for it by by basically
offering I'll loans and putting it on the backs up these
a student so what seems to be absent because you talk about how conservative
should be upset
with with this and I've I you know i i I've had this argument with some
I libertarians about a the
the the loans are dry are distorting the market place
and are you know removing the checks
that would exist n/an/an/a genuine market for
for college and I think there should be some truth to that
but the real question that everybody seems to be avoiding is what is
what do we want to do what what should society's role
either manifested through the federal government or through the state
government in it is it's clear that week
we can't have this a national conversation about it in terms the
state's
what is society's role in providing
as much opportunity for higher education is possible for students
that seems to be completely absent from this conversation
even even with those who have said this is
that you know who who were against this s above suppose a
bipartisan deal to sort Kerber interest rates
yeah no you're absolutely right i mean there's no
there's no talk about what exactly is our plan here what we want to do
a you know %uh I i think
there's a conversation to be had about about
a you-know-who who should be entitled to
a higher education should everybody get a higher education should we make
a college like high school where the available to everybody
arm you know i i I probably for a far more
to that side a and maybe some others do but
I we're not having that discussion I think what they're trying to do with
tiptoe around that discussion by
finding ways to get as many people as they can into
into this car and perverted no
market the distorted
system I and I i just don't think it's working
you know when that not only in a are we not
producing the same kinds of quality educate spending as much on teachers and
on
on educating kids as they are on useful stuff like swimming pools and
and landscaping and whatever arm or not
time but we're also not reducing the cost for not making enough
you know making it as is available to everybody
as we as we could be I was not having a conversation there
they're just there's all these policies that were talking about are just
designed to keep
the current system going for a few years longer I
and keep all the lobbyists and in washington happy yeah I may try me did
you in in the course you're reporting to you come across
any I politicians who are who were in any way sort of like saying that
this is we're not talking about the real problem here
I mean you know we should be talking about the principal who is
who is going to pay the principal in terms of a
educating our population well I mean
you know Bernie Sanders people are are are saying that
I had lik a the
he's been pretty consistent about that being that the main problem then
you know they're their sensible about almost everything I talk to them about
but
did think the the bipartisan nature of this
the you know aside from a few people like like Bernie
shows you what the that most people
archive they don't want to deal with taking on but this lobby
and they also I think there's a lot of cynicism here
in and with both
with both parties in realizing that making a whole lot of loans available
the kids sounds the young people like it
pro young people policy I and there's no
there's no organized lobbyist student age
voters to tell them otherwise to tell them that this is actually problematic
so they're they're taking advantage of a lobbying vacuum in washington
to ram through policies that you know I actually don't help
students all that much in the end and and meanwhile they're conceding to
another very powerful lobby on the other hand I i think thats why
see this this bipartisan sweeping rewrite
partisan deal go through is just an absence are they sorta a coalesce
consistency that saying that we
we need to really examine this question as to whether or not
we as a society think it's a value
not just to the individuals but to the the future the society to have
a more educated I population immediate DIII know you spoke to the guy who
founded student loan justice .org is there any
is there any semblance I mean strike debt is been talking about this but but
but
again that's worth talking about sort of the the implications
up the loans rather than the question of
move maybe what we should be doing is taking any of those profits
and pouring it back into a some type of federally funded
%uh system I love State University's
right either that or you know there's another there is that this a plan out in
Oregon now that they're thinking about implementing that word in
arm essentially kids wooden they wouldn't incur debt
at all 1a want to colleges would all be funded
by the state and then you would you would actually promise a percentage of
your
future earnings I'll in return
but you wouldn't have the debt hangover your over your head when you left
a you would do with be entirely contingent upon how well you did after
you got out
there are a number plans that are kicking around though is that are like
that that would make sense
arm but I just don't think we're going to see that I think you know after
a a couple weeks ago when this issue was that a briefly in the news
I'm after the another compromise and then
I we had a whole mess with the NSA and Glenn Greenwald
partner being arrested in and a day later literally the president goes on
the throat or
to announce this new planet they're going to have to reduce
other costs of college that would involve a government
a government funded rating system to make sure that
I there were some sort of performance a
rating for for schools that received
federally backed which in dollars but that plan wouldn't go into effect until
2018 at the earliest
there's plenty of time for that to be derailed and
my my guess is that they're they're going to be able to successfully
I keep the whole issue under wraps just buying
holding out the carotid some kind of yeah
future plan like that I am rather than dealing with it immediately
and and some more concrete facts and I gotta say that whole rating system I
just
you know their its it's one thing to say to say we can weed out sort the
fraudulent schools
I'll but me know how do you how do you how do you actually quantify miss the
same problem we have with all the the corporatisation Nov
above the the so-called school reform movement
how do you measure how do you measure something like that I mean how do you
measure the value of having
I a
people in society who a who are well versed with literature or
I with history and many its it seems to me
that a that's just you know
where we're incentivizing the wrong things
when we talk about higher education oh yeah a lot
that's absolutely decision I iced I I can't even imagine what
what the rating systems parameters will end up being a mean that they're talking
about things like
the ability to repay loan you know
with an ex-member years after graduation I
income levels a you know whether our
and a number people who drop out before before completing their educations
who you know who complete their degree programs but this doesn't tell us
anything about the value of education
I i think thats furiously right that's going to be lost in all this is
is the kinda intangible benefit
education that I think people use the very strongly believe in this country
this whole idea
arm you know love me you know the
that that's what liberal arts was all about away in didn't teach you to
have a particular salable skills just are you do
bank in to look at the world a certain way I
and I i because I think they're gonna they're gonna move more towards I
quantifiable a are
no parameters have gotten away with measuring the current value education i
think thats gonna be lost in the shuffle and we're gonna be moving towards a
different kinda model which is unfortunate you know I think and they
get some
it's important for people to be well rounded and to know then turned to
to come to know the history of the world untie happy to be well read but
I I think Anna I don't know what you think but I i think thats I totally
agree and I think you know you're losing the value up sort of like
a pinhead Singh people as serve as
as members have said the civil society as citizens verses being worker drones
in some respect miss a thing I like about that organ plan we should say that
they passed the State House
I think it's been signed into law they're gonna start I think it's been
signed into law
they're gonna start to arm I the costar to
the attempt to implement that over the next couple years they need to find I
think some initial funding
are 48 end and I know I think term I think it's a
widen is you're talking about introducing this on a federal level
up like that at least you know says we're going to take the pressure people
want to go and become teachers
I or they want to become a social workers if they want to
engage in a profession or a
pursuit work that is going to enhance society
but not necessarily provide them a big box
them then then we should we should help them out in that endeavor because it
makes society better
I your it's just its
it's a little bit depressing but yeah I'm excited about what's going on in
oregon so
let's share no I mean this threatened to hide it's just
put your earthly raided the the but that's that's exactly what we're
we're not seeing now you know i mean i always like talking for a story they are
they also the same thing at like I
I had to take it you know whatever
crappy I paint job I couldn't as as quickly as I could and I had that I had
to head to the
keep it you know no matter what indignities I had suffered a federal
what awful stuff I had to do to keep the job I had to cuz I have these bills that
I had to pay and i cant the fault on them
you know if I default on the mend then its gonna stick to me for the rest of my
life
and convoy I think we all remember 2002
the know when you're living off ramen noodles in and there's all these
horrible decisions that you have to make that are
that are really confusing if you add that variable
love you have to take the highest paying job immediately and stick with it at all
costs
so what kind of what kind of a generation are we gonna right I R we
gonna raise
if that's if that's the equation I think the other the other planets much better
I mean I edited
it tells young people the a look if you wanna me take this
non-traditional route in your career if you want to do something that's that a
you know more like volunteer worker or more like social work more
you know politically oriented whatever it is you know we value that too
I think the I would be a great thing you know it would free up kid
to you know young people to and not feel this
the relentless pressure that everybody feels now but I I left the country to
get away from this stuff and I didn't even asked in loans a
you know II had to be prepared to spend my entire twenty that the United States
because those
too afraid of dealing with it if I had ever had a six-figure debt on top of
that I probably never will come back
well we're glad you did come back Matt if
in every state your that the phone bills to Russia would have just been
human and we certainly couldn't sustain that here but I appreciate
you're coming on today other pieces in Rolling Stone willing to it at majority
.fm
Matt always a pleasure