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Ideally this happens on a national level, but
I don't know that we have the political will to achieve something like this
on a national level. It seems like it
evolves
in the coast and kind of works its way closer to the center of the country
Brian, do you want to argue with me on that?---
Thats is too broad. Certainly, I'd like to argue with that. The coast
certainly can be leaders
in a lot that happens in recycling. But, don't pick on the center part of the states
there are some really neat examples
in Minnesota. Even in Chicago area they're doing some things
that I think are pretty nice to remark.
It may be the more populated areas seem to
focus on recycling things because they perhaps see more of the impact
initially
and more of the populated areas are on the coast.---
Well, I think if you have a municipal recycling program in place already
then there are no drawbacks to increasing participation
at all. But, the question is:
what are you really trying to achieve as a municipality?
Are you trying to save landfill costs?
Are you trying - as Brian points out - to
bring your city in line to a model of
sustainability and all that entails
in terms of material sustainability and energy sustainability?
So, I think each city in each place really has to stop and
ask themselves: Why do we recycle?
A number of years ago, there was a book
that came out with that title: Why do we recycle? by Frank Ackerman
and I think it's a good question to
kind of remind ourselves of on a regular basis because there are a lot of
different goals that can be
sought through recycling and some of them
may be impacted more by recycling than others.
But in the end it's it's up to each individual municipality
to have that discussion with their citizens.---
I'd like to put -
I don't disagree with things, but I want to put a different
spin, on a different angle. For those
that have worked in a solid waste authority type of role that deal with
recycling,
collection, landfill related costs
in all those things. There is a lot of noise coming through. Is everyone know else
hearing that?---
Yeah, my microphone.---
It is working Kate--- In that regard, if you (consider)
a system that includes all of that
when they increase recycling that diverts from the landfill, which is in a
lot of ways a very good thing,
but it hurts the economy of scale of the landfill, and so they raise the rates.
So, the system costs isn't just
one-dimensional. It is more comprehensive than that. -- Right. ---
So, we need to look at it in a sustainable way. And, I am not saying diverting
from landfill isn't a good thing to do
but there can be an increase cost there and we may
take on some some new ventures in recycling
such as - and I'm going to take maybe an extreme example - having special
collection
for polystyrene packaging
which might be quite expensive for the volume we get
and so we need to look at the whole package
of what it costs and recycling does have
somewhat of a cost to it and - we're looking at - and again it is sustainability and i'm
looking at (it) as a triple bottom line:
people, planet and profit or the economy,
and we still need to drive for what is best overall
long-term and its not looking at the status quo, but there can be
unintended consequences when we benefit one aspect of the whole system
and not pay attention to what's happening to the other aspects of the system.
I'm not negating increasing recycling at all,
but I think sometimes are some other unintended consequences.---
I would add to that. I mean
relatively minor. I think it is important to
increase recycling and I think I'm that's a desirable
outcome. However, I would say
that it's not with out potential negative consequences.
One of them is: if you push it too hard -
the recycling commodity - the quality of the material suffers.
You get increased contamination rates.
So, there are are some other factors to consider
rather than just increasing the quantity all the time.
But, I think those things can be managed and dealt with. It's just
a matter of looking at it and ensuring that the quality stays high