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>> GOVERNOR BEV PERDUE VETOES THE HOUSE AND SENATE'S
2012 COMPROMISE BUDGET.
WHAT IT MEANS HEADING INTO THE WEEKEND, NEXT.
QUALITY PUBLIC TELEVISION IS MADE POSSIBLE THROUGH
THE FINANCIAL CONTRIBUTIONS OF VIEWERS LIKE YOU
WHO INVITE YOU TO JOIN THEM IN SUPPORTING UNC-TV
[MUSIC]
>> HELLO.
I'M KELLY MCCULLEN. THANK YOU FOR WATCHING THIS WEEK.
GOVERNOR BEV PERDUE SET THE TONE OF THE 2012 LEGISLATIVE
SESSION'S FINAL DAYS BY VETOING THE COMPROMISE BUDGET BILL,
REPUBLICANS PASSED LAST WEEK.
GOVERNOR PERDUE'S FRIDAY MORNING PRESS CONFERENCE OUTLINED HER
REASONS FOR VETOING THE BUDGET BILL AND HAVE APPEARED THIS
BUDGET HAD ENOUGH DEMOCRATIC SUPPORT IN THE HOUSE TO AVOID A
VETO.
SHE SAID EXPIRING TEMPORARY FEDERAL EDUCATION MONEY IS NOT
BEING REPLACED WITH ENOUGH NEW STATE DOLLARS, CREATING AN EVEN
DEEPER HOLE FOR THE SCHOOLS, DESPITE REPUBLICAN ARGUMENTS
THEY'RE SPENDING MORE STATE DOLLARS ON PUBLIC EDUCATION.
>> NOT ONLY ARE WE FAILING TO DO BETTER IN THIS BUDGET BUT UNDER
THE BUDGET THAT HAS BEEN PASSED UNDER THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, WE
ACTUALLY DO WORSE.
IF THE BUDGET THEY PASS BECOMES LAW, SCHOOLS ACROSS NORTH
CAROLINA WILL GET ABOUT $190 MILLION LESS THAN THEY GOT LAST
YEAR.
>> REPUBLICAN LEADERS WARNED THAT HER VETO WOULD LIKELY MEAN
THE 2011 BUDGET LAW WOULD REMAIN IN EFFECT IF HER VETO COULDN'T
BE OVERRIDDEN.
THE BUDGET WAS PASSED WHEN FIVE HOUSE DEMOCRATS JOINED EVERY
HOUSE REPUBLICAN TO OVERRIDE THE GOVERNOR'S BUDGET VETO.
>> SO WE HOPE THE GOVERNOR WILL REALIZE THIS IS GOING TO HELP
SCHOOLS, IT'S GOING TO HELP MEDICAID, IT'S GOING TO HELP A
LOT OF OTHER AREAS IN THE STATE.
AND IN THE ABSENCE OF THIS, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO GO BACK
TO A BUDGET LAST YEAR THAT WE FEEL LIKE IT'S GOING TO MAKE
EDUCATION AND HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES AND OTHER AREAS OF THE
STATE VERY DIFFICULT TO MANAGE THEIR FINANCES IN THE NEXT YEAR.
>> THE HOUSE MINORITY LEADER TOLD LEGISLATIVE WEEK IN REVIEW
THAT THAT HOUSE VETO-PROOF MAJORITY MIGHT NOT HOLD IF THE
GOVERNOR WERE TO VETO THIS BUDGET BILL.
>> WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO DO THIS TIME.
IN FACT, THERE ARE INDICATIONS THAT WILL NOT HAPPEN, AGAIN.
SO DEMOCRATS, AH, HAVE NEVER BEEN EITHER IN THE CONGRESS OR
HERE OR IN MY TIME IN THE LEGISLATURE A CRACK THE WHIP
KIND OF CAUCUS.
>> THE NEW BUDGET BILL'S PROVISIONS WOULD HAVE TAKEN
EFFECT JULY 1st, THIS WEEKEND.
BUT WITH NO NEW BUDGET BILL SIGNED, THE CURRENT BUDGET ROLLS
ALONG INTO ITS SECOND YEAR, WITH SPENDING CUTS HOLDING, FEDERAL
EDUCATION MONEY EXPIRED AND NOT FILLED EVEN PARTIALLY, AND ANY
2012 SPENDING PROMISES CERTAINLY ON HOLD.
AS OF FRIDAY AFTERNOON, DEMOCRATIC REPRESENTATIVES
WILLIAM BRISSON AND DEWEY HILL SAY THEY'LL VOTE TO OVERRIDE
GOVERNOR PERDUE'S VETO.
THE REPUBLICANS, IF UNITED AND PRESENT FOR THE OVERRIDE VOTE,
NEED TWO ADDITIONAL DEMOCRATIC VOTE.
EXTENDED INTERVIEWS WITH HOUSE MAJORITY LEADER PAUL STAM AND
CAROLINA JOURNAL'S BARRY SMITH ARE COMING UP.
BUT, FIRST, HERE'S THE MEAT OF GOVERNOR PERDUE'S COMMENTS ON
THE BUDGET VETO FRIDAY MORNING.
>> NOW, I UNDERSTAND CLEARLY THAT WE HAVE A DIVIDED
GOVERNMENT IN NORTH CAROLINA.
AND I UNDERSTAND THAT WITH THE REPUBLICAN MAJORITY IN THE
GENERAL ASSEMBLY, LEGISLATORS WERE NEVER LIKELY TO PASS A
BUDGET THAT MADE ALL THE INVESTMENTS THAT I THOUGHT WERE
NECESSARY FOR THE FUTURE OF NORTH CAROLINA.
BUT I WAS PREPARED FROM DAY ONE TO COMPROMISE.
I WAS WILLING AND DETERMINED TO WORK WITH THE LEADERS OF THE
GENERAL ASSEMBLY TO REACH A BUDGET AGREEMENT THAT I COULD
ALLOW TO BECOME LAW.
I REALLY WANTED THAT TO HAPPEN.
SO AFTER THE BUDGET WAS PASSED LAST WEEK, AND I HAD TIME TO
REVIEW IT, YOU KNOW THAT I REACHED OUT TO SPEAKER TILLIS
AND PRESIDENT PRO-TEM BERGER, AND REALLY TRIED TO FORGE A
CONSENSUS WITH THEM.
NOW, THE BUDGET HAS BEEN PASSED, THE ONE I PROPOSED, WERE FAR
APART.
I DIDN'T ASK THE LEADERS TO MEET ME HALFWAY, I DIDN'T ASK THEM
EVEN TO SPLIT THE DIFFERENCE.
I SIMPLY ASKED THEM QUITE CLEARLY TO DO JUST A LITTLE BIT
BETTER.
I ASKED THEM TO INVEST A LITTLE BIT MORE IN OUR CHILDREN'S
FUTURE AND IN SOME OTHER KEY PRIORITIES FOR THE PEOPLE OF
THIS STATE.
I THOUGHT THE LEADERS AND I HAD POSITIVE DISCUSSIONS.
BUT THEY ULTIMATELY TOLD ME NO.
THEY SAID TO ME, TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT.
I REFUSED TO GIVE UP.
I URGED THEM TO KEEP WORKING.
AND I ACTUALLY REMAINED HOPEFUL THAT WE COULD REACH AN
AGREEMENT.
THEN EARLIER THIS WEEK, YOU ALL KNOW THAT WE LEARNED THAT THE
STATE'S FISCAL YEAR IS GOING TO CLOSE OUT WITH AN ADDITIONAL $
117 MILLION IN OVERCOLLECTED REVENUE.
I WAS REALLY IMMEDIATELY HOPEFUL THAT THIS UNEXPECTED MONEY COULD
PROVIDE A PATH FORWARD TO A BIPARTISAN AGREEMENT, I REALLY
THOUGHT THAT COULD HAPPEN.
SO AGAIN, I REACHED OUT TO THE SPEAKER AND TO THE PRESIDENT
PRO-TEM, AND I URGED THEM TO VOTE A FEW OF THESE DOLLARS TO
THE RESOURCES IN OUR SCHOOLS, TO JOBS, TO PUBLIC SAFETY, AND
OTHER CRITICAL AREAS.
LET ME BE CLEAR.
THE EXTRA INVESTMENT THAT I ASKED FOR WOULD NOT HAVE
CORRECTED ALL THE FLAWS THAT WERE IN THE BUDGET, FAR FROM IT.
EVEN WITH THESE EXTRA INVESTMENTS, THE BUDGET WAS
GONNA BE A LONG WAY FROM THE BUDGET THAT I PRESENTED AND
WOULD LEAVE A LOT OF IMPORTANT NEEDS UNMET.
BUT IN LIGHT OF THE REALITY THAT WE FIND OURSELVES IN, IN LIGHT
OF THE POLICY AND THE IDEOLOGICAL DIVISION IN OUR
GOVERNMENT THESE DAYS, AND IN LIGHT OF ALL THE DISAGREEMENTS,
I THOUGHT THE BUDGET AGREEMENT I OFFERED THEM ACTUALLY MADE
SENSE.
THE EXTRA RESOURCES I REQUESTED WERE REASONABLE.
THEY WOULD HAVE MADE THE BUDGET JUST A LITTLE BIT BETTER.
AND I ACTUALLY BELIEVED THEY WOULD HAVE HELPED PREPARE OUR
KIDS TO MORE SUCCESSFULLY COMPETE IN THE WORK FORCE OF THE
FUTURE.
MORE IMPORTANTLY, THE AGREEMENT I OFFERED WAS A WORKABLE
COMPROMISE THAT COULDN'T, THAT COULD HAVE GOTTEN DONE.
ALL IT TOOK WAS A WILLINGNESS TO COOPERATE.
I'M SORRY TO REPORT TO YOU TODAY THAT THEY AGAIN TOLD ME NO, THEY
AGAIN SAID IN SO MANY WORDS TO TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT.
SO AFTER LONG AND CAREFUL CONSIDERATION OF MORE THAN TWO
WEEKS, AND MANY OFFERS, I'VE DECIDED THAT I HAVE NO CHOICE
BUT TO VETO THIS BUDGET.
>> THAT WAS THE GOVERNOR BEV PERDUE, VETOING YOUR BILL,
MAJORITY LEADER PAUL STAM, REPRESENTATIVE FROM WAKE COUNTY.
THANKS FOR BEING ON THE SHOW.
DID SHE THREATEN TO VETO THIS BILL BEFORE THE REPUBLICAN
DEMOCRATIC CAUCUS THINNED OUT FOR THE WEEKEND?
>> OH, SHE DID, SURE.
SHE'S BEEN THREATENING TO VETO IT FOR A WHILE.
>> SO YOU WEREN'T SURPRISED THIS MORNING, YOU HEAR A PRESS
CONFERENCE BEING CALLED FOR 10:00 A.M.
>> ACTUALLY, I WAS SURPRISED BECAUSE HER ACTION IS COMPLETELY
DIFFERENT THAN HER REASONS.
HER REASONS IS THAT SHE WANTS MORE MONEY FOR, PRIMARILY FOR
EDUCATION, K-12 EDUCATION, BUT HER ACTION, IF HER VETO IS
SUSTAINED, IS THERE'S A QUARTER OF A BILLION DOLLARS LESS FOR
K-12 EDUCATION.
QUARTER OF A BILLION DOLLARS LESS FOR MEDICAID.
SO TO ACCOMPLISH WHAT SHE WANTS TO ACCOMPLISH, SHE DID EXACTLY
THE OPPOSITE ACT.
>> THE BILL, THE BUDGET IS $ $20.3, POINT $2 BILLION.
AND FROM WHAT I HEARD THURSDAY, COMPARED TO TODAY, FRIDAY, IT
SEEMS THAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HER VETO AND THE
SIGNATURE ON A BUDGET.
ARE YOU BUYING THAT OR IS THIS JUST THE FIRST CHIP BEING THROWN
OUT BY HER TO CREATE A WEEKEND OF BUDGET NEGOTIATIONS?
>> I THINK SHE BELIEVES THAT MOST PEOPLE CAN'T COUNT, THAT
THEY THINK THAT'S A LARGE AMOUNT OF MONEY AS A PERCENTAGE OF
$20.2 BILLION, AND IT'S NOT.
BUT THE STRANGE THING ABOUT IT IS THAT EXTRA $100 MILLION IS
NOT EVEN THERE.
IT'S, ESSENTIALLY, WE'RE GETTING MONEY IN MAY AND JUNE, INSTEAD
OF IN JULY AND AUGUST, BECAUSE OF SOME QUIRKS OF TAX LAW.
SO SHE'S THINKING SHE CAN SPEND MONEY THAT IS JUST COMING OUT OF
RECEIPTS FOR THE NEXT FISCAL YEAR.
>> BUT SHE SAYS IT'S THERE TO BE SPENT.
AND IN LAYMAN'S TERMS, WHAT DOES IT MEAN?
TAX LAW ASIDE, IF I'M DOING MY HOUSEHOLD BUDGET AND I HAVE $117
MILLION TO SPEND IN THE SCHEME OF THINGS, HOW DOES IT WORK, HOW
DOES IT WORK SO WE CAN UNDERSTAND IT?
>> SURE.
YOUR EMPLOYER DECIDES TO PAY YOU A WEEK EARLY, SO, THEREFORE,
SINCE YOU HAVE TWICE AS MUCH MONEY FOR THE WEEK, YOU DECIDE
TO TAKE A VACATION.
WELL, NEXT WEEK, YOU HAVE NOTHING.
SO YOU CAN'T PAY YOUR MORTGAGE OR BUY YOUR FOOD.
IT'S ACCOUNTING GIMMICK.
>> YOU'RE SAYING THE STATE WOULD BE SPENDING ITS REVENUE, INSTEAD
OF WHEN IT SHOULD BE SPENT, THEY'RE SPENDING IT EARLY, AND
THEN YOU'LL NEED TO FILL THAT HOLE EVENTUALLY?
>> WELL, WE'RE RECEIVING THAT $100 MILLION EARLY, ACCORDING TO
THE PROFESSIONAL ECONOMISTS.
>> IS THERE A CHANCE THAT IF YOU WERE TO GO HER DIRECTION WITH
$117 MILLION, IF THE ECONOMY COULD GROW, COULD YOU SAFELY
ASSUME THAT WE'LL HAVE $117 MILLION AS A STATE, COME JUNE
30th OF 2013?
>> ABSOLUTELY NOT.
OUR PROFESSION ECONOMISTS TELL US ABSOLUTELY NOT.
>> GIVEN THE GOVERNOR'S POSITION, SHE'S NOT RUNNING FOR
REELECTION, YOU COULD ARGUE SHE HAS NOTHING TO LOSE BY VETOING
THIS BUDGET, BECAUSE SHE WILL NOT BE DEFEATED FOR OFFICE,
THERE WILL BE A NEW GOVERNOR AND LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR COMING ON
BOARD.
WHAT DOES THIS DO DOWN HERE?
WHAT DOES IT DO TO THE REPUBLICANS IN THE SENATE AND IN
THE HOUSE?
I KNOW YOU CAN'T SPEAK FOR THE HOUSE, BUT HOW DOES THIS CHANGE
THE DYNAMIC GOING FORWARD?
>> WELL, SHE'S ACTING IN AN INCOMPREHENSIBLE MANNER.
BUT WHEN WE GET TO OVERRIDE, THE OVERRIDE VOTE ON MONDAY, I'M
BELIEVING THAT THE DEMOCRATS OF THE HOUSE WILL BE MORE
UNDERSTANDING ABOUT IT AND REALIZING THAT IF THEY DON'T
OVERRIDE THE VETO, THERE'S NO PAY RAISE, THERE'S NO COST OF
LIVING ADJUSTMENT FOR RETIREES, THERE'S A QUARTER OF A BILLION
LEFT FOR EDUCATION, QUARTER OF A BILLION LEFT FOR MEDICAID.
AND IT JUST MAKES NO SENSE.
>> YOUR CROSS-OVER DEMOCRATS, I CAN COUNT THREE OFF THE TOP OF
MY HEAD THAT WON'T BE BACK HERE.
SO THEY HAVE NOTHING TO LOSE BY STICKING WITH THE GOVERNOR.
REPRESENTATIVE WILLIAM BRISNER SAID HE WILL STICK WITH IT, BUT
HE BARELY SURVIVED THE DEMOCRATIC CHALLENGE.
SO IS THE IDEA THAT YOUR CROSS-OVER VOTES AREN'T
NECESSARILY SEEKING REELECTION, DOES THAT TAKE SOME OF THAT
STATIC OFF AND SOME OF THAT TENSION THAT YOU WOULD NEED TO
GET THOSE 70-ODD VOTES YOU NEED?
>> I THINK THOSE CROSS-OVER DEMOCRATS, AND I'M HOPEFUL OTHER
DEMOCRATS WHO REALIZE THE CONSEQUENCE OF A NO VOTE WILL
JUST EXERCISE GOOD JUDGMENT AND REALIZE THIS IS NOT A POLITICAL
VOTE.
IT'S A VOTE ON WHETHER THEY WANT THE SPENDING TO ACTUALLY GO UP
2.5% FROM LAST YEAR, OR IF THEY WANT IT TO GO LESS.
AND EVERY DEMOCRAT I TALKED TO WANTS SPENDING TO GO UP.
THAT'S THE NAME OF THEIR GAME.
>> NOW, SET ASIDE THE ANTICIPATED REVENUE, THE
OVERPAYMENT AS SHE CALLS IT, WHAT YOU SAY IS THIS EARLY
PAYMENT.
THE SENATE WANTED A $100 MILLION RAINY DAY FUND FOR MEDICAID THAT
I DON'T RECALL YOU IN THE HOUSE HAVING THAT IN, BUT NONETHELESS,
THAT'S A RESERVE FUND OF $100 MILLION, $17 MILLION LESS THAN
SHE WOULD SAY WOULD MAKE HER HAPPY.
CAN YOU BEND ON THE RAINY DAY RESERVE FUND?
WOULD THE HOUSE BE WILLING TO DO THAT?
BECAUSE IT IS A SENATE IDEA AND YOU GAVE THE SENATE A LOT IN
THEIR BUDGET.
>> WELL, TO GO DOWN TO ZERO IN A BUDGET WOULD BE VERY IMPRUDENT
FISCAL FOLLY.
OUR REVENUE ESTIMATES ARE JUST THAT, ESTIMATE.
$100 MILLION CUSHION OUT OF $20.2 BILLION IS WAY LESS THAN
THE STATUTES CALL FOR.
IT'S PERILOUSLY CLOSE TO WHAT WE SHOULD NOT DO.
>> LOOKING AHEAD TO THIS WEEKEND AND TO EARLY NEXT WEEK FOR FOLKS
WHO WILL CERTAINLY KEY IN ON WHAT LEGISLATORS DO FOR ONCE,
HOW DOES THE PROCESS WORK?
WILL IT BE YOU ON THE PHONE?
WILL IT BE REPRESENTATIVE TILLIS?
OR BRUBAKER, WHO COWROTE IT?
HOW DOES THE PROCESS WORK DEALING WITH A CONTROVERSY LIKE
THIS?
OR THE BUDGET IS NOW IN CONTROVERSY.
>> WELL, WE'RE POLITICIANS.
AND WE TALK A LOT, AND WE TALK TO OTHER MEMBERS, AND WE TRY TO
EXPLAIN THE REASONS FOR A YES VOTE AND TRY TO COUNTER THE
ARGUMENTS FOR A NO VOTE.
>> ARE YOU DOING THAT WITHIN THE HOUSE DEMOCRAT AND REPUBLICAN
CAUCUS OR DO YOU GO TO GOVERNOR PERDUE, AND INSTEAD OF CALLING A
PRESS CONFERENCE TO URGE HER, CAN YOU PICK UP THE PHONE AND
TALK TO HER PEOPLE AND SAY, HEY, WHAT ARE YOU DOING?
>> WELL, SHE'S ALREADY VETOED IT.
I DON'T ACTUALLY KNOW OF ANY WAY TO UN-VETO A VETOED BILL, IF
SHE, I THINK SHE'S PROBABLY HOPING THAT WE'LL OVERRIDE IT,
SO SHE DOES GET THE EXTRA MONEY.
BUT SHE CAN TAKE CREDIT FOR VETOING IT TO SORT OF SHOW HER
METTLE.
>> NOW, SHE BROUGHT UP A BUSINESS TAX EXEMPTION, $336
MILLION, THE DEMOCRATS HAVE BRANDED THIS A TAX CUT FOR THE
WEALTHY.
HOW DO YOU SEE THIS?
IT LOOKS LIKE $336 MILLION THE STATE COULD HAVE OTHERWISE.
>> FIRST OF ALL, THE ECONOMISTS SAY THAT TAX BREAK AND THE OTHER
TAX BREAKS IN OUR BUDGET BILL, THE SURCHARGE ONE ON CORPORATE
PERSONAL INCOME, PRODUCE ABOUT 4,000 JOBS PER YEAR, ADDITIONAL
PRIVATE SECTOR JOBS.
SECONDLY, THE TAX EXEMPTION THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT IS ON THE
FIRST $50,000, NOT THE LAST $50,000, ON THE FIRST $50,000.
AND IT'S NOT ON SALARIES.
IT'S ON PROFITS AND DISTRIBUTIONS.
SO DISTRIBUTIONS FROM AN LLC OR A PARTNERSHIP.
>> IF YOU ONLY WORK FOR A SMALL BUSINESS, THEIR SALARIES ARE NOT
EXEMPTED FROM INCOME TAXES.
THIS IS THE PROFIT OFF THE CORPORATION AFTER ALL EXPENSES
ARE PAID.
>> RIGHT.
BUT IT'S IT ALSO DOESN'T APPLY TO THE SALARIES OF THE OWNERS.
ONLY ON THE PROFIT OF THE DISTRIBUTIONS, WHICH IS FAR, FAR
LESS.
>> NOW, IF THE SENATE DOES AS PROMISED, IF YOU CAN'T OVERRIDE
IT, YOU WON'T FIGHT IT TOO HARD, YOU'LL GO HOME AND STICK BY YOUR
GUNS IN YEAR 2 OF THIS BUDGET PLAN.
IS YEAR 2 OF YOUR BUDGET DUE TO NORTH CAROLINA, PROVIDED YOU
DON'T GET THE OPPORTUNITY TO TWEAK WHAT YOU THOUGHT YOU MIGHT
TWEAK ONCE YOU SAT DOWN.
>> WELL, OBVIOUSLY, I THOUGHT WE PREPARED THE BUDGET THIS YEAR TO
THE BUDGET FOR NEXT YEAR THAT WE PASSED LAST YEAR, OR WE WOULDN'T
HAVE PASSED IT.
BUT IT'S A LIVABLE BUDGET.
AND WE'LL MAKE DO.
AND STILL BE MORE SAVINGS.
BUT WE'LL MAKE DO.
>> REPRESENTATIVE PAUL STAM, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING ON
THE SHOW TALKING ABOUT THIS BUDGET AND THIS LATE-BREAKING
FRIDAY DEVELOPMENT.
>> THANKS.
>> A FEW STATE AGENCIES HAVE THEIR FUNDING ELIMINATED IN
YEAR TWO OF THE CURRENT BUDGET AS THEIR OPERATIONS UNDERWENT
WHAT'S CALLED A CONTINUATION REVIEW.
THAT MEANS LAWMAKERS CONSIDER THE AGENCY'S RELEVANCY BUT
WITHHOLD FUNDING, MAKING IT ZERO WITH THE OPTION OF RESTORING
FUNDS.
CURRENT AGENCIES WITH ZERO FUNDING BEGINNING JULY 1st ARE
THE DMV'S DRIVERS LICENSE PROGRAM, UNC CENTER FOR PUBLIC
TELEVISION - THIS TV NETWORK, THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY'S BUILDING
AND MAINTENANCE DIVISION WHICH OPERATES THE LEGISLATIVE
BUILDING, FAMILY COURTS, THE DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE'S OFFICE
OF SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY, THE WILDLIFE COMMISSION'S
CONSERVATION EDUCATION DIVISION AND DHHS'S DIVISION OF
INFORMATION RESOURCE MANAGEMENT.
THE EDITOR OF THE CAROLINA JOURNAL, BARRY SMITH, WHO WAS AT
BEV PERDUE'S PRESS CONFERENCE THIS MORNING.
YOU GET THE E-MAIL AND WHAT DO YOU THINK?
YOU THINK OF VETO GOING INTO THIS OR SOMETHING ELSE?
>> YEAH.
I'M STILL THINKING SHE'S GOING TO LET THE BUDGET BECOME LAW
WITHOUT HER SIGNATURE.
WHAT I'VE LEARNED, I THINK I SAID EARLIER, I'VE LEARNED TWO
THINGS.
NOT TO PREDICT THE SUPREME COURT AND NOT TO PREDICT GOVERNOR
PERDUE.
BECAUSE SHE DIDN'T DO WHAT I THOUGHT SHE WAS GOING TO DO.
>> LOOKING AT THE SCOPE OF THIS, PEOPLE ARE USED TO SEEING IN THE
LEGISLATURE PASS, WHAT ARE CALLED A CONTINUING RESOLUTION,
WE DON'T HAVE A BILL, WE'LL PATCH IT UP FOR A COUPLE OF
WEEKS WHILE WE REACH A REAL BILL.
IS THAT THE CASE?
>> WELL, IT'S ALWAYS DIFFERENT IN THE SECOND YEAR OF THE
BIENNIUM.
THAT'S BECAUSE LAST YEAR, THEY ACTUALLY PASS ADD TWO-YEAR
BUDGET.
NOW, THE SECOND YEAR DID NOT INCLUDE AS MUCH MONEY FOR A LOT
OF THINGS, INCLUDING EDUCATION, AS THE FIRST YEAR.
WHEN GOVERNOR PERDUE SAYS THAT THE MONEY IS GOING TO BE LESS
FOR THIS COMING YEAR THAN IT WAS FOR THE PAST YEAR, THAT'S TRUE.
ALSO, WHEN THE SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE AND THE PRESIDENT PRO-TEM
OF THE SENATE SAY THE MONEY IS GOING TO BE MORE FOR EDUCATION
NEXT YEAR THAN IT WOULD BE OTHERWISE WITHOUT THIS BUDGET,
THAT'S TRUE ALSO, BECAUSE THEY DID ADD SOME MONEY TO THE
EDUCATION BUDGET.
>> WHAT KIND OF HAND IS IT TO PLAY?
YOU'RE PLAYING THIS POLITICAL GAME OF POKER, WHERE THE
GOVERNOR SAYS YOU DIDN'T GIVE ENOUGH MONEY.
SO I'M GONNA REJECT YOUR DEAL AND MAKE YOU LIVE BY THE BUDGET
YOU PASSED LAST YEAR.
>> WELL, IN SOME WAYS, SHE IS TRYING TO MAKE THE LEGISLATORS,
THE LEGISLATIVE LEADERSHIP BLINK.
SHE IS TRYING TO MAKE THE REPUBLICAN LEADERSHIP BLINK.
SHE HASN'T BEEN ABLE TO DO THAT SO FAR.
IT DIDN'T WORK LAST YEAR, THE REPUBLICANS WERE ABLE TO GARNER
I THINK, WHAT, FIVE DEMOCRATS IN THE HOUSE, TO OVERRIDE THE
BUDGET.
AND ALSO, LAST YEAR, THEY HAD THE SUPER MAJORITY IN THE
SENATE.
THEY DIDN'T NEED ANY DEMOCRATS.
THIS YEAR, WE'RE NOT SO SURE.
IF THEY'RE GOING TO BE DOING THAT.
THEY VOTED FOR THE BUDGET, BUT THEY'VE INDICATED THAT THAT'S
NOT A SURE WHEN IT COMES TO OVERRIDE THE VETO.
>> THE OBSERVER THIS MORNING HAS AN ARTICLE WITH SOME DEMOCRATS
QUOTED.
YOU DON'T NEED ALL FIVE OF THOSE CROSS-OVERS TO STAY, YOU JUST
NEED A COUPLE TO PEEL OFF.
AND YOU DO NOT HAVE A SUPER MAJORITY.
>> YOU'RE GOING TO NEED FOUR IF EVERYBODY VOTES, YOU'RE GOING TO
NEED FOUR DEMOCRATS.
>> AND DEWEY HAS SAID I MIGHT STAND WITH THE GOVERNOR OR TAKE
A WALK.
>> AND IF A COUPLE OF THEM TAKE A WALK, THAT MIGHT IN SOME WAYS
HURT THEIR CASE, UNLIKE A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT, YOU
HAVE TO HAVE THEM VOTING AND PRESENT.
SO IF YOU'RE NOT THERE, THEN YOU DON'T COUNT.
INTERESTING YOU BROUGHT THAT UP, THOUGH.
THE PRESSURE IS REALLY ON THOSE FOUR OR FIVE DEMOCRATS.
AND MAYBE SOME OTHERS.
ARE THEY GOING TO, ARE THEY GOING TO GO AHEAD AND VOTE TO
OVERRIDE THE VETO SO THAT MORE MONEY DOES GET INTO EDUCATION
AND THESE OTHER PROGRAMS THAN OTHERWISE WOULDN'T BE?
OR ARE THEY GOING TO STICK WITH THE GOVERNOR AND RISK THE
POSSIBILITY OF THAT MONEY NOT BEING IN THERE.
>> WAIT A MINUTE.
WHY DOES IT FALL ON FIVE DEMOCRATS IN THE HOUSE OUT OF
120, WHEN THE REPUBLICANS COULD SIT DOWN WITH GOVERNOR BEV
PERDUE AND SPLIT UP $117 MILLION, AND IF THAT MONEY'S NOT
THERE JUNE 30th OF NEXT YEAR, WORRY ABOUT IT THEN?
>> THEY COULD DO THAT.
REPUBLICAN LEADERSHIP SAYS THAT THEY FEEL IT WOULD BE
IRRESPONSIBLE TO DO, THAT WHEN YOU COULD BE DOING IS IN EFFECT
GIVING THE NEW GOVERNOR, AND WE'RE GETTING A NEW GOVERNOR IN
JANUARY, GOVERNOR PERDUE IS NOT RUNNING AGAIN, SO THAT NEW
GOVERNOR COULD END UP HAVING TO ON THE FIRST DAY IN OFFICE MAKE
BIG TIME BUDGET CUTS JUST TO MAKE THE BUDGET BALANCE.
I MEAN THE GOVERNOR'S GOT THE RESPONSIBILITY, CONSTITUTIONAL
RESPONSIBILITY TO DO THAT.
THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S SIMILAR TO WHAT HAPPENED IF YOU REMEMBER
WAY BACK WHEN MIKE EASLEY FIRST BECAME GOVERNOR.
THAT'S PRETTY MUCH WHAT HE DEALT WITH THE FIRST COUPLE OF WEEKS.
>> WHEN A BUDGET LIKE THIS STAYS ON THE BOOKS, IT'S A TWO-YEAR
BUDGET BILL.
JULY 1st, THIS WEEKEND, THAT'S THE DEADLINE, THEY WILL COME IN
AFTER THAT.
WILL THE STATE EXPERIENCE THESE CUTS IMMEDIATELY OR IS THERE A
PHASE-IN WHEN YOU DEAL WITH A BUDGET AND YOU SEE A LOT OF CUTS
COMING, MONEY RUNNING OUT HERE AND THERE.
>> WELL, IT TAKES EFFECT ON THE FIRST DAY.
AND REALLY, YOU DON'T HAVE THE BUDGET AUTHORITY TO SPEND THE
OTHER MONEY.
SO IT'S SOMETHING THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO LOOK AT, WHAT ARE WE
GONNA DO RIGHT AWAY, IF MONDAY, REALLY, THE SECOND IS GOING TO
BE THE FIRST DAY PRACTICALLY SPEAKING THAT MOST GOVERNMENT
EMPLOYEES ARE GOING TO BE BACK AT WORK.
>> HOW WELL DOES THIS PLAY POLITICALLY TO HAVE SPEAKER
TILLIS AND OTHERS CALLING A PRESS CONFERENCE TO SAY IF YOU
VETO THIS BILL, YOU'RE GOING TO GET THE SECOND YEAR OF OUR
BUDGET, AND NOBODY WANTS THAT.
WHY WOULD THEY PASS A BUDGET THAT THEY WOULDN'T WANT THE
SECOND YEAR IN EFFECT?
>> WELL, YOU DIDN'T KNOW A YEAR AGO WHAT THE ECONOMY WAS GOING
TO BE LIKE RIGHT NOW.
BUT YOU HAD TO GO AND MAKE DECISIONS BASED ON YOUR
PROJECTIONS AT THE TIME.
NOW, WE USED TO JUST HAVE TWO-YEAR BUDGETS, AND THEY
DIDN'T EVEN COME BACK.
OF COURSE, THAT WAS A LONG TIME BEFORE I CAME HERE.
THAT WAS BACK IN THE '60s AND VERY EARLY '70s.
IT WAS IN THE EARLY '70s, I THINK, I BELIEVE '74 MAY HAVE
BEEN THE FIRST YEAR WE ACTUALLY HAD A SHORT SESSION, TO COME IN
AND ADJUST THE BUDGET.
STATE'S GROWING, WE GOT ALMOST 10 MILLION IF NOT MORE THAN 10
MILLION PEOPLE NOW.
WE DIDN'T HAVE THAT MANY PEOPLE BACK THEN.
GOVERNMENT HAS GROWN.
THE BUDGETS ARE JUST SO MUCH LARGER TODAY THAN THEY WERE
THERE, AND THERE'S JUST SO MUCH MORE UNPREDICTABILITY ABOUT HOW
MUCH MORE MONEY IS GOING TO BE COMING IN.
WE HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE ECONOMY IS GOING TO LOOK LIKE IN SIX
MONTHS.
WE ALL HOPE FOR THE BETTER, BUT, YOU KNOW, WE SEE SIGNS THAT
MAYBE THAT'S NOT THE CASE.
>> HERE'S WHAT WE DO KNOW.
$200 OVER $200 MILLION IN FEDERAL STIMULUS MONEY THAT
HELPED PUBLIC EDUCATORS, THAT MONEY IS GONE.
>> RIGHT.
>> AND I HAVE NOT LOOKED AT THE 2011 BUDGET, I'LL ADMIT THAT.
YOU GLANCE AT IT ONCE IT BECOMES LAW.
BUT THAT'S A HOLE THAT IS NOT FILLED IN YEAR 2 OF THIS BUDGET
OF THE CURRENT BUDGET.
IT IS PARTIALLY FILLED IN THE BUDGET THAT WAS VETOED.
>> RIGHT.
>> WILL THE FOCUS POLITICALLY BE ON THE K-12 EDUCATION DOLLARS?
IS THERE SOMETHING ELSE IN THIS BUDGET THAT WILL GARNER THE
PUBLIC'S ATTENTION RATHER THAN JUST PUBLIC SCHOOLS?
>> I THINK THERE WILL BE SOME FOCUS ON THAT.
I THINK THERE WILL BE FOCUS ON SALARY INCREASES FOR TEACHERS
AND STATE EMPLOYEES THAT WON'T HAPPEN IF THEY DON'T COME TO
SOME SORT OF ACCORD, AGREEMENT.
I THINK SOMETHING ELSE THAT'S GOING TO BE BROUGHT OUT IS THERE
WAS ACTUALLY A CUT IN THE GASOLINE TAX.
AND PRICES ARE GOING DOWN A LITTLE BIT AT THE PUMP NOW, BUT
YOU KNOW, TWO OR THREE CENTS A GALLON ON GAS, YOU KNOW, THAT'S
JUST NOT GONNA HAPPEN.
>> I HEARD THAT RESET WAS COMING ANYWAY, IT IS GOING DOWN IN JULY
AND THEY WOULD JUST CAP IT AT THE NEW LOWER RATE BY THE WAY
THE FORMULA WORKS.
>> WELL, OKAY, THAT WOULD HAPPEN, BUT THERE WOULD BE NO
CAP IN THE FUTURE.
SO IF TOWARD THE END OF THE YEAR, OR A YEAR FROM NOW, IT
GOES UP AND DOWN.
THERE'S SUCH USE CYCLES.
IT COULD GO UP AGAIN, IT COULD GO UP AGAIN IN JANUARY.
>> LOOKING AT THE BUDGET IN 2011, IF EVERYTHING HOLDS, THE
SENATE LEAVES, DOESN'T WANT TO FIGHT THIS OUT PUBLICLY HEADING
INTO JULY 4th WEEK, POLITICALLY, WHO'S MORE AT RISK
OF SUFFERING SOME ILL EFFECTS OF THIS?
WOULD IT BE THE GOVERNOR AND THE DEMOCRATS, HENCE WALTER DALTON,
SENATE REPUBLICANS, OR HOUSE REPUBLICANS.
THOSE ARE ALL THREE VERY DISTINCT IN THIS CLIMATE.
>> RIGHT, THEY ARE.
I TEND TO THINK THAT THE LEGISLATURE IS GOING TO BE ABLE
TO SAY WE PASSED A BUDGET THAT ACTUALLY FILLED THIS IN, THAT
ACTUALLY HELPED OUT, THAT WAS ACTUALLY BETTER, AND THE
GOVERNOR VETOED IT.
I THINK THEY'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO MAKE THAT CASE.
ALTHOUGH I'M SURE THAT THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR DALTON AND
THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY IS GOING TO TRY TO FISH THE OTHER WAY.
THAT'S SOMETHING, AGAIN, THAT'S GOING TO PLAY OUT OVER THE NEXT
FEW MONTHS AS WE HEAD INTO THE ELECTION.
>> POLITICALLY AND LOGISTICALLY, BEHIND THE SCENES, DO YOU EXPECT
THE SENATE AND THE HOUSE TO WORK WITH THE GOVERNOR TO TRY TO
REACH AN AGREEMENT SO THAT WE GET A DIFFERENT KIND OF BUDGET?
OR WILL THIS THING DRAW A LINE IN THE SAND?
AND IT'S LOOKING LIKE YEAR 2 OF THIS BUDGET, NOBODY SEEMS TO
WANT, WILL TAKE EFFECT.
>> WELL, GOVERNOR PERDUE EXPRESSED OVER AND OVER AGAIN,
THERE'S STILL TIME, THERE'S STILL HOPE, THERE'S STILL TIME
FOR COMPROMISE.
THERE COULD PERHAPS BE SOME WORK GOING ON IN THE HOUSE TO GET
SOME DEMOCRATS TO HELP SUPPORT THE VETO OVERRIDE.
THERE COULD BE SOME WORK GOING ON THERE TO MAYBE HAVE A
SUPPLEMENTARY BUDGET THAT MIGHT HELP BRING THEM ALONG.
THAT COULD BE SOME MORE MONEY FOR EDUCATION OR FOR THIS
PROCESS OR THAT PROJECT.
NOW, THAT'S A LOT OF STUFF THAT GOES ON.
THAT INCLUDES THE WORST AND YOU NEVER REALLY KNOW, AND YOU CAN
KIND OF FIGURE IT OUT WHEN YOU SEE THE THINGS COME OUT IN THE
BILLS.
BUT YOU WON'T KNOW UNTIL THAT HAPPENS.
>> THAT'S WHY YOU HAVE TO JUST BE DOWN HERE HANGING AROUND
LISTENING.
>> YOU HAVE TO.
>> BARRY, I APPRECIATE YOU BEING ON THE SHOW.
YOUR EXPERTISE IS ALWAYS WELCOME, PARTICULARLY IN A LATE
BREAKING WEEKEND STORY LIKE THIS.
CATCH THE SHOW, ONLINE, AT FACEBOOK.COM/LEGWEEK OR
UNCTV.ORG/LEGWEEK.
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