Tip:
Highlight text to annotate it
X
Dr. Reagan: More and more churches are offering course in what they call Christian yoga. Is
there really such a thing as Christian yoga? Or have some sincere Christians been sincerely
deceived? And how did a feature of a pagan Eastern Religion get mixed in with Christianity
in the first place? For some insights into these questions stay tuned for an interview
with a world-class expert on yoga.
Announcer: Lamb and Lion Ministries presents: "Christ in Prophecy". A program that focuses
on the fundamentals of Bible Prophecy. Showing how current events in the news relate to Biblical
predictions of End-time events and the soon return of Jesus. Now here is your host,
Dr. David Reagan.
Dr. Reagan: Greetings in the name of Jesus our blessed hope and welcome to "Christ in Prophecy"
Once again this week my colleague Nathan Jones and I are delighted to have as
our special guest one of Christendom's foremost experts on Eastern Religions like Hinduism
and Buddhism. Our guest is Caryl Matrisciana a writer and video producer from California.
Caryl welcome back to Christ in Prophecy. Caryl Matrisciana: Thank you very much for
having me. Dr. Reagan: We are delighted to have you and
I tell you Caryl that program we did last week was a real blockbuster I still feel tingling
all over from your testimony about how you went to place looking for drugs and found
Jesus Christ. Caryl Matrisciana: Incredible story.
Dr. Reagan: In fact Nathan why don't you tell our viewers how they can view that program
on our website? Nathan Jones: Sure, our website has many of
the Christ in Prophecy episodes, just click multimedia and television our programs are
there including the ones with Caryl. During the week of broadcast we'll actually have
it on every page of the website just click the button and you can
watch it right on-line. Dr. Reagan: Well Nathan how about kicking
off our discussion today. Nathan Jones: Sure. We are talking about yoga
and you are an expert, can you tell us why you are an expert on yoga?
Caryl Matrisciana: Well, Nathan I was actually born and raised in India for the first 20
years of my life so I saw the practice of yoga, I wasn't
involved in it because I realized that it was
Hinduism. I mean in fact in Hindu teaching it is known that there is no yoga without
Hinduism there is no Hinduism without yoga.
Nathan Jones: Interesting. Caryl Matrisciana: The two cannot be separated;
it can not be separated into spiritual exercise because the very point of yoga which
was designed in the Bhagavad Gita which is the
Hindu writings, the Hindu holy scriptures they call it the Bhagavad Gita the actual
god the deity in there designed yoga for the individual
to connect to his god consciousness. In Hinduism they
don't believe that you are a sinner they believe that you are ignorant of your divinity
so the spark within you has to be ignited through yoga
discipline. And in fact another interesting thing is that
it is believed that there is a lying, a coiled serpent asleep in each person waiting to be
awakened through yoga disciplines. The serpent is known as wisdom, power, knowledge and if
that is brought up through the chakras which are energy psychic centers they call them,
it is metaphysics it's not true, it is not scientific,
certainly not biblical. But the snake is brought up
through self-hypnosis, through going within oneself through breathing, through waking
it up through disciplines, repetitive saying the
names of the deities again and again through repetitive
things called mantras, repetitive prayer. Through breathing pushing it up 'til eventually
it comes to the third eye, the sixth chakra and then
comes into the mind into consciousness where you
realize that your divinity and you connect. Nathan Jones: Your divinity?
Caryl Matrisciana: That you are divinity because within Hinduism it is understood that divinity
is in everything, god is in everything, everything is divine whether it is the rat on the street,
the cow in the street, the monkeys in the trees,
you. In fact before every yoga class you say, "Namaste," that means in Hindi, "the
god within me bows to the god within you," so that is all an integral part of the spiritual
discipline of yoga. And Brahman is understood to be a god consciousness, not a person. So
when you say that you become god in the Western world we see god the God of the Bible the
Creator God is a person and Jesus Christ His Son and the Holy Spirit, three persons in
one the triune God. That is not the case in Hinduism, in Hinduism it is a consciousness,
it's a force, it's a thinking that you need to connect into. So in fact you need
to alter your worldview. Dr. Reagan: Did you ever become a practitioner
of yoga? Caryl Matrisciana: Yes, I did.
Dr. Reagan: So you have experienced it first hand, not just observing it.
Caryl Matrisciana: No, as I grew up in India I observed it being practiced, but in when
I was about 19, 20 my parents returned to England. I got involved in the New Age which
I didn't realize was a religious mechanism to change our worldview into an Eastern mystical
worldview. So the New Age that I saw in the West was a completely polished, cleaned up
appealing, manipulative enticement into a different worldview.
Dr. Reagan: Did the yoga work in the sense that it really can bring you into an altered
state of consciousness? Caryl Matrisciana: Oh, absolutely, it is a
powerful spiritualism. Dr. Reagan: What's wrong with going into
an altered state of consciousness? Caryl Matrisciana: Well you first of all you
give up your mind, but you don't realize you are giving up your mind. And the first
commandment says that we need to, love the Lord our God with all our heart and our mind.
We are not allowed to put our mind into neutral within the Biblical mandate. In fact David
talks about, "that I meditate on your law day and night," the Lord tells us, "to
bind His law on our heads." So it's a mental rumination of meditating on the Word
which is quite different in the practice of yoga where you meditate on an experience so
you go into yourself and you imagine and you have subjective emotions about what you feel
and it is very, very powerful. Dr. Reagan: Wouldn't this open you up to
demon possession, or at least demonic attack?
Caryl Matrisciana: Well I didn't know at the time because I wasn't a Bible believing
Christian that what I was getting involved in was opening doorways into the occult, opening
doorways into demons. Nathan Jones: Is that what that snake is?
Is that a demonic spirit? Caryl Matrisciana: Well the snake is the master
of all demonic spirits. It was the snake in Ezekiel and Isaiah and the stories we are
told there where he says, "I will be like the most high," he acknowledges that there
is a most high. So it's a serpent. Dr. Reagan: Good point.
Caryl Matrisciana: Lucifer the snake knows there is a monotheistic God, but I will be
like the most high is that he introduces polytheism; many gods, the idea that we can all be like
gods. And why not, because in the Bible we're told that we are children of God, but and
we are also told that we are created in His image, but we are not children of God until
we come through Jesus Christ through repentance. So what this is, is it is a counterfeit way
through of experiencing, through creative manipulation which is what Satan did, he was
a liar he said, "I will be like the most High." He created in his imagination a reality
that doesn't exist. He can not be the Most High.
Dr. Reagan: Now Caryl a few years ago you went back to India and you produced a major
documentary on yoga called, "Yoga Uncoiled", is that correct?
Caryl Matrisciana: Yes. Dr. Reagan: And tell us about your experience
there in India. Caryl Matrisciana: Well the reason I went
was because Christians today are practicing yoga and it is being called Christianized
yoga. It can't, there is no such thing, it is like saying Christianized Hinduism.
It is like saying Christianized Occultism. Dr. Reagan: Yeah, I want to get into that
in a moment. I want you to tell us right now what did you do in India?
Caryl Matrisciana: Well I went to interview Yogis; those are the practitioners of yoga
to say, "Can the spiritual discipline, the spiritual connections of yoga be separated
from the physical exercises?" Because in America everybody is saying that they are
just involved in yoga which they called it: flexing, and stretching.
Dr. Reagan: Were they willing to be interviewed? Caryl Matrisciana: Oh, yes. In the movie you
see in, Yoga Uncoiled, I interview not only the Yogis in India those are the Yoga teachers
in India and actually filmed classes going on, and people that can explain what yoga
means in India. But I also then interviewed a Christian who teaches yoga, she is a pastor
in her church who teaches yoga. Dr. Reagan: Okay, this is fascinating. I tell
you want I want to do, I want to pause right now and show a clip from that documentary
called, "Yoga Uncoiled". Video: Today in the West about 35 million
Americans are into yoga, just seeing yoga as a physical fitness. Yoga is a Hindu word;
yoga is a Hindu discipline to become one with the universal consciousness; which means to
become one with god. Which god? Brahman, the Hindu god. There are many various paths to
your god, in the sacred text of Hinduism called Bhagavad Gita indicates 3 different paths
first of all. Bhakti Veda is a focus on a deity, then Gyana Yoga is a focus on wisdom,
then the Karma Yoga is based on your good deeds and actions.
You have a number of yogas, yoga is not one entity but it has a wide variety of yogas.
So each yoga has a physical aspect and a spiritual aspect. The physical aspect is controlling
the physical body. They control the breathing, they control the mind thinking activity, they
control the physical movements and the timely behavior to discipline the body in the morning,
night, how to control the bowel movements. These are all the forms of the physical part
of yoga. If you are practicing Yana Yoga or should
I say Raja Yoga the primary focus of that technique is to bring the mind to perfect
stillness, and to focus the mind in a very deliberate way on a particular sound or vibration
or image as it maybe. And in Tibetan Mahayana tradition of Buddhism that brings the mind
into a state of quiescence, peace such that revelation can occur, spiritual penetration
of a higher truth, another truth. So it is a way of manipulating the mind to generate
different experiences or insights of cognitions that are supposed to be connected to the apprehension,
spiritual apprehension of high realities. According to Hinduism the highest reality
is to become aware of one's own divinity. Hinduism respects everything as deity; the
cows on the street, the monkeys in the city, the idols which are half men half animal like
creatures. But the highest goal is realization of one's personal divinity or god consciousness.
This realization can be experienced through direct perception deep within one's own
mind, a place known as the seat of concentrated wisdom, an area between the eyebrows which
is known as the "third eye". It is also called the "sixth chakra" meaning "wheel" and recognized
as psychic energy. The other chakras are said to run along the spine starting at the bottom,
blossoming at the top, meeting at the "agna" meaning "command". Here at the agna the third
eye is the central point where all experience is gathered in total concentration and is
also believed to be the base of all creation itself.
In this hotel where I was staying each morning the local priests would come to offer the
morning puja or prayer rituals to the gods. He'd prepare "aarti" the celebration of light
through fire and mix the vermilion red mixture for "bindi" or "kumkum", the dots seen between
the eyebrows. This bindi or kumkum is believed to retain psychic energy in the human body
and control the various levels of concentration. Here the hotel manager explains that the bindi
or kumkum and aarti fire are being prepared not only for the gods but also the hotel guest
who are esteemed as gods. For our gods we place this kumkum as a tradition.
Okay, the guests are our god. Okay, the guest who are coming in here are our gods. Okay
so we keep the bindi we do the aarti and the bindi for the guests. They are like our gods.
In Hinduism they have more than 330 million gods that means that everything is god. Whatever
you see, whatever you touch is god, and the sun god, the moon god, and all everything
is god, so man and nature, man and animal are one.
Nathan Jones: Welcome back to Christ in Prophecy and our interview with Caryl Matrisciana the
producer of the video, "Yoga Uncoiled". Dr. Reagan: Caryl I want to get into our discussion
in this segment by reading you a statement that was made recently by Albert Mohler who
is the President of Southern Theological Seminary in Louisville, Kentucky. He spoke out against
the practice of yoga and he generated a storm of controversy as you know.
Caryl Matrisciana: Yeah, I can imagine. Dr. Reagan: This is very controversial. And
he said this, "The idea that the body is a vehicle for reaching consciousness with
the divine is not Christianity. Christians who practice yoga must either deny the reality
of what yoga represents or fail to see the contradictions between their Christian commitments
and their embrace of yoga." What is your response?
Caryl Matrisciana: Well their embrace of Eastern Mysticism that is exactly what it is, because
yoga was specifically designed for a purpose within Eastern Mysticism. One to awaken the
idea that we are divine and that divinity is within us and we are one with everything.
The second is to shorten our reincarnation cycle to prepare us for our reincarnation
cycle. Dr. Reagan: That is the purpose of yoga.
Caryl Matrisciana: The purpose of yoga is to teach you how to die in order that you
can come back in your next life as a better person.
Nathan Jones: It's suicide? Caryl Matrisciana: It's suicide.
Nathan Jones: Yoga is suicide? Caryl Matrisciana: It is a discipline to prepare
you for death, within the context of Hinduism which believes that your spirit that you don't
die that you come back again and again and again. In fact Gandhi said that, "reincarnation
is a hopeless cycle of imprisonment." The Hindu knows they cannot get out of reincarnation
that they are going to be born again, die again, born again, die again. So why, my question
would be to a Bible believing Christian that understands that Jesus Christ died because
we were separated from Him through our sins. He died in order to give us reconciliation
with life, for eternity. We've got reconciliation through Jesus Christ. Why practice a discipline
designed for death? Dr. Reagan: So basically what you are saying
is that the term "Christian Yoga" is an oxymoron. Caryl Matrisciana: Well like a lot of things
in the new emerging Christianity that is exactly what it is. It is Christianized occultism,
Christianized Hinduism. In fact in my movie, "Yoga Uncoiled," the Hindus are very
angry with Christians that try and steal their religion and Christianize it. And yet Christians
will say, "Well I can separate it. I can actually do, I only do the physical exercises.
But let's question that; I play tennis, I don't play Christian tennis. We do exercises
for our body and we can do gymnastics and flex and stretch that's called gymnastics.
The moment you call it yoga, yoga means "to yolk", to unite with god consciousness. Many
of the positions used within yoga are the names of the deities, those positions are
called "asanas" and those positions are a deity that you become and you merge with within
an Eastern worldview. So if they want to do stretching and flexing which I do every time
before I play tennis. I think about the muscle I am pulling, I think about the muscle I am
stretching, I think about the position I am going in order to you know to do the appropriate
stretching. I don't think of a "cobra" which is one of the positions in yoga.
Nathan Jones: Is it that third finger thing where they sit like that?
Caryl Matrisciana: You know what? You shouldn't do a "mudra" like that.
Nathan Jones: Well tell me why? Why shouldn't I do that?
Caryl Matrisciana: Because that is believed to be part of the prayer that you pull in
the vibrations, you hold your hand in a particular way and you say that word "aum" which is a vibration
of a god, because everything is god consciousness our positions, our repetitive prayers which
are called "mantras". You say the name of the deity and they believe that the vibrations,
saying "aum" connects you to the vibration that began the world. You see the basis of
yoga is evolution. And evolution is the faith of Hinduism, that everything is becoming better.
If you are a Bible believing Christian you understand that nothing is getting better.
We are on a decline we are getting worse, they are 2 opposing worldviews. Yoga is designed
to make you feel better because they believe it is encouraging the divinity within you
to realize that your god consciousness. Actually you are getting involved in a lie, its deception.
Why not just do good physical exercises, and Paul said that it profits our body a little
bit to do a little bit of physical discipline, that's fine. But then why don't we meditate
on incredible things that God has done for us, which is what it is all about, on the
promises of God. And not put your mind into a vacuum into an experience of wanting to
make yourself feel better so that you can come into the presence of God. Now when I
was a Roman Catholic we practiced the presence of God, that is when you go into a Roman Catholic
Church and the red light is burning on the altar that is to tell you that the Eucharist;
the piece of bread there has been made into the actual body of Jesus Christ. And so when
you come into the church and make the sign of the cross you are practicing the presence,
you are walking in a mystical worldview with your mind and reason telling you that that
piece of bread is actually Jesus that is going to be crucified or die again during mass,
or is being left over from mass and is up there. So in a mystical way I feel the presence
of Jesus. When I became a Bible believing Christian I had to toss that out, I had to
repent of those feelings and now rely on the promise which says that Jesus will never leave
me. It is a completely different walk of faith, versus experience experiencing through subjectivity.
Now I may not feel like I am in the presence of Jesus when I walk by faith, but Jesus said
He would never leave me. He will never leave me alone. He is my comforter. He is the lifter
of my head. He is my boardwalk. He is my sustainer. He's my sufficiency. Those are the promises
that I have to depend on in faith. Dr. Reagan: Well Christian meditation never
consists of emptying your mind to become a vacuum. It would be meditating on Scripture,
reading Scripture and thinking about Scripture. Caryl Matrisciana: And the character of God.
Dr. Reagan: Yes, absolutely. Nathan Jones: David said that quite a lot,
meditate on God's Word day and night, but not the meditation that yoga is teaching,
right. Caryl Matrisciana: Well no it is the meditation
on the character of God. How good you have been to me God. How merciful you are to me.
Thank you for dying to give me eternal life. Thank you I am a worm, I've been separated
from you by sin. Whereas in Hinduism you are not considered a worm, you are considered
divinity, divine you've got to awaken it and you mustn't have a low self-esteem of
yourself within Hinduism and Eastern Mysticism. You just have to go to India to see this doesn't
work. In India there is huge poverty, huge... Dr. Reagan: Mass starvation.
Caryl Matrisciana: ... depression. If yoga worked in India these people would be elated,
they're not! That's right.
Nathan Jones: Welcome back to our interview of Caryl Matrisciana. We have been talking
about the danger of any Christian practicing the Hindu technique of yoga. Caryl let's
close up our show. Could you show us the significant differences between Christianity and Eastern
religions? Caryl Matrisciana: Well in Eastern Mysticism
there is no such thing as sin, it's your ignorance that you are divine. See in biblical
Christianity the whole concept of having a relationship with Jesus Christ is based on
me being a sinner. But God loved me so much He didn't want me separated from Him for
all eternity, He sent His only begotten Son so that through Him my sins might be forgiven
and I can be reconciled back to Him. In Hinduism the only reconciliation if you will is because
they see death as a hopeless cycle of imprisonment, so the only reconciliation is for you to come
back better the next time round through the practice and discipline of yoga. So you can
somehow be a better sinner, I hate to say it like that, but within Biblical Christianity
we believe that your sin is a sin, you're a sinner. In Hinduism they think you can be
a better person. Nathan Jones: With what the guru being the
most holy, or the most sinless of their group? Caryl Matrisciana: Not really the guru is
a god-man. The guru has connected with his enlightenment, that he is god and he wants
all his devotees to connect to their divinity and realize that they are god because that
way they can then control their death their destiny. Well there is no such thing, we can't
control our destiny. But you see we have to come back to the serpent who is the initiator
of Hinduism. The serpent told Eve, "Surely you won't die." The Hindu's idea of
reincarnation is surely you won't die. So it is the procrastination of death that I
can come back better in my next life, in my next life. So I think that is a huge difference
there in Eastern Mysticism you are connecting to a god force. With us through Biblical Christianity
we connect, we are reconciled to God through Jesus Christ which is a personal relationship,
a person. Hinduism doesn't believe that there is any such person out there, it is
a universal god in everything, everything is divine concept.
Nathan Jones: Pull you up by your own boot-strap and save yourself basically.
Caryl Matrisciana: Yes, yes. Nathan Jones: While in Christianity we need
a Savior to save us because we can't. Caryl Matrisciana: That is the primary difference,
and that death has been concurred for us. In Hinduism it hasn't been it is on-going,
it is reincarnation. And I think another thing when Christians get involved they say, oh
I've heard lots of people say to me, "Well I only did it once and then I didn't feel
right." The reason they didn't feel right is because they opened themselves up to demonic
spirits. That must be confessed in order for a Christian to have a life relationship of
fellowship back with the Lord, go to 1 John 1:9 which says, "If we confess our sins
then He who is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sin will cleanse us of all unrighteousness."
Go to the Lord, say, "Lord, I've sinned I got involved in something that I was ignorantly
involved in. I didn't realize I was opening myself up to demonic spirits. I confess my
sin Lord Jesus." At that point you are forgiven you are back in fellowship, but if you allow
those demons to come in within Hinduism those demons become our familiar spirits, they are
familiar. We are Christians we say, "Well I didn't really sin, I didn't really do
that bad." That is a familiar, you either sinned or you didn't. You are either pregnant
or you're not, you know that's it. So we have to come back to the fact that to realize
I am a sinner, yes I tangled with the occult world, it's like well I kind of sort of
played with Ouija Boards but I didn't really do it.
Dr. Reagan: Sort of, kind of played with it. Caryl Matrisciana: You don't know you became
involved in a vehicle that takes you into a demonic world where they want to possess
you. So you have to come out as a Christian, whether you have practiced it once or for
years and years or years it doesn't matter, it's according to the Bible we have to call
evil, evil and good, good. Dr. Reagan: Caryl I hate to say it but our
time is almost up, and I want people to find out more about your ministry and I know one
way they can do that is to get on your newsletter mailing list where you discuss all these issues,
it is free of charge. How about telling our viewers how they can do that.
Caryl Matrisciana: Well they can go onto my web page, www.caryl, my name is spelled a
little differently C-A-R-Y-L-T-V.com, 7 letters, C-A-R-Y-L-T-V.com and there they can preview
many of the 60 movies we have produced. Dr. Reagan: Great.
Caryl Matrisciana: And get the book. Dr. Reagan: Well thank you Caryl and I tell
you it has been so exciting to talk with you that we are going to invite you back for a
third week and kind of shift things a little bit.
Caryl Matrisciana: Well good. Dr. Reagan: We are going to talk about the
impact of Eastern religion upon Christianity in America particularly in the apostate Emergent
Church Movement which has been heavily impacted by Hindu type thinking. And I know you are
making a major video production on that right now which is called what?
Caryl Matrisciana: Wide is the Gate.
Dr. Reagan: Wide is the Gate, and so we will have you come back next week to discuss that
with us and we look forward to that. Well folks that is our program for this week. I
hope it has been a blessing to you I am sure it has, and I hope you will be back with us
next week when Caryl Matrisciana will discuss the dangers of the Emergent Church movement.
Until then this is Dave Reagan speaking for Lamb and Lion Ministries' saying, "Look
up, be watchful for our redemption is drawing near."
Announcer: If you enjoyed today's program you will like the video "Yoga Uncoiled", a
revealing look at the growth of yoga throughout the Western world. Video journalist Caryl Matrisciana,
who was born and raised in India, returns to her native land to search for truth among
India's leading experts and examines what Christian yoga practioners in the West are saying about
their yoga participation. Once viewd by Christians as a pagan import from the East, yoga has
now become mainstream in the Church and has advertised to improve spirituality and experience
God's presence. But is yoga mysticism compatible with historic Christianity? With critical
discernment this hard hitting and informative DVD explores the ramifications of dismissing
yoga's core spirituality and blending Biblical terminology and precepts with Eastern meditative
techniques and practices. To get your copy of "Yoga Uncoiled" for a gift of $15.00 plus
shipping and handling, go to www.lamblion.com and place your order. Or if you prefer call
(800) 705-8316 and we will gladly take your order over the phone.
Announcer: Thank you for joining us on today's: "Christ in Prophecy". A presentation of "Lamb
and Lion Ministries"
A non-denominational ministry dedicated to teaching the fundamentals of Biblical Prophecy
and proclaiming the soon Return of Jesus.
End