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>> WOMEN AND DOCUMENTARY FILMS ARE INCREASING.
>> YES.
>> AND PROPORTIONATELY TO SAY NARRATIVE FILM, MORE SO, THE
DIRECTORS OF NARRATIVE FILMS IS ABOUT 17%.
>> YES.
>> AND 34.5% OF DOCUMENTARIES ARE DIRECTED BY WOMEN.
WHY DO YOU THINK THAT THAT IS?
>> I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE WOMEN ARE GREAT STORYTELLERS.
LONG TRADITION OF WRITING AND EXPRESSIVE COMMUNICATION.
AND BUT, THERE IS, THERE IS -- YOU KNOW, MAKING FILM IS AN
EXPENSIVE ENDEAVOR.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, THE BIGGEST BARRIER TO ENTRY IN NARRATIVE
FILM-MAKING IS FUNDING.
YOU HAVE TO CONVINCE, IF NOT A STUDIO, IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT,
IN THE INDEPENDENT WORLD YOU ARE ASKING PEOPLE TO GIVE YOU A LOT
OF MONEY ON VERY SPECULATIVE VENTURE, SO WOMEN HAVE HAD
DIFFICULTIES, YOU KNOW, GETTING THAT, THAT FUNDING.
IN DOCUMENTARIES, I DON'T THINK THAT WE'RE ASKING ANYBODY.
I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE'RE DOING WHAT I DID, WHICH IS USE OUR OWN
NETWORKS THAT WE HAVE ESTABLISHED OVER THE YEARS TO GO
TO PEOPLE WHO ARE IN POWER, A LOT OF FOUNDATION EXECUTIVES ARE
WOMEN, AND WHO ARE NOT PUT OFF BY THE IDEA OF A WOMAN PRODUCING
AND DIRECTING THE DOCUMENTARY.
AND SO, I THINK THAT, ACTUALLY, PROBABLY THE NUMBER, WELL, IN
DOCUMENTARIES, IF YOU LOOKED AT THE NUMBER OF WOMEN PRODUCERS,
YOU PROBABLY HAVE A HIGHER -- >> IT'S HIGHER.
>> IT IS HIGHER.
>> RIGHT.
>> AND I WAS SAYING, DIRECTING BUT IT IS HIGHER.
>> RIGHT.
>> SO, YOU KNOW, WE WERE KIND OF NOT TAKING NO FOR AN ANSWER IN
DOCUMENTARIES AND, AND, YOU KNOW, THE OTHER THING, IN THE
DOCUMENTARY, IS, IS THE COST GETTING STARTED, ARE A LOT
LOWER, SO, I DON'T HAVE TO, I CAN SHOW SOMEBODY WHAT I'M
THINKING ABOUT DOING AND, AND EASILY WITH A LOW, A LOW COST.
>> RIGHT.
>> IT'S FUNNY TO ME BECAUSE SOME NARRATIVE FILMS, THEY ARE
FILMING THEM LIKE DOCUMENTARIES.
>> RIGHT.
>> THEY GET JUMPY OR WHATEVER, AND LOW TECH AND, AND --
>> RIGHT, COPYCATS.
>> RIGHT.
DID YOUR BACKGROUND, YOU THINK, AT A&E AND ABC HELP YOU?
>> YEAH, IT DID.
YOU KNOW, I WAS LAUGHING, I LAUGH IN MY BIOBECAUSE IF YOU
DON'T THINK OF YOURSELF, AN ABC EXECUTIVE OR AN A&E EXECUTIVE.
WHAT THOSE JOBS DID WAS I HAD A, A CLEAR UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT
THE MARKET FOR THE FILM COULD BE.
I KNEW HOW TO WRITE BUDGET, AND I KNEW HOW TO WRITE A GRANT
PROPOSAL, AND I ALSO KNEW HOW TO ORGANIZE AND TAKE CONTROL OF THE
SITUATION.
WHICH DOES NOT MEAN THAT I KNEW WHAT I WAS DOING, JUST THAT I
HAD THOSE OTHER SKILLS.
SO, YOU KNOW, SO, A LOT OF DOCUMENTARIES, AND OF ANY FILM
IS JUST BEING A LEADER.
JUST SAYING, ALL RIGHT, I WANT TO TELL THIS STORY, AND HOW DO I
GET FROM A TO D.
AND YOU KNOW, IF YOU DON'T THINK ABOUT THE END PRODUCT, AS MUCH
AS OH, I CAN DO, DO THIS, AND I CAN DO THIS, AND I CAN ORGANIZE
A SHOOT, AND I CAN TELL PEOPLE WHAT I WANT IT TO LOOK LIKE, AND
I CAN INTERVIEW SOMEONE, AND BEING A LAWYER, I WAS A VERY
GOOD LISTENER.
AND I THINK WHEN YOU ARE, WHEN YOU ARE, YOU KNOW, WE WERE
TALKING EARLIER ABOUT, ABOUT, OR WE WERE ALSO TALKING ABOUT,
ABOUT, ABOUT WHETHER IT'S A LIKE TO INTERVIEW PEOPLE ABOUT THE
VERY INTIMATE PERSONAL TOPICS AND, AND, AND YOU HAVE TO HAVE A
LEVEL OF TRUST, AND PEOPLE CAN TELL WHEN YOU ARE INTERESTED IN,
IN WHAT THEY ARE SAYING.
AND SO I, YOU KNOW, WAS ABLE TO ESTABLISH A RAPPORT WITH THE
SUBJECT, AND I THINK THAT THAT'S WHAT COMES THROUGH, THAT THEY
ARE BEING HONEST, AND THEY ARE NOT ALWAYS ON MESSAGE.
>> BRANDY LET YOU FILM HER INNER BATHROOM.
>> RIGHT.
SHE WAS ALWAYS IN HER BATHROOM.
>> PUTTING ON HER MAKEUP.
>> AND YOU WENT THROUGH THINGS THAT I THINK THAT ARE HELPFUL
FOR FILMMAKERS TO KNOW ABOUT LIKE GOOD PITCH.
>> RIGHT.
>> AND THERE ARE A NUMBER OF -- I THINK THAT THE FOUNDATION
WORLD, IN PARTICULAR, HAS REALIZED THAT, THAT THE FUNDING
FOR DOCUMENTARY HAS DECREASED IN TRADITIONAL BROADCAST AVENUES
HAS DECREASED SO SUBSTANTIALLY, THAT THE FOUNDATIONS HAVE REALLY
BEEN STEPPING UP AND GIVING FILMMAKERS SUPPORT, SO, GOOD
PITCH.
IS RUN BY AN ORGANIZATION CALLED [INAUDIBLE], WHICH IS
LONDON-BASED.
AND THEY DO SOCIAL ISSUE GATHERINGS, SO FILMMAKERS
PRESENT THEIR PROJECTS TO, TO, TO NOT NECESSARILY FILM PEOPLE,
BUT TO, TO, TO PHILANTHROPY GROUPS, AND ACTIVIST GROUPS.
SO, WHAT I DO, THERE WAS THE ACLU, THE DEFENSE LAWYERS'
ASSOCIATION, AND MENTAL HEALTH INSTITUTIONS, SO, ALL THESE
PEOPLE WHO ARE THINKING, HOW COULD WE USE A FILM LIKE THERE
IN OUR WORK, AND GOOD PITCH BRINGS THEM TOGETHER.
WHAT THAT DOES IS IT SHOWS YOUR FUNDERS SUPPORTING THIS FILM, IS
GOING TO HELP ALL THOSE OTHER ISSUES THAT I SUPPORT.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, WE'RE REALLY TRYING TO BE STRATEGIC ABOUT
HELPING EACH OTHER SO I HAVE THIS GREAT NETWORK NOW IN MY
OUTREACH CAMPAIGN THAT INCLUDES MENTAL HEALTH ADVOCATES.
AND, AND THERE IS, YOU KNOW, GAY AND LESBIAN ADVOCATES BECAUSE,
BECAUSE I HAPPEN TO HAVE, YOU KNOW, THAT WAS JUST LUCK.
>> RIGHT.
>> BUT, YOU KNOW, BUT -- >> ONE OF THE DEFENDANTS HAD TWO
GAY FOSTER PARENTS.
>> SO, A GOOD PITCH ALLOWS YOU TO BRING TOGETHER THE SOCIAL
ACTIVIST GROUPS, AND MARRY IT WITH A FILM THAT CAN HELP THEM.
>> THERE IS A HUGE TREND, ISN'T IT?
>> DOCUMENTARIES THAT ARE VERY ENTERED ON SPECIFIC SOCIAL ILL
OR PROBLEM, THAT SOMEBODY SEES, THERE IS ANOTHER ONE OUT THERE
ABOUT INTERNATIONAL ADOPTIONS, ONE OUT ON, ON FRACKING.
AND THERE ARE POV, POINT OF VIEW FILMS, AND SOMETIMES THEY ARE
GETTING SLICK, SOMETIMES BEING COMMISSIONED BY, BY, BY ENTITIES
THAT HAVE SOME OTHER MOTIVES AT HAND, AS WELL.
>> WELL, THAT IS SOMETHING THAT, I THINK, IS DOCUMENTARY,
FILMMAKERS, I MEAN, I COME FROM A NEWS BACKGROUND, SO, IT WAS
VERY, VERY -- IT'S NOT A NEWS PIECE.
WHEN YOU MAKE FILM, IT IS YOUR, YOUR OPINION.
AND, AND WE EDIT IN A WAY THAT, THAT YOU DON'T, YOU WOULD NEVER
EDIT A NEWS PIECE.
WE CAN MOVE THINGS AROUND AND, AND TO CONDENSE THE STORY, AND I
HAVE, YOU KNOW, A THREE-DAY TRIAL, AND IT'S SHOWN IN LIKE
SEVEN MINUTES, AND THAT'S A LONG THING.
BUT, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE REASONS WHY, WHY YOU HAVE TO BE
REALLY CAREFUL WITH YOUR FUNDING SOURCES IS, IS YOU CANNOT GIVE
OVER THAT EDITORIAL CONTROL.
AND SO, I AM VERY GRATEFUL TO THE FORD FOUNDATION.
THEY SAW CUTS, THAT IT WAS A FILM GROUP THAT SAW CUTS,
PRIMARILY.
AND THE JUSTICE GROUPS SAW CUTS THAT, THAT, THAT THE NOTES WERE,
WE DON'T UNDERSTAND THIS STORY.
NOT COULD ADD IN X, Y OR Z BECAUSE I THINK AN AUDIENCE IS
SOPHISTICATED THESE DAYS, AND THEY KNOW IN A MINUTE WHEN
SOMETHING IS, YOU KNOW, MEANT TO OVERTAKE, YOU KNOW, PRESSURE
AND, AND LEAD THEM INTO A CERTAIN CONCLUSION.
SO, I THINK IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO WATCH.
>> WITH THE KICK STARTER AND THE CROWD SOURCING THINGS, I'M
NOTICING, IF YOU GIVE THIS MUCH YOU GET CREDIT.
>> RIGHT.
>> AS A PRODUCER OR THE EXECUTIVE PRODUCER.
>> RIGHT.
>> WHICH THE BROADCAST NETWORK DOESN'T LIKE.
>> RIGHT.
>> AND WELL, IT WOULD VIOLATE THE PBS FUNDING.
>> THAT'S RIGHT.
>> SO, YOU KNOW, MORE AND MORE AS PEOPLE GO OUT THERE FOR
MONEY, THEY ARE OFFERING THINGS THAT ARE IN THE REALM OF
EDITORIAL.
>> THAT'S RIGHT, AND I THINK FILMMAKERS REALLY NEED TO BE
THINKING ABOUT THAT.
SOMETIMES, YOU KNOW, YOU LOVE YOUR STORY SO MUCH, AND YOU ARE
SO DESPERATE FOR FUNDING, IN THAT YOU CAN IGNORE YOUR GUT.
AND I THINK MOST PEOPLE KNOW WHO IS GOING TO BE A GOOD PARTNER
AND WHO IS NOT GOING TO BE A GOOD PARTNER.
BUT THERE ARE SEVERAL ORGANIZATIONS THAT, LIKE I WAS
SUPPORTED, THE END CREDITS TO MY FILM SHOW THAT IT TAKES A
VILLAGE, EVEN WITH A SHOW ON HBO, SUPPORTED BY THE FORD
FOUNDATION, I HAD CHICKEN AND EGG, WHICH SUPPORTS WOMEN
FILMMAKERS.
AND, AND THEY DO -- THEY SUPPORT THE DEVELOPMENT, WHICH IS VERY,
VERY RARE THAT YOU CAN GET SOMEBODY TO GIVE YOU THAT FIRST
10,000 SO YOU CAN GO AND FILM FOR A WHILE AND EDIT SOMETHING
AND REALLY THINK ABOUT YOUR STORY.
AND IFP LABS, AND THEY SUPPORT YOU BY BRINGING TO MEET WITH
BROADCASTERS, SUNDANCE INSTITUTE, AND THEY GAVE ME A
GRANT, AND THEY INVITED ME FOR THEIR DOCUMENTARY LAB, WHICH IS
LIKE DOCUMENTARY HEAVEN.
AND YOU SPEND TWO WEEKS THERE WITH SPECTACULAR EDITOR AND IS
THEY HOPE, THEY HELP TO CRAFT THE FILM, TRIBECA FILM
INSTITUTE.
SO ALL THESE GROUPS PUT IN A RELATIVELY SMALL AMOUNT OF
MONEY, BUT THEY, THEY MAKE YOU PART OF THE COMMUNITY AND GIVE
YOU EXPOSURE TO PEOPLE WHO HAVE, HAVE, WHO CAN HELP YOUR FILM AND
ALSO HELP YOUR CAREER.
AND THEY MAKE THAT POINT VERY CLEARLY WHEN -- WE ARE FUNDING
YOUR CAREER, AS WELL AS THIS PROJECT.
SO, YOU KNOW, SO, I JUST -- I LOVE THAT PEOPLE KNOW ABOUT
THOSE GROUPS BECAUSE I THINK THAT, THAT THEY ARE VERY POPULAR
IN NEW YORK CITY, AND LOS ANGELES, AND CHICAGO, AND SOME
OF THE, THE BIGGER CITIES.
BUT, THEY ARE REALLY LOOKING FOR A FRESH VOICE, AND I THINK THERE
IS A LOT OF TALENT ALL ACROSS THE COUNTRY AND ACROSS THE
WORLD, AND SO PEOPLE SHOULD REALLY LOOK INTO THOSE, AND I
THINK THAT THEY WILL BE RECEPTIVE TO THE VOICES FROM
OTHER PLACES.
>> SPEAKING OF CAREERS, THIS IS YOUR CAREER NOW, ISN'T IT?
>> YES.
>> YES.
>> THIS IS YOUR PASSION, AND YOU KEEP DOING IT.
YOU HAVE COMPANY CALLED TRILOGY --
>> YES.
>> DOES THAT MEAN YOU ARE ONLY GOING TO MAKE THREE?
THREE OF EACH.
>> OK.
>> A SEQUEL TO -- >> YEAH.
>> GIDEON'S ARMY?
>> A NUMBER OF BROADCASTERS HAVE CONTACTED ME ABOUT MAKING IT A
SERIAL SHOW LIKE SHOWING SOME OTHER PUBLIC -- I WOULD LOVE TO
DO THAT.
KIND FOLLOW OTHER PEOPLE, OTHER PEOPLE AND SHOW WHAT'S HAPPENING
THERE BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, THERE IS GREAT STORIES, I MEAN,
PEOPLE, AMERICANS ARE INTERESTED IN THE CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM.
AND THIS IS, THIS IS, AS YOU SAID EARLIER, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN
NOT MAKE THAT STUFF UP.
>> WELL, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
WE'LL LOOK FORWARD TO THE TRILOGIES TIMES THREE.
>> HOPEFULLY.
>> YES.
>> THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU.
I'VE BEEN LISTENING TO DAWN PORTER, FILMMAKER, AND THANKS
FOR TUNING INTO THIS "DIALOGUE" WEB EXTRA.