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welcome back to the point i'm your host of my rocky more and i am pleased to
welcome dean baker to sandy malcolm
dean are you there be a shipping clerk i tam
well how are you reading hand-in-glove list and dina sequestering shenanigans
trails
um... inaudible the question my guess is more likely to see a very short period
of sequestration but i i think the obama administration credit with the proposes
that
william weld
some sequestration cut that people didn't really feel alone
be very angry about killed me delia should stay in the sense of
they're talking about putting our traffic controllers virtually to a lot
of flight delay his coming back security at the airport which people very very
long lines over the phone lines
and my guess is that very quickly the republicans will come to the table
and be willing to accept
for something quite different so
i think we'll probably see that will probably
trickle-down effects of the day or two
and uh... then will get uh... some
very different tactics think they do you think that the republicans will be
stared into coming to the table
you're gonna get a lot of questions
that's coming across the board of ministry for our you know people point
out the upper income people businesspeople loans there there's not
going to have to your point skills will be on people
coming and getting out of business trips on his indication they can do with from
waiting two hours of the security of air force
of using a lot of people pretty angry and given that the whole thing is really
pointless and they know that they never when does the centenarian also
so my guess
since you will get the printer cable pretty quickly
seven-year entities for the guardian uh... recently talking about and making
the case as you ledoux time ask her to do on many occasions and we actually
need to be expanding the deficit
mendes right now did you and tell and lessons learned
you know uh... this is what he thought of old
servitude builders omitted to both parties have perpetuated we've had an
ongoing deficit problem by the democrats course like that that when the bush tax
cuts because number of and i've also the wars with the gals wasn't a fan of
republicans create this image of out of control spending
the reality is that we did not have ongoing deficit deficit
leading up to the collapse in two thousand they were relatively modest two
thousand
seven was just over one percent g_d_p_ we could run a deficit that size with
early forever one could argue which have a balanced budget arguing chevy surplus
but again he was in a crisis it was something
we could have done literally for ever
uh... we got a large deficits because economy collapse
that meant big plunge in past elections
we paid out more money for programs like unemployment insurance other
programs associate with uh... with uh... supporting people lost their jobs
and of course we do have a stimulus that
too liberal erase the deficit to boost the economy now thats
that's basically over dallas two thousand nine two thousand and two
thousand won't be much paid to zero but we learned thirteen there's almost
nothing there last
uh... but we have a large deficit today again because the economy is weak and
that have become the state's strong we would have the deficits and
if we cut that deficit worse
slowing growth throwing people out of work and i just don't feel anyone the
right mind would want to do that linden we've seen from other nations that is
not sods its course of action i saw the note this week and lead
is downgrading the united kingdom's credit rating and they have to see this
austerity um... budget from temple
but because they were in the u_k_ is probably the best picture for fear
because one peter
if united kingdom has its own currency other countries you don't get a lease
greasy had no choice
they don't have their own currency advocate arkansas the big deficit
arkansas cancers you know run large deficits it you know a big if u_s_
dollars so it has to find a way to finance that u_k_ has its own currency
but they said no no no we're going to be responsible a conservative government
the won the elections in two thousand ten they decided to cut that
spend a half tax increases bring the deficit down
and what it's done is drawn the country's economy back into recession
they
every critic growth looks at the back in a recession offered third time
and it's led to because the economy contracted section of the deficits
walkers perverse effect that you know when you saw your economy
um... that because more people out of work to pay more than a point at which
put too much in taxes
and that the consequence uh... consequence no moody's is looking at
that you can see here you know your your debt situation which would that your
television a growing and that's why the downgraded ten yet austin lead in the
master of austerity has paint a solid of course of action continues
to play out here in america and we in our last action sex and we just ask the
secret is on
who talked about the role of pete peters center symbols in some sense and i
handle my size now size role these actors
do you think that
the conversation has been bought now we lost this argument
but we haven't lost than you ever lost it for the simple reason that you know
that the programs that these people want to cut social security medicare of your
medicaid aiming to be hugely popular programs across the board is not just
you know
probable liberals or democrats right
popular among c party conservatives republicans
so they have to find some better ways to do it that's why we always coming up for
the short convoluted
schemes were going to have this
super committee in an awkward down vote you know no amendments is for that
to try to find something at the democratic way to get through measures
that you know koch that you'll just have no popular support
anywhere in the political spectrum
so in terms of getting their agenda brush gary d i think that you have a
hard time but what is unfortunate if not the officers discussion of how we can
get people back to work to link that that is the real crisis images
incredible story we uphold communities are being devastated
you know families can restrict kids properly and that you know if he really
is an enormous hardship in this country not to have a job
and it's uh... you know these people were working for the economy collapsed
or were not talking about that all we're talking about is how do we get the
deficit down the notably the pure debate
where are you want to get to g_d_p_ ratio
should be in two thousand twenty
resort or grab these people go to you on this planet
so dean and you're the president now i just made in the press and the united
states he won the election her good judgment on what happens when two and
what kind of job creation program into complaints
you know we have a lot of infrastructure needs this is something we quit
should be addressing because you know that the basic story here's the private
sectors not important people so
usually you know when i had this
discussions of conservative economist another argument your polling shows
away from the private sector and there's something to that
windward near full employment if we go back to two thousand
seven employment for a half percent okay i want this huge infrastructure projects
well that rightly say was that can be a better use of the money that the private
sector on this case
the crime issue
so you know dressed in a lot of infrastructure needs building our
infrastructure for the next forty fifty sixty years frustration infrastructure
that was building the new deal
i actually talked about that at the top of that they are not you know when our
tasting of our show
this weekend last week in the week before it has been uh... dot called
third world america
and i have a friend
who travels extensively around the pacific rim and he says whenever he
comes into l_a_ acts he feels like he's flying into a terrible country the
infrastructure is so bad
and so when you make the argument in a case that you know infrastructure could
be one way of promoting growth it makes a lot of sense to me
well i think it makes out also you know people talk about education we're
cutting death we should be building up to you know it's it's not easy unit it
improved education system in the sense that you know we have a lot of people
from disadvantaged backgrounds but
you know i mean for months to come to the tune for that we know if your
parents were employed
kits at what they do real poorly in school you know that they've been
unstable households families are moving that's really bad feeling in second
grade you're in school for two months when he moved the whole neighborhood
said that they prepare for performance a lot of research on that
so on the one hand if we spend more money in the sense of having teachers
you know making sure that we had no decent class sizes with good teachers
and schools
the other hand would be people back to work
you know so that that's really too for that if we can improve the quality of
education in addition to infrastructure
um... you know this is a benefit we're gonna see long into the future union
we're facing sequestration which will have any impact on at least federal
teacher tells spending
destroyed and in his office
set of areas where we're going to be cut and
you know again uh... these jurors have already been cut to you know you're
looking at the state local government to the cutting really since two thousand
hands
and insofar as we see these uh... sequestering cuts go through
we're going to feel that even more now you know that important to realize that
three thousand thirteenths just the beginning of the halls the hope that the
story was we have a whole set of
cuts echoing effect over the course of the next decade
so whatever we're seeing this year
that's just the beginning at least
you know if we follow what
scoreless federal this can be more coming next year even more the year
after that
so where is in his late do you think that they really you have argued for a
financial transaction tax robin hood tax on every i mean and it just seems to
mean that
um... that uh... these conversations that our revenue
raising revenues on sketches seems to me that day and it is not
gaining traction and what do you think
well it is quite striking that you know you you in the washington unit purpose
serious people debate over what the washington post talks about
yediyat financial speculation takes would we never get mentioned and it's
treated like you know it
bizarre thing like we were you know crazy people out there don't wait a
second we actually came up in the united states until the mid
um... you kate has that which last time i will cause and communist
uh... you know they have the taxes
half of one percent on stock trades in the red raised equivalent rolled at
their side of the economy of thirty to forty billion a year just catching
soccer tonight action derivatives you know credit default swaps just on trade
and you know you're a state here and people look at you like how can you talk
about that do you have been doing that
you just has to answer i got no i'm glad you brought that up the process that we
have eleven countries in european union including uh... germany's
so that
spain italy substantial countries
that parent support him in the financial transaction password in the uh... woods
doesn't have everyone in the u_k_ does one have proved taxes of the nose
suppose but you have
you know the biggest countries within the yours owner all behind us
so to treat this like it's a bizarre idea that you know just crazy people
would advocate
you know i think that really speaks volumes about the nature of our politics
dainty and and and and are mostly that the world economic forum
that have been invited me
admittance inside surprise surprise if you if you look at the situation
realistically then you're left on the house i actually dean one thing that i
think that is
cynicism here recently has it
people seems to be more invested in the allusion then the reality they don't
want to hear the truth
well i think that certainly true and
you know it doesn't really make it hard to to make progress because obviously
we're going to make headway in suppose we could get people look at the reality
of say hey look we got to change things for going in the wrong direction
so this terrible american concepts i mean m in my eyes i mean we're headed
down a path if we do not change stuck on this conversation if we don't get a hold
of our
a political on policy apparatus to to ensure
by the people are made whole land that people can actually afford to survive
and thrive in this nation
that we will be heading backwards and has a minimum wage plan to that
you know if you go back in a and a confessed to having not noticed this
into literally a few weeks ago
uh... if you go back to the early postwar europe that period from by the
end of world war two talk to them it's seventies the minimum wage kept up not
just with inflation with
but with productivity growth
and the crew it was an accident there was an ideologue we wanna make sure
everyone's
shearson the gains of economic growth
name which hasn't even kept up with inflation
demand that the legislation for the bomber propose rate commemoration nine
dollars an hour and that
breaking into a gun battle increase of over three thousand dollars for the
lowest paid workers on country hard to say that the bad thing
the capacity to get us back to where we were in the wake
sixties where we were uh... you know at this point forty five years ago
where's if the minimum wage kept pace with productivity in other words that
workers
up and down the income whether
sharing the gains of economic growth the minimum wage today would be about
sixteen fifty an hour
really kind of credible thing to think about this morning
forty percent of all men get
the more than fifty percent of all women get we'd be in a very very different
countries that were the case involves a lot of ground
i recently i went into signing for a friend of mine who wrote down dot com
behind the kitchen door innocent out demand always means that people don't do
this for restaurant workers
which is actually lower than the national minimum wage and and it's been
stagnant for decades as well high and so you know they're now pushing to actually
tag the minimum wage for restaurant workers to the national minimum wage
do you have any insight on that
yet know this incredible thing again the courses that very few people have a lot
of people policy debates are aware of that there's a
separate minimum wage protected forties
and i forget whether that whenever last has been uh... increase say i think that
they expect from the mid eighties for the next week if you know i could tell
you check the weather there is a lower and that phone dammit
uh... you know the presumption is that you didn't get that made up with the
exception obviously you know if you work in the expense of restaurant and you
know people are big meals whatever that may be true but for a lot of people that
are working at your coffee shops
no you know that i'm making up to what that means is that
give a lot of people working in the restaurant sector that
of getting considerably less from the minimum wage which you know through an
incredible thing 'cause
seven point eleven hours not exactly uh... living high on the hog might
actually have the book signing had people on workers are strong workers who
testified that
negative taste as it actually says that this is not a uh...
and this is not a payment and and it's actually made it because the taxes
actually wipe away their base uh... minimum wage
and then they're just in dire dire straits forcing them to do all kinds of
things and so it's a terrible thing
when people actually work in this country and they can't make it
yeah and you know if peres
strikingly dougie you go back and near the forties and fifties
sixties because it wasn't obviously for the cause of this country i mean we were
he was very much a couple's country companies were making big profits
but yet there was weakened
senses fewer republicans that support this
true that you know that you can get a big difference you know that you got out
now on the white house in some ways sell whatever they raise the minimum wage
again
you know this is across the political spectrum this idea that everyone she
sharing the gains of prosperity
and death
that ideas just disappear that we're getting this this notion somehow
you know for paying our workers more than we're paying them and you know that
the poorest country and in latin america sub-saharan africa whatever might be
that somehow that we can't do that which is not just incredible story steam
digitally response
yes it did and you know that
though you know is that it is a real tragedies is a brilliant kids in
we're committed
and you know that
story i have
said feel bad i i didn't know almanac communique with and i are you of his
arrest of course
i had no idea of the charges he was facing do your listeners don't know he
was
he he he did downloading uh... academic articles intention was to uh... to make
them available to the public saved on motive at believe is a hundreds of
thousands if not millions of academic our government is going to make them
freely available to people that anyone could
uh... click onto them without pain
and it's a violation of the of copyright law no doubt about it he got caught and
my assumption was you know he's facing p_l_o_ suspended sentence something but
the the prosecutors federal prosecutors under the obama administration were were
charging a pressing charges that could have put 'em in jail for for decades
thirty
years i understand
uh... and if you know it with the staying over his head he he ended up
committing suicide no obviously other issues settlement savy
your portion to commit
suicide but the tapes are striking
you know i look at this i got here you have the that this young man that was
trying to make
the information
academic work available to the public
take the resources to presses charges
and then you look at the wall street banks who
passed on
tens of billions of dollars in fraudulent mortgages to enrich
themselves
and that one of them has been charged with reminds me anymore and they seem to
be going after the little guy in the morning the mortgage brokers who were
doing and saying that seems like they're willing to press charges against them
and not the players who were actually pulling the strings
he refused to be clear you know accepted people say well there was nothing with
all that well
you do you all very but the basic story here's a deferment citigroup environment
merrill lynch
and i have a po mortgages that have also
short of waiting improprieties and
things that clearly don't make sense
supplemental mortgage-backed securities selvam on forever
that's cropped
and you know can you prove that
i know
security which i think that right
someting i just wanna ask you this last question why why do you think the state
house capitalism means today and then we seem to have a super capitalism
socialism on steroids capitalism and all costs making money off costs and
the government seeming to demand that
and some of this what what is your take on where we are
will i think that uh... i think we're expendable
situation and sent
these people just are not there there's there's no one who's doing long-term
thinking go back to the forties fifties and sixties
your capitalism people make plenty of money that was
stable system
this is not a stable system that was unstable system before things blew up in
two thousand eight
it's not a stable system today and thing if these people do not want think about
that all they're doing is going to haiti profits are back to the pre recession
level stock market is back twelve was in two thousand seven
why are you bother me
so if you were president on the world
what kind of uh... will what changes would you make
well you know waiters
think long-term look we we've looked people out of poverty after world war
two and much of the developing world uh... we could repeat
moved forward i mean of once and i will look to impose
you're really great storage you've had huge with the improvement of living
standards for large onto a population of one of the ocean to praise of the
government help dictatorship plucked a bad thing to pray about it
but there have been enormous improvements and living standards beer
in many countries in latin america we could build on that route see those
countries as friends rather than enemies and
you know that the problem facing today it's really kind answer
were poor because we have a lack of to be in
we have to do is get money into pockets peoples
spend and that will make us all better off
so it's not earlier
sir that you know where so many people suffering from unemployment
simply due the fact we don't have enough demand in the world economy today
the maker always a pleasure thank you
fair manner
well that's it for another edition sit with my rossy marks
as always i like to thank my listening audience and my production team appeared
james callaghan greece webster and courtney finally i'd like to remind our
listening audience to please join us live every sunday at three p_m_ eastern
time and we had radio dot com or fourteen eighty eight and if you're in
the washington d_c_ area until next time america