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♪ [Theme Music] ♪
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Hello, I'm Ronnie Eldridge.
Welcome to Eldridge & Company. It isn't very often that an
expected winner declines to run for election, especially in this
city and for the City Council where last year there were
202 candidates running for the 51 seats, but that's what
Mark Winston Griffith did last year. Instead, this long-
time champion of community empowerment is the Executive
Director of the Brooklyn Movement Center, and he's
my guest today and I'm delighted to have you.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Great to be here.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Thank you. So the Brooklyn Community,
Development , whatever.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Brooklyn Movement Center.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Movement Center is something you created.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Yes. I cofounded it with a group of
other activists and organizers in Bed-Stuy, in Crown Heights,
about three years ago, about three-and-a-half years ago.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: That's nothing new to you,
to start an organization?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: No, I'm a serial social
entrepreneur so I've been on the starting end of quite
a few different institutions and organizations.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: How did you come to do this?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: The Brooklyn Movement Center?
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: No, the whole thing, where did you start?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: I don't, you know, I can't,
I'm not sure if I can identify exactly where the impulse to
be an organizer and activist and be in social change came
from. My parents were civil servants. My father was a
truant officer and my mother was a secretary for the
Fire Department but there was always sort of underground,
a social consciousness that I grew up with,
and I went to public school and then went away to
high school for boarding school, and I was one of a few black
students there, and ended up becoming the first black
president in the school's history, and then went to
Brown University and ended up becoming an activist there,
and then in my senior year I was part of a group of students
who had a series of protests that really transformed the
university. So I think that that, it gave me a sense of
my own power and gave me a sense of social right and
wrong, and the need to be in the mix, and so when I
graduated, that's what I wanted to do.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: And the need that you also could succeed
because you really had some great successes then.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Yeah, exactly. I mean, when I --
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: And you could really see a difference.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: When I was at Brown in my
senior year, I have never worked with a more talented group
of people, and they were all black students my age but they
were just -- and they have all gone to different things,
not necessarily in social change work, but they were just really
smart and very great strategists, and so I had
an appreciation for that.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: And where did you come up with,
I mean, you then were a cofounder of a credit union.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Right.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Where did you decide to get into the money
part of it, the financial part of it? What did somebody
call you, something --?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: We were dubbed the world's first
hip-hop credit union.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Right. That's right.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: And that's because of a speech I
gave when we started where I likened the starting of this
credit union to what happens in hip-hop where you take
an old song and you put a new spin over it,
and so were trying to put a new spin on the world of banking.
I sort of backed into it because I worked for an elected
official and I worked for a community development
organization, and I eventually saw sort of what we now
think of as economic justice as a very big missing part
in Bedford-Stuyvesant in Crown Heights, that is we
saw that we were able to elect elected officials at
will, we were able to have social and cultural
institutions, but there weren't a lot of economic institutions
that not just served us but actually were owned and
operate by us as well, and that's what distinguishes
a credit union from a bank is that it's actually owned
and operated by the people who are members of it.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: I was in high school many, many years
ago and we had a student coop, and so we started with
a coop movement and the whole thing, and we all owned
shares in this place, and it sold art and music supplies,
and it was great, and it gives you then a sense of what you
can go on and do. Later on it got involved in housing,
not for the public but-- well, it was in a way--
but it was always sharing and that whole concept.
Do you think that's a natural step, then, to- I guess it is-
to change and community empowerment?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: I think so because if you're
part of a coop, you have to believe in democracy,
you have to believe in shared work and responsibility,
you have to believe in community building, and so that is
what I think has given me a grounding or has been at
least an integral part of everything else I've done since
then. It really gave me a sense of, you know, we don't sort
of have to step outside of the neighborhood to build
institutions and to recreate our environment.
We can do it from within.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: So you live in a very
changing neighborhood now.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Yes.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Bed-Stuy Crown Heights?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Technically I live in
Crown Heights, what's called North Crown Heights,
which is two blocks away from the borderline of
Bedford-Stuyvesant and Crown Heights.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: So you're seeing a lot of change?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: A lot of change, I mean just as an
example, there's a Connecticut Muffin two blocks away from
me. You know, I've been in some form on that block--
my grandmother moved there in 1952, her sister
moved next door in 1948, and her brother lived on the other
side, so my family has been there for a long time.
My wife and I bought the house some years ago but I've
been living in that house now since 1985, and when I lived
there as an adult, there was literally not one white person
on the block, and now I would say, you know, 90% of the
people who are buying into the block are white, and I
would say about 30% of the block right now is white,
and it's just -- but people have been clamoring for
change for a long time. I mean, working class and middle
class black folks have been looking for a change on the
commercial strips and the quality of housing and so in
many ways, gentrification becomes exactly
what you've asked for.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: I first, I guess, visited Bed-Stuy with
Robert Kennedy when he started his Bed-Stuy Restoration
and all that project.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Right. I'm two blocks away from there.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Oh, really?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Yeah.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Has that impact lasted? What affect did
that have on that community?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Well, Bedford-Stuyvesant
Restoration Corporation is an anchorage. It's the largest
and oldest community development corporation in the country,
and so it has fueled what I and other people have come
to see as a sense of possibility in the district, in community
development. It really embodies it in that way. But I think that
many of us, people who are children of the civil rights
movement see that's an important model but that --
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: It's got to change.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Yeah, it's got to evolve, and there's
some variations of it, and it's still there, and I think it's
still doing good work, but I think what the Brooklyn
Movement Center and other organizations represent is
sort of the next generation iteration of it.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: So tell me what the Brooklyn,
what you're doing.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: The Brooklyn Movement Center
is a community organizing group, and getting back to
the sense of coopervism, we are member-owned and operated,
so we have a membership made up of people who live
and work in the neighborhood, and we are committed to
what's called direct action community organizing which
means that we use different techniques and methods to
great social change but one of them includes direct
confrontation and pressing for change with elected officials
and policy-makers. So we are the "rabble rousers" but we
try to do it in a very sophisticated way.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: What are the issues?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Well, we are a multi-issue group but
right now we're focusing on things that have kind of just
bubbled up to the top, so right now we're focusing on
education, public education in community school district
16, which is in Bedford- Stuyvesant and
Crown Heights. We focus on what's called food justice and
the need to address the poor quality of food and
unaffordability of food in the neighborhood, and that's led to
the organizing of a food coop. We do some work around civic
engagement where we try to get people more involved
in understanding what policies are affecting them,
where elected officials stand on the issues, and getting
them to step up and hold elected officials more accountable.
We have a group of women who have started an anti-street
harassment project where they're doing public education.
It's sort of like a community health model where we're trying
to build better relationships particularly between men and
women of color in public venues. And then we have a very strong
communications component. As you know, I have some
grounding in journalism and so we're trying to build out a
citizens journalism arm of our organization where local people
are telling their story or reporting on what's going on,
really to kind of address the fact that there are very few
metro sections left, there are very few publications that are
reporting on what's going on in neighborhoods like that, and we
feel that that could actually have a very big impact on --
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Well, that's a very sensible kind
of thing. I mean, that's what some people have tried to do
and not too successfully.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Right. I mean, there is The Patch.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Do you do this on the internet?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Yes. There was The Patch,
just The Bed-Stuy Patch just left, in fact.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Yeah, yeah, and then DNAinfo?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: DNAinfo is actually probably one of
the ones that does the most reporting right now.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: But it doesn't do that much?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Um, no, because they're covering the
whole city. They have a couple of reporters that are based,
you know, that cover that beat, and I think they do a good
job, it's just I think we want to cover it deeper and wider.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Is it all on the internet or do
you have a sheet?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: It's going to be internet-based.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: And no paper to give anybody?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: No. No.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Do you think everybody is on the internet?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: I don't think everyone is on it but
right now it's the only way we can afford to do it. You know,
I went through a course at the CUNY-J School in
Entrepreneurial Journalism, and there is this big sort of
tug-of-war about legacy publications and about how
long print will survive, and I think we just-- I don't think
we can afford it. There are other print publications there,
and I think committing yourself to print sort of holds you
back in some ways.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Or both. I mean, if I were thinking about
it, I would say, "Well, the people who have lived there the
longest, and who are still black or of color, may be the
people who need more help, right?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Absolutely.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: And they may be the people who
don't have the computers.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Absolutely. Absolutely.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: So I always had a dream, years ago even,
of like a teletype machine or I guess it's a printer on the
corner, and when you go, you could just print out what's
on there, so what you really need are some printers that are
available and some paper, and you can just print it out.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: You're right, right.
You're absolutely right.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: There's nothing like seeing
something either, you know.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: And it's funny because I think in the
black community in particular, you go into some of the
bodegas and you will still see several different print
publications, not just the Daily News or The Post or
something like that but something like The Daily
Challenge and in Central Brooklyn there's something
called Our Time Press, all these different -- there's recognition
that there is still a market for that, and there are people
who don't consume their news on the internet.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Yeah, it's interesting. So do you find--
do you have really poor people living in your district?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Of course, it's a big mixture.
I mean, Central Brooklyn, Bed-Stuyvesant, Crown Heights
has long been known as a poor neighborhood,
economically-speaking at least. It has been seen sort of as
a parallel to Harlem. Like Harlem, it has always had
working and middle-class black folks, and like Harlem,
it has undergone a significant shift. I mean, there was
an article in the Times some years ago that said that
Harlem is no longer predominantly black, and so
that is true actually of a section of Bedford-Stuyvesant
is no longer predominantly black, so things are changing.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: But not all, but not all. Do you have
homeless people, a homeless population?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Um, yeah, I mean, I think that--
well, by definition of homeless, you know, don't have homes,
so I don't know how you want to define it but there are
actually two homeless shelters in the area, and many of those
populations are coming from the surrounding areas.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: The big shelter that recently had all
the publicity in the Times, that's not in Bed-Stuy, is it?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Which one do you mean?
There was one --
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: The one where the young girl, what was her
name, the homeless families shelter.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Oh, okay, I'm remembering the article.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: That was a big one.
I think that's Leticia's district.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Right, we cover Bedford-Stuyvesant
and Crown Heights, so right, it may have not been,
it may have been outside of that area.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Yeah. So are you taking up that cause also?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Not yet. I mean, I think eventually
we will. At the very least, we're going to I think address
housing and affordable housing, and getting tenants to
demand better quality housing.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: But you're not just going to lobby.
Are you going to think of actually finding a way to
develop housing, affordable housing?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: I don't know if we will ever get into
development. I mean, what happens often times with
community organizing groups is they start with lobbying
and agitating and organizing, and it often times leads to
some kind of service delivery or, you know, running housing
or something like that, so that could be in our future.
Right now we're focusing on organizing but even in the work
that we do now, it goes a little bit beyond organizing.
There's always some form of service delivery at the end
of it because once you expose what's needed and once you
start calling for what's needed, you inevitably get involved
in the process of helping to create what's needed.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: But the object is to move the person in
elective office, right?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Among other things,
I mean that's not the only reason we're there, but yes.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: No, and you're also pressuring businesses
and everything, all around.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Right. All the institutions and people
who have the levers of power at their disposal, that's who
we're creating relationships with, alliances with. For some
it will be confrontational, with others it will be nothing
but collaboration and working very closely together.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: I laugh because I worked at the
Port Authority many years ago, doing their community and
government relations, and we had the religious group,
what was it, the Brooklyn Ministers --
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Let's Work on Churches, or?
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Well, it was- kind of stuff, and that
confrontation, it just drives people crazy, and I always
loved it because you need that when you're inside
something to move it.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Right, exactly.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: You build the pressure and then--
I mean, you even go out and organize it, so then
you can move. So some day, you're going to be in
public office, right?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: I really don't know that. I mean, I,
again, decided not to run in 2013. My children are still very
young, my organization is still very young, so I don't know
what's going to happen in the future, and I'm not trying to
be coy. I just, I literally don't know.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: No, I get it. What I talked about before
and what I felt when I read your announcement was
this was my situation. I mean, I was always so stressed,
and at that point I was just a district leader, but to go
out at night or to go out to a meeting during the day, what
are you going to do with your kids, what is my husband doing,
did he mind, blah, blah, blah, and that all went on, the guilt
and the feelings that you're always torn is very great.
We don't find that many people saying that publicly and
so it makes it hard.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: I know. I know, and that's what drove
me to write the article in the first place because I just felt
like it's something that just kind of needed to be brought
to the surface.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: But you loved running, if you didn't
have the pressure.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Yeah. What I loved was feeling
like I was part of something that was more than just me.
I mean, I was the person on the poster, it was my name.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: You have to feel that or else it's just a
plain ego trip, isn't it?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Exactly, exactly, but I really felt like
it was something more, and I felt like more than most
local races, we focused on policy and specific issues,
and that really turned me on, and it's actually what
ultimately led me to join with other people to start the
Brooklyn Movement Center because I got reinspired,
because you know in some ways I had stepped away from that
life. I was working for citywide organizations where I wasn't
working on a grassroots frontline level.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: What were you working on before then?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Well, before then I was with a
Sustainable Transportation Campaign. I was with the
Drum Major Institute for Public Policy, which is a
public policy think-tank. I was with an organization called the
New Economy Project or a neighborhood economic
development advocacy project which did economic justice
work. I was writing, I was doing policy stuff, I was working
on economic justice work, and I needed a breather from
working all those years on the frontline, having to worry
about meeting payroll, and I swore I would never go
back to it, and look at --
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: And here you are.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: And here I am.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: I used to dream of becoming mute because
all I was doing was talking, and I really wanted to do
something, you know, but how can you stop talking. So the major
issues you're talking about now are education. Are you part
of the Mayor's campaign for pre-K?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Yes, we are, and I think we're
taking a particular slice of it because what is sort of a
footnote to it is that he's not only advocating for universal
pre-K but he's also looking to raise money for expanded
after-school, particularly in middle schools, and so that's
something, that's a drum beat that we've been on for for
the last two years. We issued a report on community school
district 16 which essentially unearthed the death of
after-school programming in the district, and really talked
about the lack of coordination among schools and other
stakeholders, and so we want to not only work with him
in focusing on after-school and universal pre-K but also
going back to a neighborhood- centric form of not only
parent engagement but just talking about schools,
that is understanding we'll still be dealing with
Mayoral control but we don't abandon the district system
that was created, and really look to parents and other local
stakeholders to be a part of that conversation.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Are parents involved in the parents'
associations there?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Not to the extent that we feel
is important, and that came out in our report too.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: And the graduation from
high school rate?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: It's low. The college readiness
rates are very low.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Unemployment?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Unemployment is low,
and what's interesting about our district is, like you said,
it's a changing demographic but the student population
is still very black, very low income. The middle class has
fled and is not really investing in the district, and so we need
kind of all hands on deck, and we need this district to be the
district like you see in other neighborhoods where the middle
class see it as a viable option. That's not the case in
community school district 16.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Some of the younger people coming in
have young families?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Exactly, and they're choosing charter
schools, they're choosing private schools, they're
choosing schools outside of the district.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: And the arrest records?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: We're not the highest in the city
but we're up there, we're up there.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Yeah, so you have a high rate
of incarceration?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: We do, and that's another issue
that we work with that I didn't discuss is we also involved
in juvenile justice issues, trying to lower the rates, as
well as we work very much on the Stop-and-Frisk campaign
and on the legislation that was recently enacted, and there are
two other pieces of legislation that are coming up.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: The juvenile justice and the need of a
community, I mean, is the end goal the sustainable
community that you have everything within that community
you need to lead a decent life?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Um, look--
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: You don't want it to be that simple.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Exactly. I don't think we're looking for
it to be that closed of a community but certainly you
want what you find in other healthy neighborhoods where
there are places for families to thrive, there are places
to eat, small businesses can do well.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Get the decent foods, and affordable, yeah.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Yeah, so we're looking at what I think
is what others in healthy neighborhoods see as a
baseline of service and function.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: One of the things that's an issue that
I've always been interested in is what happens on release from
prison or jail, the need for community support, and then to
stop so you don't have the recidivism rate that we have.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Exactly, exactly.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Because there are people spending their
lives going in and out of the system.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Right. Right. Yeah, we work very
closely with an organization called Center for New
Leadership, which is focusing just on that, that young people
are being re-released into the neighborhood and there are
so few support systems. Not only is there very few jobs but
just in every part of their lives, there are very few
things that keep them from going back into their life.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: So are you working with other similar
groups around the city?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Very much so.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Is there an umbrella group?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Well, there are umbrella groups in
different pieces of work that we do, so for instance some
of the education work, we work with an organization called
CEJ, Coalition for Educational Justice. We work on the
Stop-and-Frisk work with a citywide organization that
is doing that. So in all the different pieces of work,
in order to have- because we're trying to have a local impact
but ultimately we're trying to have a citywide and statewide
impact too, and so you can't do that unless you are not
just in a coalition but you are a functioning and active member
of that coalition, and are bringing the perspective of your
neighborhood into that coalition.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: What would the city say if you somehow
were able to find a way to make your group a bid?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: A bid as in the Business
Improvement Industry?
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Yes, but it's not a business, it's a
community support group, to get some of the advantages.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: I hear you. I would love that. I mean,
I would love what we do to be modeled. I would love templates
to be -- and I have to say, if there's any administration who
would be up to it --
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: This is it.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: I think this it. I think this is
our opportunity here.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: You have to really work because we want
to be sure that it stays for a while.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Exactly. Exactly.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: And then you have the national --
I mean, we've talked before about Andrew Friedman who
was one of the founders of Make the Road, and then he has this
national organization now where he comes in and they
come, this organization comes in to help with
forming other groups.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Exactly
Exactly. RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Do they have national meetings?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: They do have national meetings,
and they're part of a national network and they do national
work, and what you're speaking of is Make the Road by Walking
and then it became Make the Road New York, and then he
went and started Center for Popular Democracy, which in
many ways was trying to replicate that work locally
across the country, but even Make the Road is not even
a local organization any more. I mean, it's doing work I think
in three different boroughs right now, and it's focused
mostly on immigration issues but Center for Popular
Democracy has gone beyond that.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: What's interesting with De Blasio is
not only what it promised for people who want change within
the city but it sent ripples nationally about the whole
different emphasis so you're back to your own economic
justice stuff, in a way, when you started the credit union.
I mean, this is an opportunity nationally, and so when you
pick up the paper and they say it looks like the Congress,
maybe Republican and the Senate and the House,
so what's discouraging?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Well, New York is always seen as an
outlier on some level so I don't know how much this breeze will
go across the rest of the land but I think that if the
DeBlasio administration and us progressives do a
***-up job, then that will demonstrate that progressive
administrations and progressive infrastructure is a
credible alternative in our cities.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: I don't want to put a damper but
because of my age, I guess, I don't like the word
progressive, and somebody the other day said,
"Progressive shows the fare of us with Newt Gingrich
because he gave liberal such a bad name," and then when you
think back in history, I mean, Roosevelt, Social Security,
all the labors laws and everything else, they were
progressive, so why are we always afraid -- you know this
progressive business, it still has a generational
difference to it.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: I think so, and I'm not scared of the
word liberal but I do think that liberal has certain
connotations that progressive doesn't,
and I think progressive --
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: What are they?
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Well, I think progressive is a more
self-conscious and more realistic on some level, and
I can already see you body language -- I think it's a more
conscientious sort of grappling with privilege that we enjoy,
and going from less of a place of guilt to
more a of a place of --
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: We have to have this discussion because
we've come to the end but when you said guilt and all that,
it brought me to the white involvement in the Civil Rights
Movement, but I'm before that.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Gotcha. Gotcha.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Anyway, it's lovely to talk to you,
and I certainly wish you lots of luck.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Thank you.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: And I do hope you run for public office.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Well, thank you very much.
I appreciate that.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Okay. Thank you.
MARK WINSTON GRIFFITH: Okay.
RONNIE ELDRIDGE: Bye.
♪ [Theme Music] ♪
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