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(Grant) Evan Emory, thanks for joining our audience here at ReelSEO.
(Evan) Yeah, no problem I’m glad to be here. (Grant) Well glad to have you here, and for
you to tell your story in your own words. So, there are some people who aren’t familiar
with your story, a lot who are. And it’s gotten some interesting national news and
national debate. So I think for the first time, we want to be able to provide a Webcam
interview where you get to tell what happened in your own words, and what’s going on with
you right now with what we like to call a YouTube debacle. And you pretty much have
done something on YouTube that has gotten quite a lot of people angry, but also quite
a bit of people supporting you. So go ahead and tell what’s happened with you in your
own words. (Evan) Well Grant, if I were to actually go
and tell this whole story, we would probably need like a 6 hour interview or a full book
or something like that to tell this whole story. But I can give you in a nutshell what
happened. I’m 21 years old and I live in Muskegon, Michigan. And I had been performing
for live audiences for a really long time. I had started out just playing acoustic gigs,
just 3 or 4 times a week to make money for college and stuff like that. And I started
progressing more and more and I’ve always had a love for like variety shows and late
night talk shows, so I started hosting my own variety shows where I would mix sketch
comedy in with music. And also with local artists. So I would bring in a ton of local
musicians, comics and artists, and have a show that was formatted that I wrote – including
lighting cues and all this other stuff – and I would write that out and it would come out
to about an hour and a half show. Well, I performed one of my variety shows
for a Valentine’s Day, one year anniversary special for a local club down in downtown
Muskegon. Now this club had a, they had a large video monitor on the back, so I thought
of the idea of incorporating as one of the sketches between a musical break, making a
comedic video. So, a couple months before, I had thought of this idea and there’s a
song that I had written years ago – and that I’m not very fond of. I think I definitely
have better material, I think the sad thing is that this song really isn’t a true representation
of my performance and stuff. But I had written this song a long time ago and I thought of,
for this video, taking this song and making it appear that this song was being – cause
the song is extremely raunchy – but it was also funny to a lot of people who heard it.
So I thought of taking the song and making it appear that I had been playing it in front
of an inappropriate audience as comedic effect. And so, initially we thought of the idea of
using like a nursing home or something like that and playing in front of a bunch of old
people, but we had kind of thrown it around and then the idea came up of if we did it
in front of a bunch of little kids – you know, them not even understanding half of
the things talking about in the song, just to see how they would react to it. And so,
to go about making the video, a local elementary school which I had attended in my town that
I had graduated from, and I had asked them for a personal project go in there and record
me playing in front of these kids. And so I went into the school that day and
I had talked to a bunch of people. I had been known there by a lot of people, and I had
recorded – I had spent 45 minutes recording myself playing completely children appropriate
songs for the kids. Doing improv about their cats or their, you know their favorite thing.
You know singing songs about monster trucks or helicopters and stuff like that. And I
had done that for 45 minutes and then after school, I had had permission to go back into
the classroom and record more footage, and so that was when I went back into the classroom
and recorded me playing this really raunchy song. And then I had went home and edited
the video together to make it appear that I had been playing this song in front of the
children for comedic effect. About a month following that was when this
whole variety show was. And so it had went really well. We had a turn out of almost 350
people there. It had went great and I had showed the video there and it got a really
good response. I mean people laughed a lot. And so, 2 days following that I had posted
that video on YouTube and it had gotten I would say 85-100 hits in the 2 days and then
I had been performing at Muskegon Community College where I had gotten my associates degree
from and soon after I had gotten done performing a secretary came up to me and she said that
she had seen my video and she thought it was really funny and I was like, “Oh thank you
very much.” And was like very surprised of how she had found out about this YouTube
video. And then she had told me that 3 police officers,
3 news teams and 4 angry parents had called the school about that video. And it had started
to set in that something was definitely wrong and she had asked the parents if they wanted
the video taken down and they explained that the damage has already been done – they
basically just want to knock my teeth in. So then I had driven from the school where
I just got done performing, to my house and at my house there was a camera team and a
cop car. And so, when I had gotten there, I had asked the police officer if I was in
any sort of trouble and he had told me that I wasn’t in trouble, I wasn’t going to
jail or anything. He had assured me of that, he was just here to protect me from a lynch
mob of parents basically coming for my head. Not thinking I had done anything wrong or,
I mean, just not even realizing the seriousness of the situation, I had done an interview
with the local news station and they had asked me about the video and about the process of
making it. They had asked me if I had planned on taking down the video and I had responded
with, “Well I had heard from a secretary that the damage has already been done, and
you know, it didn’t matter if the video came down, and that was directly from parents,
so…” So it ended up – and so then I responded,”
Well I guess the parents had said it didn’t matter if it had been taken down and the damage
has already been done, so I guess we’ll see how many views it gets on the Internet
now.” And then shortly thereafter, a few other cars had showed up in my driveway and
it was detectives and they had came with a search warrant that was looking for, I was
sitting in the car with a detective. Shortly thereafter my cell phone was confiscated and
they had presented me with a search warrant that was asking for basically child ***
things like children’s underwear and pictures of children and a few other things like that.
And so following. Following that, after I had heard about how
serious this was, the last thing I wanted was that video to be online. You know, I had
thought maybe with the news had kind of been backwards and they had been – you know if
the video, if they didn’t want the video to be promoted then by putting it on the news
they would be doing the exact opposite. But at this point I realized how serious it was
and I immediately wanted nothing more then to get that video offline and so I was completely
cooperative. I let them search my car. They went through my entire bedroom and tore apart
everything looking for any evidence of ***. And so in the process of all this, them looking
through my room, I had presented to one of the officers and asked him if I could go in
my sister’s bedroom and get on the computer and take that video down, and so they had
to make a few calls to make sure that was alright.
You know I think they were more concerned with finding child *** then getting
the video removed. So I had taken it down and by that time it had jumped up from the
85 views that were probably just my close friends to about 400 and something views.
And then I removed the video and then I was still being assured that I wasn’t going
to jail, or I had been thinking that they were going to realize that I’m not a child
pornographer and this was all going to be sorted out. But after a couple hours of searching,
then they finally came up to me and said, “Well we are going to have to take you to
jail.” So I want to jail that night and spent about 28 hours in jail. And I was arraigned
in front of a judge…probably about halfway through my night in jail after being asked
all sorts of questions about my *** preference towards children, and a few other questions
that I couldn’t believe I would ever be asked in my life. I was arraigned and I was
charged with 20 year felony and 25 years on the sex offenders list for manufacturing child
abusive material, which is basically manufacturing child ***.
And I was let out on bond for $5,000. And that’s what basically led me here. And I
just recently pleaded no-contest to a lesser felony which was a 5 year felony and which
is a way to guarantee that I will not be going to prison and I will not be on the sex offenders
list. (Grant) So Evan. Was it all around that for
your reason for your plea. Because you sound like that you apologized for what you did.
For not getting permission from the parents for video recording their kids. But you certainly
don’t think you did anything that would constitute endangerment or breaking of any
laws. So I think the question people will have is then why did you agree early on to
plea no-contest to even lesser charges? (Evan) Because there – As I am – This
whole thing has been a huge growing process for me. I feel like if I was the same person
I was a month and a half ago then this would have all been pointless but I have grown up
a ton during this whole process and I am realizing that saying sorry – it’s just words but
making amends its something way way more important than that. And I feel like I’ve turned – you
know – aside from my family, having their lives turned upside down, there’s been a
lot of people in my community that I love and care about that have been affected by
this. And I feel like making amends and taking responsibility for the fact that I did do
things wrong is more important than showing I’m sorry. So that has to do with the plea
deal. That’s the majority of the reason I took the plea deal.
And another reason is because had we fought this – and I get a lot of people saying
like why did you fight this? If the ACLU had gotten involved or something like that – but
the thing is that it was an option and we could have taken it but it doesn’t mean
there’s a guarantee that at a jury trial you are going to be found innocent. And at
this point I was so terrified of the fact that this system had charged me with a 20
year felony that the last thing I wanted to do was trust the system to bail me out of
this. I mean, there’s no guarantee that I was ever going to be found innocent. And
it’s easy looking in from the outside saying I never would have done that. I would have
fought for my free speech. I believe in the constitution just as much as anybody else
but the fact as the matter is I don’t wanna take the risk of being in prison, getting
***, as I’m waiting for the appeals court to come bail me out. I’ve been losing sleep.
I’ve gained weight. I’ve broken out so bad from all this. I don’t want a prison
hanging over – prison and a sex offenders list hanging over my head and my family’s
head for another 2 and a half years, 3 years, as long as this trial would have taken to
play out. I want – I wanna move on with my life.
(Grant) Well, you know – you mention a lot of the parents wanted you to be serving a
lot more jail time and doing a much harsher punishment that you agreed to. What are you’re
thoughts of that? Can you understand the type of emotional distress that they say they were
feeling over what you did? (Evan) I don’t know. I mean, that’s not
for me to say I guess because I haven’t personally spoken with any of them. I only
see quotes on the news and I only see what is shown on the news and 5 minute bits of
the story. So, as far as I know their things might’ve been taken out of context just as much as the media.
And, I mean I can’t even imagine what it’s like being a parent. I can’t imagine. I’m
21 years old. I never thought I was going to have kids until at least 30. And, so to
picture having this happen to one of my children, I mean, it’s – I can never put myself
in their shoes and how they would feel so that’s a really hard question to answer.
(Grant) Well, assuming that maybe one of those parents might be seeing this video at some
point, what kind of message would you have for the parents of those school children?
What would you like to say to them directly? (Evan) Well, the parents had already seen
the video and that’s why the police were contacted. Because they had already seen the
video. And so, I believe that the majority of them had seen the video. I guess the message
I would have is I never meant to cause anyone any harm. I never meant to – I could have
never imagined this would ever come out – I could never imagined that I put a YouTube
video online and 2 days later, I would be in jail, being charged with a 20 year felony.
I had no idea. To the parents, I never meant to hurt anybody. I never meant any harm by
this. I basically just wanted to make something that would make my friends and followers that
had been going to my shows and stuff like that laugh. And, that was basically the gist.
So, I am sorry to those parents who had been affected by this because I never wanted any
of this. (Grant) I guess the question people who have
been following us is why didn’t you ask for permission? Is that something you were
not aware that you need permission to get? Normally, there are popular shows that will
use kids that – like on cable television or other web shows – well they will show
inappropriate scenes with adults and kids. Those kids have parents that get waivers and
releases. They might even be members of the Screen Actors Guild. This is the case of regular
people. Were you not aware of what would be the proper way to do it?
(Evan) Yeah, I don’t think I was aware of the proper way to do it. I think I got so
caught up in the creative process of making this video and of making the show and stuff
like that, putting together this whole variety show, and the video, and all this. I think
I kind of lost track on a lot of that stuff. You know, looking back it now, it’s easy
– I’ve had tons of people I know personally with children that were like, “we would
have let you use our kids, you just had to ask. If you had asked us, we would have let
you use them.” But I mean, hindsight is always 20/20 and I think I was just so caught
up in the creative process of making this that none of that stuff ever really crossed
my mind. I never really thought about it. I thought that permission from the school
was enough. So, once I got permission from the school I kind of figured I was clear on
that. But I had no idea anything else around this.
(Grant) Well, what I’m hoping to do is like see if the situation is reversed. Say a loved
one of yours had been video recorded and used that video recording and they were deceived
and that video recording was used in the same way with somebody dubbing in a sexually suggested
video, sexually suggested lyrics. Like say it was your own mom. How would you feel about
seeing something like that? (Evan) I would probably be pretty angry to
be honest. I would be furious. I don’t want this to show through because I’m bias to
this. I think now I’m bias to this but as angry as I would be I don’t necessarily
think it constitutes 20 years in prison. (Grant) It just sounds like there are some
things that are easier to do without getting proper permissions. Is it like that because
you get to do stuff on YouTube? It’s quick. It’s fast. It isn’t really an incentive
to do slow things down. It’s like, “hey I have a video idea. Let’s get it out. It’s
quick and fun.” (Evan) Well, I think not only that but if
you watch popular television shows that use web videos like Tosh.0’s and stuff like
that, and if you look at viral videos online – I think that a lot of – I think it kind
of promotes the “candid-nance” of it and I think a lot of those videos are done without
permission and I think that’s kind of like the kind of America’s Funniest Home Videos
type thing. But they still get permission to put that online and stuff like that. My
incentive was never to make some video that got millions of views because I think had
this not happened, I still don’t even think that video would have reached 1,000 yet.
(Grant) So, why then not do a private url for friends and why make it public?
(Evan) Because I had no idea about any of that. I don’t know anything about making
private url’s or anything like that. I just posted it on YouTube just the same way I posted
any of my other videos. I guess just being ignorant to the fact that there are other
ways to go about doing that. (Grant) So, do you think with the punishment
that you’re getting and what you pleaded to, do you think that law is fair to what
you pleaded to or do you think that there needs to be something in place that serves
as a deterrent? Because there are things that make you realize that you shouldn’t have
been doing. But it doesn’t sound fair, from your sentence, that you’re having to go
to jail. That you’re having to go through this and that you’re probably expressing
that people are older and not around YouTube don’t seem to understand what you’re intentions
were or what other people’s intentions were who do this kind of stuff. Is that fair?
(Evan) that question and I think –by the national and local media, it wouldn’t have
been fair. But I think now part of the hurt that’s been caused is because of the fact
that this has been everywhere. And it’s not just national. I mean I was getting letters
from people in the U.K. and Australia and stuff like that, saying they had seen it on
the news. A cousin from the Netherlands had said that he had seen it on the news. With
it blowing up the way it has and becoming worldwide as fast as it has, I think it almost
adds to the punishment and adds to the hurt and the stress of this whole thing that I
put people through. Initially, yeah, if it was only a video that had had 85 views and
no one really knew about it then I think jail would have been pretty unfair.
But the fact that this has blown up and it’s caused more stress on the community that I
love and the people that I love. I think – I don’t know. I guess whether it’s fair
or not isn’t really for me to decide because I didn’t think – I’m just grateful that
I’ve had this change to plea to this. I couldn’t be more grateful for this plea
deal because I don’t want to be in this position any longer and I don’t wanna drag
this thing out and put my family through this. But, whether it’s fair or not, it isn’t
for me to answer. (Grant) Do you think at the same time though,
it’s taken this kind of attention to make you realize what the ramifications have been.
If this hadn’t happen, do you think you would have had that moment by yourself to
say, “Maybe I really shouldn’t be keeping this up. Okay, I’ve got 85 views and nobody
else noticed.” But what do you think? (Evan) Gosh, that’s such a hard question.
I have no idea what I would’ve thought. I definitely don’t think – I mean, in
a sense, I am grateful for this because I’ve grown up a lot as an individual and I think
this is a real test of character for me. But, that’s really hard to say whether I would
have looked back and thought that. I think there are some good things about this though.
That being that I want this moment to be teachable. I don’t want anybody, any young kids, or
any person in general, I don’t want them to go through what I’ve been through. And
so, I think there’s definitely a lesson to be learned. It’s really unfortunate that
I had to be the guinea pig in this and be the example but I really do not want anyone
else to have to go through what I went through and I want this to be teachable and I want
people to learn from this or at least make some changes so we can ensure this isn’t
going to happen again. I see on the news all the time there’s a
fight in a high school and nowadays, the first thing kids do when they see a fight in high
school is they gather around and pull their cell phones out and start recording it. And
then immediately turn around and put it on YouTube or on Facebook. And then they _______
or suspended. Or the girl in UCLA who went on Youtube and made offensive remarks about
the tsunami in Japan and stuff. And I just feel like if things don’t change it’s
going to keep reoccurring. I hope that my case is going to be teachable and that we
can ensure this isn’t going to happen to anybody else because I don’t wish this on
anybody. (Grant) Well, my last question for you Evan
is when you’re out of jail and when you’ve done your community service, what are your
plans? Maybe it’s too early to say plans on YouTube _____ But have you given thought
of will you ever do another YouTube video and if so, how are you going to go about it
differently? (Evan) Okay. This is something I haven’t
really been thinking about because I’m kinda just focused on getting through the next couple
weeks here and surviving jail and stuff. And I’ve been asked this a lot like do you think
this is going to have any boost on your career and stuff? Initially, prior to all this happening,
I had been saving school to go to college and I would really still love to go to college.
Well go back to college because I only have an Associates degree and I dreamed of eventually
getting a Masters Degree in copywriting or something like that.
I don’t think this has completely scared me away from YouTube but it’s definitely
gonna make me go about it a different way. I’ve written – I still do have YouTube
videos out there, none of which include children and so I think it’s safe to say that I will
never use kids again, that’s for sure, in a YouTube video. And yeah, I definitely will
go about this a different way. I probably will stick to a video of myself or of people
that are aware that they are being recorded and have given permission to being recorded.
It’s hard to say where I’ll be after probation and after this felony’s been dropped to
a misdemeanor. I’m just trying to be a boy scout and get myself through jail and get
myself through probation and so I don’t have the risk of going to prison for 5 years.
(Grant) Yes, well that’s the first thing ahead of you and perhaps when you’re out
and doing your community service, you’ll probably be able to give this other kind of
stuff down the road a lot more thought with your career and how you might be able to help
other people whoa re looking do something similar to you. But you’ve got the full
effect of the law and a real community around you. Is there any other things you wanted
to say to anybody or anything? (Evan) Wow. I’ve got the couch right now.
(Grant) I’m not going to ask you play your guitar behind you or sing a song.
(Evan) No, I just broke a string on that thing anyway so I can’t. I would say to anybody
out there, any young kids who are watching this or anybody in general who is planning
on making a YouTube video to be careful and know that there are laws out there, whether
you think they’re outdated or not. There are ways where you can get into huge huge
trouble over posting a video on YouTube despite your intentions. I just hope that this doesn’t
happen to other people and I just want people to think about things before they post them
online and to really take into consideration every aspect of it. Because that’s something
I didn’t do and I definitely paid the price for it.
(Grant) Well, Evan, I think people will be able to learn from you and some positive things
can hopefully come about from your own experience. Evan Emory, I’d like to thank you for doing
this interview and I’m hoping that we can check back with you as things are going along
because I think it’s important for people to pay attention to you’re not the only
one. There’s a lot more of people doing it for perhaps good intentions or just intentions
that are not meant to be negative but this is what happens and it sounds like you have
learned from it. So again, I want to thank you and hopefully we can catch up again with
you and our audience. (Evan) Yeah, thank you very much Grant. I’ve
been reading all your articles and stuff like that and hopefully, if people want to learn
more about this they can go to ReelSEO.com and read more about it and I really appreciate
everything you’ve done for me and so thank you very much and go check out reelseo.com.