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MARIA: MY NEXT GUEST WAS
CHAIRMAN AND CEO OF ONE OF THE
LARGEST TELECOMMUNICATIONS
COMPANIES IN THE COUNTRY, HELD
TOP-SECRET SECURITY CLEARANCE
AND WAS NAMED CHAIRMAN OF THE
NATIONAL SECURITY
TELECOMMUNICATIONS ADVISORY
COMMITTEE BY PRESIDENT GEORGE W.
BUSH.
HIS WORLD CAME CRASHING DOWN
AFTER HE SAYS HE REFUSED TO
PARTICIPATE IN NSA SURVEILLANCE
PROGRAMS.
YEARS BEFORE THE NOW INFAMOUS ED
SNOWDEN CAME ALONG ONE TELECOM
CONGLOMERATE CEO STOOD UP TO THE
NSA AND U.S. GOVERNMENT BUT DID
HE HAVE THE PRICE FOR IT?
JELL-O -- JOE NACHIO GUIDED THE
FIRM THROUGH A TELECOM BOOM,
THROUGH THE COMPANY'S INITIAL
PUBLIC OFFERING THE SAME YEAR.
IN JUNE OF 2001, HE WAS SUMMONED
TO CLASSIFIED MEETING AT THE NSA
HEADQUARTERS IN FORT MEADE,
MARYLAND WHERE HE SAID THE
ORGANIZATION PRESENTED HIS
COMPANY THE OPPORTUNITY TO
PARTICIPATE IN A SURVEILLANCE
PROGRAM, MADE THE OFFER ILLEGAL
AND UNCONSTITUTIONAL.
HE DECLINED.
THE YEAR FOLLOWING HIS REFUSAL
WAS A NIGHTMARE.
SEVERAL KEY GOVERNMENT CONTRACTS
WERE MOVED FROM THE COMPANY.
SHARES TUMBLED.
THE SEC BEGAN INVESTIGATING AND
HE WAS FORCED TO RESIGN FROM THE
COMPANY.
WITH THE GOVERNMENT UPSET WITH
NACHIO TURNING DOWN, THE
GOVERNMENT CHARGED HIM WITH 42
COUNTS OF INSIDER TRADING.
THE GOVERNMENT CLAIMED NACHIO
SOLD $101 MILLION WORTH OF
STOCKS BETWEEN JANUARY AND MAY
OF 2001.
DURING THE THREE WEEKS FEDERAL
TRIAL NACHIO WAS NOT ALLOWED TO
DESCRIBE THE AGENCIES OR
OFFICIALS WHO WORKED WITH
BECAUSE THE INFORMATION WAS
DEEMED CLASSIFIED.
HE WAS NOT EVEN ALLOWED TO
TESTIFY IN HIS OWN DEFENSE AND
IN THE END NACHIO WAS CONVICTED
ON 19 COUNTS BY $52 MILLION IN
QWEST COMMUNICATIONS STOCKS
BASED ON NONPUBLIC INFORMATION
IN APRIL AND MAY OF 2001 AND
SENTENCED TO SIX YEARS IN
FEDERAL PRISON, ORDERS
$52 MILLION AND PAY AN
$19 MILLION FINE ON TOP OF IT.
IN 2010 HIS SENTENCE WAS REDUCED
TO 70 MONTHS IN PRISON, FINES
LOWERED TO $19 MILLION AND
FORFEITURE OF $44.6 MILLION.
AFTER SERVING NEARLY 4 YEARS
NACHIO WAS RELEASED FROM CUSTODY
LAST SEPTEMBER.
SANDRA SMITH, FOX BUSINESS.
MARIA: SPEAKING FOR THE FIRST
TIME ON TELEVISION SINCE BEING
RELEASED FROM PRISON JOE NACHIO
JOINS ME ON SAID IN AN INCLUSIVE
INTERVIEW.
THANKS FOR JOINING US.
>> THANK YOU.
I AM THE HAPPIEST PERSON AROUND
TO BE HERE.
HAS BEEN 12 YEARS I HAVE BEEN
WAITING TO TELL THE STORY.
MARIA: TELL US YOUR STORY.
YOU GOT OUT OF PRISON LAST YEAR.
>> THIS PAST SEPTEMBER.
MARIA: HOW DID IT START?
>> IT ALL STARTED AT THE EARLY
DAYS OF QUEST WHEN WE WERE
APPROACHED, AND I WAS APPROACHED
ON AND ANNOUNCED VISIT BY A
THREE STAR GENERAL WHO SAID HE
WANTED TO TALK ABOUT SOME
OPPORTUNITIES BUT WE NEEDED TO
GET OUR CLEARANCES.
I WAS CLEARED FOR TOP-SECRET
CLEARANCE ALONG WITH SOME OF MY
GUYS AND FROM 1997-2000 WE GOT
HEAVILY INVOLVED IN NATIONAL
SECURITY WORK AND THE REASON FOR
THAT IS THIS WAS THE BIRTH OF
THE INTERNET WORLD AND WE WERE
BUILDING A THE MOST ADVANCED
FIBER-OPTIC NETWORK IN THE WORLD
SO THERE WAS A NATURAL
REQUIREMENT OF THE GOVERNMENT,
THE DOD AND INTELLIGENCE
AGENCIES TO USE THE NETWORK.
I AM NOT ALLOWED TO NAME WHO WE
WORKED WITH, I AM NOT ALLOWED TO
NAME WHO I MET WITH, THAT IS
STILL CLASSIFIED BUT WE GOT
DEEPLY INVOLVED.
MARIA: WHEN YOU SAY DEEPLY
INVOLVED, THEY WANTED DATA, SOME
OF IT IS CLASSIFIED SO YOU CAN'T
MENTION IT BUT THEY WANTED YOU
TO TURN OVER YOUR DATA, YOUR
CUSTOMERS'S INFORMATION.
>> LET ME BACKTRACK.
THAT IS WHAT ULTIMATELY HAS BEEN
REPORTED IN THE PRESS.
WHEN I SAY PEOPLE INVOLVED IN
ORDER FOR OUR GOVERNMENT TO DO
ITS INTELLIGENCE WORK TO
PROSECUTE MILITARY ACTIONS IT IS
REQUIRED THAT THE KIND OF
TECHNOLOGIES WE PUT IN THE
GROUND ARE PART OF THEIR
INFRASTRUCTURE BUT BECAUSE THEY
ARE IN PRIVATE SECTOR HANDS WE
HAVE TO BE INVITED IN AND
CLEARED TO WORK WITH THEM.
THAT IS HOW IT STARTED.
WHAT HAPPENED SUBSEQUENT TO THAT
IS A LOT OF INFORMATION COULD BE
GATHERED FROM THESE COMPANIES,
WE STARTED GETTING REQUESTS FOR
THAT AND MY DOWNFALL IF I CAN
USE THAT TERM BEGAN ON FEB.
TWENTY-SEVENTH 2001 AS YOU
REPORTED WHEN I WAS INVITED TO A
MEETING AT FORT MEADE WHICH IS
NSA HEADQUARTERS AND IT WAS A
LEGITIMATE MEETING, LEGITIMATE
CLASSIFIED PROJECT AND AT THE
END OF THAT MEETING ANOTHER
REQUEST WAS MADE.
I FOUND THAT REQUEST TO BE
PECULIAR.
I DIDN'T THINK IT WAS LEGAL.
I ASKED LEGAL JUSTIFICATION AND
WE NEVER GOT IT AND SO THEREFORE
WE NEVER DID IT AND THAT WAS THE
MOMENT THINGS TURNED DOWN FOR
ME.
MARIA: I WILL GET TO THAT AND
FIND OUT HOW THINGS TURNED DOWN
FOR YOU BUT IT HAS BEEN REPORTED
QUEST WAS THE ONE MAJOR TELECOM
COMPANIES THAT WOULD NOT AGREE
TO THAT REQUEST.
>> WHAT WAS REPORTED WHICH WAS
THE STORY THAT BROKE IN 2006 BY
USA TODAY WAS A DIFFERENT
REQUEST FOR THE TURNOVER OF
TELEPHONE RECORDS AND THAT WAS A
STORY THAT DID NOT COME FROM
YOUR ANYONE I KNOW AT QUEST.
I WAS GONE BY THEN.
THAT WE SAID WE REFUSE TO TURN
OVER TELEPHONE RECORDS BUT THAT
IS NOT WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT
ON FEB. TWENTY-SEVENTH.
IT IS IMPORTANT TO NOTE ON FEB.
TWENTY-SEVENTH 2001, IT IS 7
MONTHS PRIOR TO 9/11.
REMEMBER WE HAVE BEEN TOLD THAT
ALL OF THIS, QUOTE, SURVEILLANCE
ACTIVITY OF THE AMERICAN PUBLIC
BEGAN AS A RESULT OF THE 9/11.
I WOULD CHALLENGE THAT.
I AM NOT SAYING WHO KNEW IT WAS
HAPPENING.
I AM JUST SAYING I WAS
CONFRONTED WITH SOMETHING THAT I
THOUGHT WAS CLEARLY A VIOLATION
OF THE LAW AND I HAVE A
RESPONSIBILITY TO MY SHAREOWNERS
AND CITIZEN NOT TO BREAK THE
LAW.
MARIA: SO THE SURVEILLANCE BEGAN
SEVEN MONTHS, MORE THAN SEVEN
MONTHS BEFORE SEPTEMBER 11TH.
>> LET ME BE CAREFUL.
I CAN SAY WHAT THEY ASKED US TO
DO.
I CAN ONLY TELL YOU WHAT THEY
ASKED US TO DO WAS SOMETHING I
BELIEVED WAS NOT LEGAL.
MARIA: WILL YOU EVER BE ABLE TO
TELL US WHAT THEY ASKED YOU?
IS ALWAYS GOING TO BE
CLASSIFIED?
>> WHAT IS INTERESTING IS WHEN
YOU HAVE THE CLEARANCE AND YOU
WORK IN THIS AREA YOU ARE BOUND
FOR LIFE NEVER TO DISCLOSE
SECRETS.
I DID NOT DISCLOSE SECRETS EVEN
DURING MY TRIAL.
I WAS SUBJECTED TO 17 MONTHS IN
SECRET COURTS UNDER A LAW CALLED
CLASSIFIED INFORMATION
PROCEDURES ACT.
I ONLY HAD A THREE WEEK PUBLIC
TRIAL AND AS YOU KNOW BECAUSE
YOU COVER DID I NEVER TOOK THE
STAND, SENTENCING, I NEVER
ELECTED, I DIDN'T ASK FOR
LENIENCY, I TURNED DOWN A DEAL
THAT COULD HAVE SERVED ME TENS
OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS AND
PROBABLY MULTIPLE YEARS OF JAIL
TIME BECAUSE I WASN'T GOING TO
ELLA CUTE AND ADMIT TO A CRIME I
DIDN'T DO.
I DID NOT INSIDER-TRADING.
MARIA: USE AT ALL THIS TIME YOU
-- THINGS TURNED DOWN AFTER YOU
REFUSE TO DO WHEN THEY ASKED YOU
TO DO.
HOW DID THINGS TURNED DOWN?
FOR STARTERS YOU WERE EXPECTING
GOVERNMENT CONTRACTS AS PART OF
YOUR BUSINESS AT QUEST.
WHAT HAPPENED?
>> THIS IS THE CRITICAL POINT.
I AM ACCUSED OF TRADING ON
INSIDE INFORMATION IN THE
PERIOD, THE GOVERNMENT CHARGED
ME WITH 43 COUNTS FROM
JANUARY 1ST, 2001, THROUGH
MAY 29, 2001.
I WAS CONVICTED OF 19 ACQUITTED
OF 23.
I WAS CONVICTED OF SOMETHING I
TRADED BETWEEN APRIL AND MAY OF
2001.
FEB. TWENTY-SEVENTH 2001, THE
REASON I WAS INDICTED IN TO THAT
MEETING, THE REASON THE CEO
SHOWS UP BECAUSE YOU ARE AT THE
CONTRACT PHASE AND THE PEOPLE
WANT TO LOOK ACROSS THE TABLE AT
YOU AND KNOW THAT IF THEY NEED
SOMETHING WILL YOU BE THERE FOR
THEM?
I EXPECTED GOING INTO THAT
MEETING THAT WE WERE GOING TO
WIN 50 TO $200 MILLION CONTRACT.
I DID NOT LEARN, WE DID NOT WIN
THAT UNTIL JUNE OF 2001 WHEN
RICHARD CLOCK, A MEMBER OF THE
NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL, HEAD
OF COUNTERTERRORISM AND ACROSS
THE TABLE TO ME IN A MEETING AT
THE STATE DEPARTMENT AND SAID
THAT CONTRACT YOU THOUGHT YOU
WERE GOING TO GET IS GOING TO
SOMEONE ELSE.
THAT IS CLASSIFIED.
THAT IS WHEN I GOT WIND OF IT.
WE LEARNED IN AUGUST WHY IT WENT
THE OTHER WAY AND THE EVENTS OF
SEPTEMBER 27TH, 2001, THE
CONTRACT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT,
THE RETALIATION WE EXPERIENCED
WAS ALL BEING CLASSIFIED AND I
WAS NOT ALLOWED TO TESTIFY IN MY
OWN DEFENSE SO WHEN THE
GOVERNMENT BRINGS UP PEOPLE WHO
SAY WE TOLD THEM THE BUSINESS
PLAN IS RISKY WHO DON'T HAVE
CLASSIFIED CLEARANCES AND DON'T
KNOW ABOUT THIS AND I AM
PREVENTED BY TELLING THEM WHAT I
KNOW, THERE IS NO DEFENSE ON
INSIDER TRADING.
MARIA: WHAT YOU ARE SAYING IS
YOU WERE ASKED TO DO SOMETHING
BY THE NSA, YOU SAID NO, YOU
THOUGHT IT WAS ILLEGAL, YOU SAID
NO, YOUR WORLD CHANGED IN TERMS
OF BUSINESS BEING TAKEN AWAY,
YOU SOLD STOCK BUT YOU DIDN'T
LEARN THE CONTRACT WASN'T COMING
YOUR WAY UNTIL AFTER YOU SOLD
STOCK.
THEY SAID YOU KNEW THAT THE
BUSINESS WAS TURNING DOWN AND
THAT IS WHY YOU SOLD STOCK, YOU
COULD NOT HAVE SOLD STOCK
BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T KNOW YOU
LOSING THE CONTRACT.
>> WHEN I SOLD STOCK I DID IT
UNDER AN SEC RULE THAT WAS A
PROGRAM TRADING PLAN DESIGNED BY
LAWYERS AND I HAD A STOP ORDER
IN AT $38 A SHARE.
IF YOU THINK YOUR STOCK IS GOING
TO GO DOWN BECAUSE YOUR BUSINESS
IS FALLING OFF YOU WOULDN'T PUT
A STOP ORDERING, YOU WOULD SELL
EVERYTHING YOU COULD.
I ALSO DID NOT SELL THE OPTIONS
THAT WERE THE HIGHEST PRICE.
I SOLD THEM AT THE LOWEST PRICE.
YOU WOULD SELL THE OPTIONS THAT
ARE WORTH THE MOST BECAUSE IF
THE STOCK FELL THEY WOULD BE
WORTHLESS.
EVERYTHING I DID WAS
CONTRADICTORY TO WHAT THE
GOVERNMENT SAID MY MOTIVES WERE.
AND THEN I COULDN'T DEFEND
MYSELF.
THAT IS THE THING THAT REALLY
ANNOYED ME ALL THIS TIME.
MARIA: YOU COULDN'T SAY THEY ARE
LOOKING AT INSIDER TRADING
BETWEEN APRIL AND MAY OF THAT
YEAR.
YOU DON'T EVEN LEARN THE REASON
WHY YOU ARE NOT GETTING THE
GOVERNMENT CONTRACT UNTIL AUGUST
OF THAT YEAR AND YOU CAN'T GO ON
THE STAND AND SAY HOW IS IT
POSSIBLE I COULD INSIDER-TRADING
WHEN I DIDN'T EVEN HAVE THIS
INFORMATION AND I HAVE A $30
STOCK?
>> I HAD A $30 STOCK, THE
GOVERNMENT SPENDS THAT, THAT WAS
PART OF MY CONSPIRACY.
IN OTHER WORDS I DIDN'T WANT TO
MAKE A LOT OF MONEY, JUST WANTED
TO MAKE SOME MONEY, MAKES NO
SENSE.
BUT I COULDN'T SAY HERE IS WHAT
I KNEW, HERE IS WHO I WAS
TALKING WITH AND HERE IS WHERE I
LEARNED THE DIFFERENCE.
I ALSO WHEN I GOT INTO THESE
COURTS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT
HAPPENS IN THESE SECRET COURTS
IS YOU DON'T HAVE THE SAME
CONSTITUTIONAL PROTECTIONS YOU
HAVE IN A NORMAL CRIMINAL TRIAL.
FOR EXAMPLE FOR ME TO CALL A
DEFENSE WITNESS I HAD TO TELL
THE PROSECUTION AND THE
GOVERNMENT WHO I WANTED TO CALL
AND THEN THEY WENT IN
INTERVIEWED HIM FIRST SOUGHT
WANTED TO CALL RICHARD CLARK
FROM THE NATIONAL SECURITY
COUNCIL I INTERFACED WITH.
RICHARD TOOK THE FIRST CALL FROM
ME AND ONCE THEY CONTACTED HIM,
WOULDN'T EVEN RETURN OUR PHONE
CALLS.
WE WANTED SUBPOENA POWER ON
DOCUMENTS, THE GOVERNMENT SAID
THE DOCUMENTS DIDN'T EXIST AND
OF COURSE SUBPOENA POWER WAS
TURNED DOWN.
I KNOW THOSE GOVERNMENT
DOCUMENTS EXISTED BECAUSE THIS
ISN'T ALL DONE ON TOILET PAPER.
MARIA: I WANT TO ASK YOU WHAT
OTHER COMPANIES WERE BEING
QUESTIONED TO GIVE UP DATA.
I WANT TO ASK YOU WHAT ELSE YOU
LEARNED ABOUT THE NSA.
DON'T ANSWER RIGHT NOW, WANT TO
TAKE A SHORT BREAK AND CONTINUE
WITH JOE NACHIO'S STORY.
STAY WITH US.
AVOIDT
WHERE AXIRONS APPLIED AS UNEXPECTED SIGNS
OF PUBERTY IN CHILDREN OR CHANGES IN BODY HAIR
OR INCASED ACNE IN WOMEN MAY OCCUR.
REPORT THESE SYMPTOMS TO YOUR DOCTOR.
TELL YOUR DOCTORBOUT ALL
SERIOUS SIDE EFFECTS COULD INCLUDE
R,
WO,
DECREASED *** COUNT, ANKLE, FEET OR BODY SWELLING,
ENLARGED OR PAINFUL ***,
PROBLEMS BREATHING WHILE SLEEPING
AND BLOOD CLOTS IN THE LEGS.
COMMON SIDE EFFECTS INCLUDE SKIN REDNESS
OR IRRITATION WHERE APPLIED, INCREASED RED BLOOD CELL COUNT,
HEADACHE, DIARRHEA, VOMITING, AND INCREASE IN PSA.
ASK YOUR DOCTOR ABOUT AXIRON.
MARIA: SECTOR MOVER OF THE HOUR
IS TELECOM MOVING TO THE UPSIDE
AS FAR AS SECTORS ARE CONCERNED
IN THE S&P 500 IN THE GREEN ONE
OF THE BIGGEST MOVERS IS SPRINT
NEXTEL UP 4 PRESENT ON THE
SESSION.
OTHER BIG MOVERS TO THE UPSIDE
INCLUDE QUALCOMM, VERIZON A BIG
MOVER, THE DOW COMPONENT AS WELL
AND ALSO I WILL POINT OUT
TELECOM AS A SECTOR BEST
PERFORMERS SO FAR THIS WEEK AS
WE START THURSDAY MORNING.
MARIA: THANK YOU.
I AM BACK WITH FORMER QWEST
COMMUNICATIONS CHAIRMAN AND CEO
JOE NACHIO.
FIRST TELEVISION INTERVIEW FROM
BEING RELEASED FROM PRISON.
PRESIDENT OBAMA THIS WEEK
PUSHING FOR THE NSA
SPINE PROGRAM, A PROGRAM OF
COURSES THAT YOU REFUSED TO
COOPERATE WITH.
AT ONE POINT YOU THOUGHT WAS AN
OVERREACH SO YOU REFUSE TO
COOPERATE AND THEN YOUR WORLD
COMPLETELY COLLAPSED.
THE COMPANY LOST GOVERNMENT
CONTRACTS.
ULTIMATELY WERE PROSECUTED AND
WENT TO JAIL FOR INSIDER TRADING
CHARGES THE WE JUST DISCUSSED
WHICH WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE TIME
LINE REALLY DON'T MAKE SENSE.
LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT NSA AND ED
SNOWDEN.
WE READ A PIECE -- DOES THIS
COMPARE --
>> THERE ARE STARK DIFFERENCES.
LET ME GET OUT THE MOST
IMPORTANT DIFFERENCES.
WHAT ED SNOWDEN REVEALED AND HE
DID VIOLATE A LAW IN REVEALING
IT, WAS LEGITIMATE, OF A RISE,
LEGAL INTELLIGENCE OPERATIONS
BASED UPON AUTHORITY THEY
RECEIVED BY AN ACT OF CONGRESS.
HE BROKE HIS CLEARANCE.
HE POTENTIALLY HARM TO THE
COUNTRY.
THAT IS AN ILLEGAL ACT AND I
FEEL BADLY FOR HIM HAVING DONE
THAT.
WHETHER WE LIKE THE PUBLIC
POLICY ISSUE OR NOT IS A
DIFFERENT ISSUE BUT WHAT THEY
WERE DOING WAS LEGAL.
WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT IS
SOMETHING THAT WAS IN MY OPINION
NOT LEGAL AND PRIOR TO 9/11.
SECONDLY, UNLIKE ED SNOWDEN, I
HELD MY OBLIGATION NEVER TO
DISCLOSE, I TOOK A TRIAL, I
DIDN'T TAKE THE STAND, I PAID A
BIG FINANCIAL PRICE, I PAID A
BIG PERSONAL PRICE GOING TO
PRISON AND I COULD NOT CHOOSE TO
BREAK A LOT TO PROVE THAT I
DIDN'T BREAK A DIFFERENT WALL.
THIS BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN
MYSELF AND ED SNOWDEN, THE
GENERAL TOPIC I WOULD SAY IS THE
SAME ALTHOUGH I CAN'T TELL YOU
WHAT WAS SPECIFICALLY ASKED OF
ME IN 2001.
MARIA: WHEN YOU HEARD ABOUT THE
ED SNOWDEN REVELATIONS YOU WERE
IN PRISON, YOU MUST HAVE --
>> WHEN I HEARD ABOUT HIM IT WAS
NO NEWS TO ME.
I THINK THE FOCUS THIS IS ABOUT
TELEPHONE RECORDS AND TELEPHONE
COMPANIES IS TOO NARROW.
THIS IS ABOUT THE ELECTRONIC
AGE.
ANY ELECTRONIC MEDIUM YOU ARE
USING, YOU'RE SMART PHONES,
TWITTER, GOOGLE, FACEBOOK, GET
MONITORED.
MARIA: DO YOU KNOW THAT ALL OF
THOSE COMPANIES GAVE UP THEIR
INFORMATION?
YOU SAID WHAT YOU ARE ASKING ME
TO DO IS ILLEGAL.
I REFUSE TO DO IT BUT THE OTHERS
DID.
>> LET ME PHRASE IT, AT THE TIME
I WAS INVOLVED THOSE COMPANIES
DIDN'T EXIST.
MARIA: I AM TALKING ABOUT --
>> THE OTHER TELECOMS.
THE THING I WOULD POINT OUT IS I
DON'T HAVE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT
ANYBODY DID ANYTHING WRONG BUT I
WOULD SAY TWO THING IS.
THE REQUEST THAT WAS MADE TO ME
WOULD BE ILLOGICAL UNLESS YOU
WERE ABLE TO MONITOR WHAT WAS
GOING ON ON OTHER SIMILAR
NETWORKS.
SECONDLY IN 2008 WHEN THEY
MODIFIED THE FOREIGN
INTELLIGENCE SERVICES ACT
PRESIDENT BUSH GRANTED
RETROACTIVE IN UNITY TO THE
TELECOMS BACK TO 2001 AND THAT
BILL WAS ALMOST HUNG UP ON THAT
POINT AND THAT IS THE FIRST TIME
IN AMERICAN HISTORY RETRO ACT OF
IMMUNITY WAS GRANTED TO PRIVATE
COMPANIES FOR SOMETHING THEY MAY
HAVE DONE WRONG.
I DON'T THINK THEY WOULD HAVE
DONE THAT OF OTHER PEOPLE
WEREN'T INVOLVED.
MARIA: WHAT DO YOU THINK THE NSA
IS LOOKING FOR?
YOU MAKE THE POINT THAT THIS WAS
BEFORE 9/11.
AS ALL OF THIS IS COMING OUT WE
ARE BE LEAVING WE HAVE TO GIVE
UP OUR PRIVACY, IT IS FOR THE
GOVERNMENT TO MONITOR TERRORISM
AFTER 9/11.
THIS BEGAN BEFORE 9/11.
>> LET ME SAY THIS.
I THINK THE JOB THE NSA AND
OTHER INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES, NOT
JUST THE NSA, YOU HAVE A REPORT
A COUPLE WEEKS AGO THE SENATE
INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE BELIEVED
THE CIA WAS SPYING ON THEM AND I
HAVE NO KNOWLEDGE OF THAT.
NOT JUST NSA.
WE HAVE TO BE THE BEST AS A
COUNTRY ON USING THE NEW DIGITAL
TECHNOLOGIES, INTERNET AND
EVERYTHING ELSE TO PROTECT OUR
WELFARE.
THAT IS AN IMPORTANT GOAL,
IMPORTANT RESPONSIBILITY OF THE
GOVERNMENT.
WHAT WE DON'T HAVE TO DO IS GIVE
UP OUR CIVIL LIBERTIES AND
CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS TO DO
THAT.
MARIA: THAT IS WHAT WE ARE
DOING.
>> BEN FRANKLIN IN 1788 SAID IT
WELL, THOSE WHO WILL TRADE THEIR
LIBERTY FOR SECURITY WILL END UP
WITH NEITHER NOR DO THEY DESERVE
EITHER.
THIS IS AN COLD AGE TOPIC.
PEOPLE SHOULD NOT THINK THAT OUR
GOVERNMENT STARTED SPYING ON ITS
CITIZENS AS A RESULT OF 9/11.
THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR A
LONG TIME.
BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT GOVERNMENTS
DO.
I HATE TO SAY IT.
THAT IS WHAT GOVERNMENTS DO.
YOU HAVE A LOT OF PATRIOTIC
PEOPLE ARE VERY ENTHUSIASTIC
ABOUT THEIR JOB WHO JUST GO A
LITTLE BIT TOO FAR AND WHAT WE
HAVE TO BE CAREFUL OF IN THIS
COUNTRY IS OVER A PERIOD OF 10
OR 12 YEARS WE DON'T FIND WE
HAVE CHANGED OUR VALUES,
PRINCIPALS OR CONSTITUTION FOR
THE SAKE OF SECURITY.
I BELIEVE THE TECHNOLOGY AND THE
PEOPLE WE HAVE ARE SMART ENOUGH
THAT YOU CAN HAVE BOTH.
BY THE WAY I NEVER SAID TO
ANYBODY WE WILL HELP YOU AND
ANYTHING.
I SAID SHOW US THE LEGAL
JUSTIFICATION.
THAT IS WHAT WE NEVER GOT.
MARIA: THEY ASKED YOU TO HAND
OVER SOMETHING, THEY ASKED YOU
TO GIVE THEM INFORMATION BUT YOU
WANTED THE LEGAL JUSTIFICATION
FOR HANDING THAT OVER AND
WITHOUT THAT LEGAL JUSTIFICATION
YOU SAID NO.
>> AS CEO OF A PUBLIC COMPANY I
WAS DOWN BY TWO LAWS, THE 96
TELECOM ACT WHICH SUPERSEDED THE
34 TELECOM ACT AND THE 86
ELECTRONIC FREEDOM ACT WHICH
WOULD HAVE PUT SEVERE CRIMINAL
AND CIVIL PENALTIES ON THE
COMPANY IF WE BROKE THE LAW SO
THERE'S ONE THING ABOUT BEING A
PUBLIC COMPANY AND ANOTHER THING
ABOUT BEING UNNAMED INTELLIGENCE
OPERATIONS WHICH IF SOMETHING IS
DISCLOSED EVERYBODY VANISHEDES.
I HAD A FIDUCIARY RESPONSIBILITY
TO MY SHAREOWNERS NOT TO BREAK
THE LAW.
I MADE A LOT OF MONEY AND TIME,
I MADE A LOT OF MONEY.
ALL THAT WAS HELD AGAINST ME.
BOTTOM LINE IS I HAD A FIDUCIARY
RESPONSIBILITY NOT TO BREAK THE
LAW.
MARIA: WE WILL COME BACK AND
FOLLOW UPON INSIDER-TRADING
CHARGES AND ALSO ASK YOU WHAT
NOW?
THEY ARE WATCHING YOU.
ARE YOU GOING TO HAVE MORE
REPERCUSSIONS FROM COMING OUT
AND TALKING TO US TODAY?
WE WILL TAKE A SHORT BREAK AND
THE DITCH BACK WITH JOE NACHIO
AND MORE ON THIS EXT
MARIA: WE ARE TALKING CIVIL
LIBERTIES.
WE ARE BACK WITH FORMER QWEST
COMMUNICATIONS CEO JOE NACHIO,
HIS FIRST TELEVISION INTERVIEW
SINCE HE WAS RELEASED FROM
PRISON.
YOU TOLD US YOUR STORY AND YOU
HAVE DONE A GOOD JOB EXPLAINING
WHEN THIS HAPPENED, HOW THIS
HAPPENED AND LED IT DOWN THE
PATH.
ARE YOU GOING TO GET OFF THE
SET, THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE
SAYING YOU WENT ON TELEVISION
WITH THIS.
>> I SPENT THE LAST FIVE MONTHS
WRITING DOWN SPECIFICALLY WHAT I
WANTED TO SAY AND EVERYTHING I
SAID TODAY COMES OUT OF REDACTED
COURT TRANSCRIPTS WHERE THE
GOVERNMENT ALREADY REJECTED THE
CLASSIFIED INFORMATION.
I SUBMITTED IT, HIRED A LAWYER,
SUBMITTED TO THE AGENCY TO HELP
MY CLEARANCE, THREE WEEKS AGO
THEY CLEARED ME TO SAY WHAT I AM
SAYING TODAY IS SO I HOPE NOBODY
PERCEIVES THAT I SHOULD BE
FURTHER PUNISHED.
IF THEY DO I GUESS WE WILL BE
BACK IN COURT WITH THAT FIGHT.
MARIA: YOU WERE PUNISHED FOR
INSIDER TRADING.
EVERYTHING WAS CLASSIFIED.
>> A NOVEL THEORY OF INSIDER
TRADING, I KNEW THERE WAS TOO
MUCH RISK IN MY BUSINESS PLAN 18
MONTHS IN THE FUTURE.
THE KNOWLEDGE I HAD, I COULD
PREDICT THE FUTURE PERFECTLY.
MARIA: YOU DIDN'T KNOW YOU WERE
GOING TO LOSE GOVERNMENT
CONTRACTS.
WHAT DO YOU DO NOW?
>> I AM WRITING THE BOOK, THAT I
COULD TALK TODAY.
ASKING ME TO GET BACK DOING
PRIVATE EQUITY WORK.
I AM NOT A MEMBER OF A PUBLIC
COMPANY.
IT IS A BIG ADJUSTMENT PERIOD.
MARIA: HOW TOUGH WAS IT?
>> VERY TOUGH BEING AWAY FROM
THE FAMILY.
IT WAS TOUGH THE LAST 12 YEARS.
ON A CASE THAT WAS TOTALLY
MISDIRECTED.
PRISON IS A TOUGH PLACE TO BE.
I DON'T CARE WHAT PEOPLE TELL
YOU.
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A CLUB
FED.
I CAN GIVE YOU A COUPLE PLACES
TO GO TO.
IT IS A TOUGH WORLD.
I-MAN AN ADJUSTMENT PERIOD.
MARIA: YOU ARE ADJUSTING?
>> EVERY DAY I WAKE UP AND AM
THANKFUL TO BE HERE.
MARIA: THE UPSETS OF CIVIL
LIBERTIES IS AN ENORMOUS STORY.
YOU ARE A CALM AND THAT STORY.
>> WE DON'T WANT TO CHANGE THE
VALUES OF THE COUNTRY, OUR
CONSTITUTION AND CIVIL LIBERTIES
BECAUSE WE ARE THREATENED BY A
BROAD OF THE NEW WEB.
WE DO BOTH EFFECTIVELY.
WE ARE NOT DOING BOTH
EFFECTIVELY, CIVIL LIBERTIES ARE
BEING TRADED FOR SECURITY,
DANGEROUS SLIPPERY SLOPE FOR THE
AMERICAN PUBLIC.
MARIA: THAT IS THE FINAL WORD.
WE ARE WORKING ON A SPECIAL WITH
YOU.
WE WILL DO MORE ON THIS BECAUSE
THIS STORY HAS MORE LEGS TO A.
WE WILL HAVE D-BACKS IN.
JOEL NACHIO, THAT WILL DO IT FOR